[nabs-l] What is independence?

Thu Feb 27 03:53:09 UTC 2014

Hi all,

I am going to echo much of what has already been said, but
independence means a lot.

I have a few anecdotes to demonstrate my point.  I have always been an
artsy person, and much like Lillie's story my mom would always help me
shop for what I was looking for---same with clothes.  However, I was
always the person to make the final say in what I would purchase.  On
the other hand, independence for us can mean many different things to
people on the periphery of our lives.  They might overstep a bound and
not realize what they are doing, because it is well-intended.  Going
back to my mom, when I told her I had made plans to live on my own
next year, she was concerned about a number of things.  I consistently
have a class that gets out at 6:30, and some that get out at 8:00 PM,
so she was worried about the safety risks of me walking outside in the
dark by myself.  Every time I walk somewhere at night after about 9:00
PM, and choose to call her for safety reasons, I get "You shouldn't be
out on your own right now, that's a stupid risk to take."  I know
she's just being a mom, but it seems a bit like overkill when there
are hundreds of other students walking around after 9:00 PM on campus
too.

I am a firm believer in the idea that you should do what you can on
your own, and strive to find alternative ways to do the things that
you don't already know how to do.  This is why I am teaching myself to
cook, and although I've burned a few grilled cheeses and messed up
pasta because I added noodles before water because I was used to doing
that to make hard boiled eggs, these small failures are what are
helping me to learn.  However, when there is something I have no idea
how to do, or do not think I will be able to teach myself, or that
would be more practical for me to not try to teach myself, I am not
afraid or ashamed of asking for assistance from others.  It really
depends on the situation, and what "tool in your toolbox" will best
suit the need at the time as Aleeha said.

On 2/26/14, Aleeha Dudley <blindcowgirl1993 at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hey All,
>      Independence is a word that means so many different things to so
> many different people.
> The Concise Oxford definition of independence is "free from outside
> control; not subject to another's authority." So, in the simplest
> sense of the word, we might say that independence for us is being free
> from others' control and not allowing others to think, feel and do for
> us.
>      With blindness, however, independence has so many more layers.
> It's all about what one feels is independence for them at a given
> time. For example, someone might see independence as never accepting
> help from anyone, while another might see independence as seeking help
> only when it's needed.
>      For myself, I believe independence is knowing all your resources
> and utilizing the best one for that given time. For example, the use
> of a human guide might be more useful than that of a dog guide in a
> noisy, unfamiliar situation. I think it's all about knowing one's
> options, knowing how to successfully use all of them, and choosing the
> right one. I think there is also an element of knowing how to do
> something by yourself should you absolutely need to, but then picking
> the more practical solution.
> Aleeha
>
> On 2/26/14, Ashley Bramlett <bookwormahb at earthlink.net> wrote:
>> Lillie,
>> You have a mature grasp of independence. I agree you should work with
>> teachers directly, using your TVI as a backup or supplement to the
>> regular
>> instruction.
>>
>> Also, you reminded me of my father. I'm so glad to hear your dad is
>> supportive as mine was. My dad also read me computer screens that were
>> inaccessible. We never had online quizzes, oh these days of technology
>> high
>>
>> schoolers have now.
>> But, if we  did my dad would have read it if needed. Your father is simply
>> a
>>
>> reader; you are still doing the work. So keep at it. You may need a
>> reader
>> in college, so good to practice now.
>>
>> My dad also helped me edit papers. I still felt independent though as I
>> was
>>
>> the one producing the work primarily. You cannot catch some spelling
>> errors
>>
>> by reading auditorily. and, do not say spell check, because spell check
>> will
>>
>> not catch your homonyms orextra spaces in compound words because it makes
>> them two correctly spelled words with a space. For instance writing there
>> fore and therefore or for see and foresee. In this case, both pairs of
>> words
>>
>> are spelled right, but you are not compounding the words as its meant to
>> be.
>>
>>
>> I'm sure sighted students get help from parents, so no harm done there,
>> just
>>
>> as long as you are doing what you can yourself and understand your
>> homework.
>>
>> Independence to me is controlling the decisions. I could say more, but
>> have
>>
>> things to do. that is my simple definition.
>> It may involve asking for some help and that is fine as long as I control
>> the outcome of the situation. using a reader or driver or proofreader is
>> a
>> good example of this.
>>
>> Ashley
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Lillie Pennington
>> Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2014 6:56 PM
>> To: 'National Association of Blind Students mailing list'
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] What is independence?
>>
>> Hi Darian and all,
>> You pose an interesting point, and one that I had been thinking about
>> recently.
>> Personally, independence to me seems like being in control of your
>> blindness
>> and life. No, not everything is perfect necessarily, but you have a
>> balance
>> within your mind. For example, I make jewelry, and I have my mother or
>> someone sited help me shop for the different beads. I will describe what
>> I
>> want, and she will help me find what I want. I then use the beads to
>> independently make the jewelry. I am accomplishing a task independently,
>> and
>> my mother is just acting as a pair of eyes.
>> Another example. I was attempting to do an online modual for my personal
>> finance class. It had to get done, and my teacher and I knew it would
>> most
>> likely be inaccessible because it was flash based. My TVI was in theory
>> supposed to describe the pictures after the modual would talk about the
>> concept and click on any buttons if I needed to. However, this did not
>> happen as I had hoped. For example, the modual would talk about the rule
>> of
>> 72. After it had finished talking, my TVI would summarize what the modual
>> said. I attempted to politely and calmly explain that although it was
>> very
>> nice that he was giving summaries, that I did not need this
>> interpretation
>> and to please only read the question and answer choices on the screen. He
>> refused to do this and said he wanted to make sure I understand the
>> information before I selected the answer. He did this for every screen.
>> This
>> at least doubled the time I needed to spend on this module.
>> An example of how this works well. I have homework options in my Spanish
>> class and the easiest one that I see is an online site where it is a
>> matching game between Spanish and English vocabulary. My dad will read
>> the
>> Spanish words on the screen and I will tell him which English equivalent
>> to
>> match them with. He is not helping me in any way with the assignment.
>> While I readily admit that I am not most likely completely independent, I
>> think I have gone a long way towards embracing this philosophy. Our
>> society,
>> even for sited people relies on relying on others. Blind people should
>> have
>> this prevelige as well.. Independence is knowing the easiest way for you
>> to
>> do something, and knowing when to ask for help while still challenging
>> yourself.
>> This brings up another topic as well, asking for help. There was a
>> discussion on this list yesterday about TVI help in a math class. My
>> reply
>> was that that perhaps the TVI was teaching the student to help herself.
>> What
>> I meant was a general use of problem solving skills. In my school when I
>> was
>> little, sited students, including me in the general classroom, were
>> taught
>> to use problem solving situations to figure out problems. Basically, not
>> to
>> just shy away from a problem but to attempt to figure out how to solve
>> it.
>> For example, lets say that I am working on algebraic math homework such
>> as
>> factoring where there are many different types. Lets say that although
>> the
>> homework focuses on general trinomial factoring, there is a problem about
>> difference of squares factoring. And lets say that in the notes or book
>> there is an example of this type of factoring, or that there is an answer
>> to
>> the problem in the back of the book. I would simply look at the example
>> and/or the answer to attempt to figure it out, or maybe google it. If I
>> could not understand the what was given to me, or if there was nothing of
>> the sort, then I would ask my teacher or another classmate.
>> I believe this is not a problem of refusing to asking for help. In a
>> conversation about an English paper a few weeks ago, my TVI told me that
>> he
>> knew about the assignment and could help with it. He then said that he
>> spoke
>> to my teacher and told her that any questions about the assignment I
>> could
>> just ask him, and told me that I had problems in refusing help (I don't
>> think that's the case.) Fortunately for me, I have a good relationship
>> with
>> that teacher and my dads a magazine editor, so I had a built in editor in
>> my
>> house. He'd also been suspicious that a previous essay I had written was
>> not
>> necessarily my work, so I didn't want to go down that route. I thanked
>> him
>> for his offer and said I would consider it, and that I planned to deal a
>> lot
>> with my teacher in this, but thanks anyway. I ignored the comment about
>> the
>> helping.
>> I am working with a student currently who is going to enter high school
>> in
>> the fall. I was asked to prepare a list of tips for entering high school.
>> I
>> plan to include tips such as working directly with teachers, so hopefully
>> I
>> can extend this branch of thought somewhat.
>>
>> All in all I am trying to say that if the task is done mostly by you, and
>> that if it is something that at the end you can feel proud of that you
>> have
>> truly done it, then that is probably a true sign of independence. If I am
>> making a bracelet and I ask someone how the color choices of the beads
>> look
>> next to each other, I am still doing the work, I am just getting a
>> perspective on the placement of a factor that I cannot see, and it is a
>> piece of work that I can be truly proud to wear.
>>
>> Thank you to anyone who has read this.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Darian Smith
>> Sent: Wednesday, February 26, 2014 5:08 PM
>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>> Subject: [nabs-l] What is independence?
>>
>> Hi all,
>>
>>   It seems to me that a word  that  we use a lot  in the Federation is
>> independence.
>>   Obviously, we go about it differently which would suggest  differing
>> definitions for each individual. As you read this message, I wonder what
>> the
>> word independence means to you?
>>   Best,
>>   Darian
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-- 
Kaiti