[nagdu] contact with puppy raisers/walkers

Mon Dec 20 20:39:56 UTC 2010

You know, part of me agrees with Peter. 
I've had two dogs, both of whom I suspected had health conditions. My first one shed like there was no tomorrow. I could have spent my life brushing her and she'd still shed. 
My second one would at times breathe very rapidly. She had virtually no stamina. I observed the breathing and lack of stamina from day one but she was a labs and I was under the impression rightly or wrongly that "labs are different from shepherds". When I would try to mention this to anybody from the school, the answer was "This is a different dog, you can't expect them to perform the same". 
This attitude combined with the "guide dogs are in perfect health" mindset and you're in for a real mind f***. 
I think had I had the ability to talk with someone who spent as much time with the dogs as I eventually did, I'd have been able to find a resolution or at least know I wasn't nuts. I can't say which would have been more useful. 
The thing that annoys me is that I don't know how I'd resolve a future situation. You know when something isn't right, but how do you quantify something like occational intense rapid breathing that seems to have no cause. How do you quantify sheding. 
I got to the point where the phrase "You need to brush that dog" still gets me angry. 
I have the same reaction when I hear "Labs are different from shepherds, they tend not to be able to work as hard". 
When I've talked about the retirement of my second dog with friends and family, I have been surprised by the number of people who said "I'm surprised you waited so long" only to think Why didn't you say something to me sooner, if only to validate that what I'm observing isn't just me." 
Add in the emotions that I loved both dogs, combined with the wanting to be "successful" i.e. using the dog for x amount of time, and it is a screwed up mental state to be in. 
Being a parent is a lot easier. I don't depend on my kid for my safety, other people spend chunks of time with my kid, and people speak up when they have something to say. I can then choose to do what I wish with the feedback.  I only wish I'd had similar feedback and similar oppertunities to talk things out with my dogs. I felt that with my dogs, the problem was all mine to solve, yet I wasn't absolutely sure there was a problem, nor did I have a starting point on how to address it. It's a very unpleasant place to be in. 

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Peter Donahue
Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 11:16 AM
To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
Subject: Re: [nagdu] contact with puppy raisers/walkers

Hello Ginger and everyone,

    Hmmmm! I was never asked to fill out any consumer satisfaction survey. 
Perhaps what you meant to say is that graduates whom you knew would give you 
the views you wanted were asked to fill out this survey. I experienced the 
same behavior with GDB. NAC and other agencies for the blind have also given 
us this same horsepuckey. From having met Ogden's raiser and her family I 
know that learning something about his past helped us become a great team. 
Had I been able to dig in to Tim's background perhaps some of the problems I 
had with him could have been avoided.

    All this dribble about charity and such isn't an issue with me. If I 
wish to show gratitude fore something done for me I do it. Otherwise if I 
feel that someone's actions over-step the bounds of such I feel it my 
responsibility to address it appropriately. We in the federation work hard 
to teach blind persons how to interact with the public to teach them when 
assistance and such are appropriate and when they are not. Policies like 
this do nothing to instill this in graduates. As long as the choice to 
communicate or not to communicate directly with puppy raisers is respected 
that's where it should begin and end. I really get tired of the same old 
garbage that "It's not as simple as you think." Se is not the only agency 
for the blind that has given us that line of junk. Se graduates may have one 
view. The organized blind has another and will act in time.

Peter Donahue

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Ginger Kutsch" <gingerKutsch at yahoo.com>
To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Friday, December 17, 2010 8:07 AM
Subject: Re: [nagdu] contact with puppy raisers/walkers

All,

There is a question about The Seeing Eye's policy regarding
raiser contact on the consumer satisfaction survey that graduates
are invited to participate in after they have been home with
their dogs for nine months. When I worked on the consumer
satisfaction committee, the majority of respondents,
approximately 80%, were satisfied with the current puppy raiser
contact policy.

As a graduate of The Seeing Eye, I have no strong feeling one way
or another about puppy raiser contact. I've written a thank you
note to my puppy raisers for each of my three dogs and have never
received a response. Whether I am able to have direct
communication with my puppy raiser or not has no bearing on my
dog's ability to guide me safely and effectively. Therefore, it
is not part of my decision making process when I consider a
school.

There are, however,  several graduates who attend The Seeing Eye
because there is *no contact. Whether we are all "adults" or not,
people are generally brought up to feel obligated in some way to
those people who offer us assistance, give us gifts, etc. How
many times have you done something simply because you feel
obligated?

The fact is that, whether we call ourselves "consumers" or not,
when we attend a guide dog school and receive a dog, we are
accepting charity. Those people who raise puppies for a guide dog
school are performing a charitable act. If you consider the
definition of charity for a moment, it may give you more insight
on the philosophy of The Seeing Eye. Charity is defined as 1),
generous actions or donations to aid the poor, ill, or helpless;
And 2), something given to a person or persons in need.

Early on, The Seeing Eye created policies that supported its
belief that blind people deserved respect and dignity. Now I know
there are some on this list that dislike the word dignity, but
when applied correctly, one realizes that The Seeing Eye's tag
line  is not saying that dogs provide independence and dignity;
but rather  it's saying that the organization firmly believes
that independence and dignity is a right that everyone deserves.

That said, many of the policies that The Seeing Eye upholds
support this belief.

1. There is a charge for the dog. Seeing Eye does not advertise
that a blind person can come get a dog for free. This smacks of
"charity".  The fee hardly covers the true cost of the dog and
may only be symbolic, but it enables the organization to promote
its belief that blind people are not looking for a hand-out but
rather a hand-up.

2. The Seeing Eye does not accept funding, or ask its graduates
to seek funding, for any one individual's  specific training
needs. I think Buddy's post adequately explained the reason for
this policy.

3. The Seeing Eye does not facilitate puppy raiser contact. This
policy is in keeping with the organization's belief that blind
people who receive a dog from The Seeing Eye are not charity
cases but rather individuals who are looking to enhance their
lives. This policy switches the focus of puppy raising from
raising a dog for any one blind individual to raising the dog for
an organization that provides dogs for the blind. This makes the
organization obligated to the puppy raisers, rather than placing
that burden on the individual blind person.

Years ago when graduates expressed a desire to be able to
personally thank their puppy raisers if they so chose, The Seeing
Eye responded and created a system so that graduates might do so
while still preserving anonymity. Since the majority of Seeing
Eye graduates are satisfied with the current policy on puppy
raiser contact, it's highly unlikely that the organization will
seek to change it at this point.

Anyway, I'm not speaking on behalf of the organization, just
offering my two cents for what its worth!

Ginger,

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