[nagdu] owner training was hi

Wed Feb 4 05:06:14 UTC 2009

Hello!

I've never trained my own guide dog. But there's one thing I've wondered
about. Two of my eight dogs didn't work out as guide dogs, and another of
them decided that guide dog work wasn't right for him after two and a half
years of work. The process of making the decision to "retire" the dog as a
guide (in this case, with the input from the school) is difficult. At one
level you are already attached to the dog which mmakes it difficult to
decide to part with it. However, as one director of training told me many
years ago, with respect to a guide dog love has nothing to do with it. the
main questions are do you trust the dog and are you safe? The other side of
this is that your attachment and the effort which is put into developing a
working relationship with the dog, makes you prone to ignoring the signs
that things aren't going well. Once you can accept this, you oftenn tend to
start blaming yourself. "What have I done wrong to lead this dog astray?" It
would seem to be that if you are training your own dog from scratch, you
have even more invested in the process and relationship. Does this then make
it difficult to recognize after 18 months into the training, for example,
to recognize that either this dog will not make a good guide or you and the
dog are not a good match? 

I'm not trying to say that people shouldn't traing their own dogs. What I'm
trying to say is that many things have to be considered before embarking on
this endeavor. 

Toni whaley
-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
Of Tracy Carcione
Sent: Tuesday, February 03, 2009 8:36 AM
To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
Subject: Re: [nagdu] owner training was hi

I want to add something to Julie's caveats on owner training, the biggy
for me.  Even after one has picked a dog, it can turn out that the dog is
not suited to be a guide.  It may find the work too stressful, or not fun,
once it gets hard.  The same thing happens with school-trained dogs, but a
fair number of the unsuitable dogs have been dropped out by the time they
get to the student.  It's not me that's spent months working with a lovely
dog, only to figure out that it will be happier as a pet.
Of course, dogs can still quit after they've started their real work as
guides, but if they've made it through the first few months of training, I
think one has a better chance that the dog will go on with it.
Hope this makes sense; I'm not sure I've said it very well.
Tracy

> Yes and yes.
>
> Please refer to the messages from Mardi recently.  she is in the process
> of
> finding a dog to train.  Not every dog is going to make a good guide dog
> candidate.  sometimes you have to evaluate quite a few before the right
> one
> comes along.  There are transportation expenses, veterinary in depth
> evaluations for each dog you decide to train, equipment, incidental
> training
> costs etc.  It adds up.  I probably looked at 30 dogs before settling on
> my
> final choice this last time.  I spent almost $500 just to go look at dogs.
>
> The training time varies depending on the readiness of the dog and the
> abilities of the handler.  At a minimum you can expect to be training
> daily
> for four months.  I start with younger dogs that need more basic obedience
> and they take longer.  If you start with a puppy it could take two years.
> Whatever age dog you start with you can expect to spend a minimum of 30
> minutes training every day.  In addition to that time you will also need
> to
> spend time exercising the dog, grooming and providing basic care.
>
> Obviously when you begin this process the dog is not a guide dog. It
> cannot
> go everywhere you go.  If you work or have other obligations arrangements
> will have to be made for the care of the dog, until it's training is
> adequate to accompany you.
>
> Anyhow, that is the very short version of time and money and owner
> training.
> I'm happy to talk more about it if you have more questions.
> Julie
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "kl" <FuzzyPurpleCouch at neo.rr.com>
> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'"
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Monday, February 02, 2009 7:18 PM
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] hi
>
>
>> Does it take a lot of time. Doe it cost a lot. I would love to talk to
>> you
>> about it.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>> Behalf
>> Of Julie J.
>> Sent: Friday, January 30, 2009 7:32 AM
>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] hi
>>
>> It's Tami that has the owner trained poodle in Oregon.
>>
>> Are you interested in owner training?  There are several people on this
>> list
>>
>> who have owner trained our guide dogs, including me. I'd be happy to
>> talk
>> to
>>
>> you about it.  Or you can search the list archives.  There's quite a bit
>> of
>> info there.
>>
>> Julie
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "kl" <FuzzyPurpleCouch at neo.rr.com>
>> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Thursday, January 29, 2009 8:13 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] hi
>>
>>
>>> The person who has the owner trained poodle and who lives in orgon.
>>> Will
>>> you
>>> e/mail me off list.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>> Behalf
>>> Of Tamara Smith-Kinney
>>> Sent: Thursday, January 29, 2009 5:06 PM
>>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] hi
>>>
>>> Kl,
>>>
>>> Hi, and welcome!  I live in Oregon and am working with my owner-trained
>>> poodle guide Mitzi.  Or learning to work with her, to be more accurate.
>>> Our
>>> team building progress has been spotty due to life stuff, so I'm still
>>> a
>>> complete dunce quite a bit of the time.  Sigh.  I was worried there for
>>> awhile that the disruption in our work and in my progress as a guide
>>> dog
>>> user would ruin her and waste all the time and effort we both put in so
>>> that
>>> she would be ready to put up with my bumbling efforts to change roles,
>>> but
>>> she's doing quite well.  Whew!
>>>
>>> Anyway, sorry to hear about your voc rehab problems.  I've been there,
>>> too,
>>> only I had to live in their housing across the state from where I lived
>>> at
>>> the time to get some living skills training....  So that was where I
>>> discovered how incredibly awful people who work with the blind (the
>>> help
>>> us,
>>> of course!) can be.  I hope you are able to get what you need for your
>>> vocation even though you don't have case with your state's agency.
>>>
>>> Tami Smith-Kinney
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>> Behalf
>>> Of kl
>>> Sent: Wednesday, January 28, 2009 9:47 AM
>>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] hi
>>>
>>> Hi I am in ohio. I have had some problems with my rehab counselor. I
>>> no
>>> longer have a case open with thim.
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>> Behalf
>>> Of Ron Davidson
>>> Sent: Tuesday, January 27, 2009 6:21 PM
>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] hi
>>>
>>> Julie is right every state has rehabilitation services that include O&M
>>> training. If you are considering a dog most schools require you have
>>> mastered your O&M skills and can travel safely by cane before
>>> proceeding
>>> to
>>> get a guide dog. You will always from time to time use your cane and
>>> some
>>> of
>>>
>>> the cane skills coincide with dog handling skills and techniques. What
>>> state
>>>
>>> are you from?
>>>
>>>
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