[nabs-l] review of social skills in training centers

Wed Sep 28 17:15:26 UTC 2016

Good morning, Beth,

So narrow, so limiting, how can someone anticipate the warants of 
every single situation?
CarAt 08:42 PM 8/14/2014, Beth Taurasi via nabs-l wrote:
>Talking bad is a combination of things, in my opinion.  Bashing, use 
>of bad language/words such as, dare I say it, the F word, the N 
>word, etc., and talking rebeliously to people if you are under 
>eighteen.  That's talking bad.
>Beth
>
>----- Original Message -----
>From: Arielle Silverman via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>To: Elizabeth Mohnke <lizmohnke at hotmail.com>, National Association 
>of Blind Students mailing list <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>Date sent: Thu, 14 Aug 2014 15:24:01 -0700
>Subject: Re: [nabs-l] review of social skills in training centers
>
>I may regret this but I feel the desire to ask: What does "talking
>bad" entail? Using bad grammar? Sounding uneducated?
>I worry that in these kinds of discussions we are conflating "social
>skills" with value judgments about how educated or decent people
>should behave. It is not really the place of a training center for
>adults to make these kinds of value judgments.
>
>Further, cigarette smoking, drinking and consensual sex are all legal,
>allowable activities for adults to engage in. They can lead to harm
>but only if they are not done responsibly. I don't think it is
>appropriate for a training center for adults to deny students these
>basic freedoms or try to babysit students, but they should do whatever
>they can to ensure that such freedoms don't cause harm to others. From
>what I've seen I think the NFB centers are pretty good at walking that
>line. But there might be occasional times when a harm occurs or
>something gets out of hand despite the center staff's efforts to
>enforce rules of conduct. The same risk applies at a college or any
>other place where adults freely reside. If that happens, I hope the
>individuals involved discuss their concerns with the center and that
>the center responds appropriately.
>
>Arielle
>
>On 8/14/14, Elizabeth Mohnke via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>Hello Antonio and all,
>
>Given the fact that we are currently discussing what is and is not
>appropriate for this email list, I believe it would be best for us not to
>discuss this topic on the email list. I can see this topic getting out of
>hand rather easily as well as offending people easily by reporting
>inaccurate myths and facts about rape and sexual assault. While I believe
>it
>is important for people to understand the real facts about rape and sexual
>assault, I do not believe this discussion should take place on this email
>list.
>
>Warm regards,
>Elizabeth
>
>-----Original Message-----
>From: nabs-l [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Antonio
>Guimaraes via nabs-l
>Sent: Thursday, August 14, 2014 11:28 AM
>To: Carly Mihalakis; National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>Subject: Re: [nabs-l] review of social skills in training centers
>
>Carly,
>
>I am not a woman, so the following comment may be taken with a grain of
>salt.
>
>I have not read any studies, but I do not believe most, let's say over 50
>percent of women, are raped.
>
>To say that most women are raped may be overstating the fact a bit.
>
>You also say that in your opinion it is better that rape happens "within a
>more or less controlled environment where some support is available."
>
>Many cases of rape go unreported because the victim feels nothing will be
>done, or that se will be retaliated against.
>
>Rape happens in colleges and universities, which qualify as very controlled
>environments, but most media accounts of rape cases at universities I hear
>tell a story different from a place of support to rape victims.
>
>There is no easy answer to treating rape epidemic.
>
>However, I am not positive any organization, including a training center,
>wants to acknowledge and address rape in a satisfactory way. That stuff is
>often best left alone, and swept under the rug from the perspective of the
>service provider, be it a training center, or a university.
>
>I question whether any organization adequately supports rape victims for
>these reasons.
>
>As for rape victims, I believe it is important to find the appropriate
>authorities and procedures to report these incidents.
>
>Education about what is rape, and how to avoid it should also go a long way
>to prevent it in the first place.
>
>Antonio
>
>
>On Aug 13, 2014, at 8:33 AM, Carly Mihalakis via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>wrote:
>
>Good morning, Don't forget, rape happens everywhere, to most women, at
>camp, at college, at frat parties. And yes, at centers, too. And, it is my
>opinion that it's better that it happens within a more or less controlled
>environment where some support is available, than after leaving the center
>where, one must fend for herself. And no, sharing general ideas,
>particularly about matters considdered taboo, has a place. If information
>someone appreciates, happening to come from a listserv such as this, helps
>one person, it is fulfilling an envaluable function.
>
>wrote:
>I'm not exactly sure how to say this delicately, so please understand
>that I'm not trying to be offensive here.
>I find the statement that you made, that social skills must be taught
>at centers because there is too much drama on Skype, to be wanting in
>many ways.
>First of all, I agree with what Arielle said. A class about social
>skills could very easily backfire. I don't even think the model of
>structured discovery would be able to rein in individual
>personalities on this subject, nor should it. Each person, to an
>extent, is free to behave how they see fit, as long as they're not
>causing harm to others. I believe that forcing people to go through
>training in social skills would quickly and effectively single out
>those who were maybe more inept, and just lead to ridicule by the
>other participants rather than actually helping them to see things
>differently. Furthermore, no one wants to be told how to act. As long
>as we know the basics, and I suspect that most of us do, we'll be fine
>in
>most settings.
>Now, about the actual suggestion that social skills training will
>eliminate drama on Skype, I'm sorry, but that is ridiculous. I would
>suggest that, rather than focusing on browbeating people into making
>changes that they might not even find to be necessary, you should
>distance yourself from those who are giving you problems. It's just
>skype, after all. Blocking an annoying or offensive person is
>literally a click or keystroke away.
>
>Finally, if someone did truly get raped at one of the NFB's training
>centers, that is horrible and should be dealt with. But I think it's
>in poor taste to bring it up on a public mailing list. Even though
>you didn't mention the person's name, how do you think that person
>would feel if she knew you had paraded her story around without asking
>her?
>Even if she did give you permission to talk about it, I still would
>think that there are better venues for getting her story out there.
>Starting with the center itself, obviously. But there's so much that
>we don't know that any more speculation on my part would be
>unnecessary.
>I do agree, however, that it might be a good idea to add self-defense
>training to the curriculum of NFB training centers. I believe that
>too many blind people perceive themselves to be more defenseless than
>their sighted counterparts. And, sadly, there are probably a lot of
>criminals out there who would mug or attack a disabled person just
>because they think that person is helpless. I also believe strongly
>that learning how to defend oneself is a pretty good way to become
>confident. If it were me, I'd feel that way. As someone who does
>struggle with this very thing sometimes, the fact that I'm not only
>blind, but female, and not very physically imposing, either, gets to
>me sometimes. It makes me a little less confident in city
>environments. Then again, this could also be because I was raised in
>a rural area, so I have a natural wariness toward that kind of thing.
>But I do think, either way, it has a place in a confidence-building
>curriculum. Everyone feels better about themselves if they feel like
>they know what to do in a situation where they're being victimized.
>
>On 8/9/14, Beth Taurasi via nabs-l <nabs-l at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>Dear RJ and all,
>While I'm in agreement with the independent living skills portion
>of training at the Center, I was STILL forced into a sighted group
>of socially inept people who mostly do not discuss blindness.
>It
>is absolutely horrific that any voc rehab would do this and think
>that my primary disability is NOT blindness, but mental illness
>instead.  Well, that mental illness was caused because I was blind.
>If I hadn't been blind, I would not have any problems because of
>the society and the sighted world's view of blindness as a darker
>form of living.  Social skills also must be taught because, if you
>look at it this way, there is too much drama on Skype.  RJ is
>right, but let's face this: social skills are not being taught
>properly at any of the Centers.  I've heard of people at both CCB
>and LCB not bathing, smoking, and doing things that are otherwise
>not allowed.  I've heard numerous complaints from various people
>that say that the Center students smell bad, look bad, talk badly,
>and so on.  There was a girl who was unable to keep her body safe,
>and so she is now expecting a little baby because someone raped
>her.  Should training centers even teach social skills and
>self-defense?  We do martial arts traiing, but that should be
>taught outside and earlier.  Because of this and because of other
>sorts of bullying cases I've seen on Skype, I'd like to do a study
>of social skills and actually share my experiences with the rest of
>the NFB members and nonmembers about what works and what doesn't.
>Thanks.
>Beth
>
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>--
>Desiree
>
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