[nagdu] researching programs

Sun Feb 14 10:30:34 UTC 2010

Mark,
    Though it "should" be that the schools not interfere with you, there are 
some schools who have been known to take (or attempt to take) dogs away 
without evidence of abuse or neglect. I know of cases in which a school has 
threatened to take a dog away because they asserted it was overweight when 
the dog's vet said it was not. The same school took the harnesses away from 
two graduates because people who did not like the graduates said they were 
abusing the dogs, even though an investigation by animal services concluded 
the dogs were not being abused or neglected. I am of the opinion that 
schools that do not grant ownership upon graduation, as a matter of policy, 
have an underlying belief in the lack of the capacity of blind people to 
care for their dogs.

Fraternally yours,
Marion Gwizdala


----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mark J. Cadigan" <kramc11 at gmail.com>
To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, February 13, 2010 4:09 PM
Subject: Re: [nagdu] researching programs


> So, from what I understand, owning the dog is nice, but not essential. 
> From what you are saying, it appears that if the school owns the dog there 
> should be no problems so long as I treat the dog properly. Correct me if I 
> am wrong.
>
> What schools let you own the dog either immediately after graduation, or 
> after a trial period.
>
> I don't know why someone would ever mistreat an animal, but that is off 
> topic.
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Jenine Stanley" <jeninems at wowway.com>
> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'" 
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, February 13, 2010 1:49 PM
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] researching programs
>
>
>> Mark,
>>
>> I have my own personal feelings about ownership but for purposes of this
>> discussion, I'll give you the technical answer to the difference between
>> ownership and custody, or whatever term the particular school uses that
>> means they have legal ownership of the dog. Others here will more 
>> eloquently
>> give the philosophical perspective.
>>
>> When you legally own your dog, you literally own it. The school cannot 
>> take
>> your dog away without a third party being involved, and usually without 
>> some
>> type of legal action against you.
>>
>> Let me preface that by saying for most school staff the last thing we 
>> want
>> to do is to take a dog away from someone. We want to help make the team 
>> as
>> good as it can be.
>>
>> Now, let's say the rare, and it is extremely rare, instance occurs when 
>> we
>> misjudge someone's ability to handle the responsibility of a dog. The 
>> person
>> might be fine initially but life may change and for this example, let's 
>> say
>> he or she is seen physically abusing the dog. There is also evidence,
>> through the dog's medical condition, that it is being neglected. People 
>> in
>> the community have called the school to report this person.
>>
>> The first thing any school should do, and again, most do this, is to 
>> contact
>> the handler directly and discuss the complaints, offering help. We all 
>> know
>> that sometimes things can be misinterpreted.
>>
>> Let's say this "worst case scenario" continues and the handler in 
>> question
>> refuses the school's help. Complaints continue and the dog's condition
>> worsens or doesn't improve.
>>
>> Most local animal cruelty statutes don't include the kinds of things we
>> would think of as cruelty toward a guide dog. They involve excessive 
>> times
>> without food, water, shelter, or witnessed beating, open wounds,
>> malnutrition, etc. Also, many animal control officers don't want to get
>> involved with service animals because they fear being sued for civil 
>> rights
>> violations.
>>
>> Yes, I know, there are other animal control officers with the very 
>> opposite
>> point of view and actions, overreacting to a standard leash correction. 
>> I've
>> actually talked to both types in the same department, sadly in the same 
>> day
>> once.
>>
>> So, what are all of us who are worried about the welfare of this dog to 
>> do?
>> Well, if the handler legally owns the dog, all we can do is to go through
>> the legal processes of his or her community, city, county, etc., to take 
>> the
>> dog away. This could mean anything from petitioning a court to getting a 
>> vet
>> to testify about the dog's condition. It all depends on the local laws.
>>
>> Now, on the bright side of ownership, the bright technical side that is, 
>> if
>> you are ever involved in an accident, struck by  a car, etc. owning the 
>> dog
>> means that you are legally entitled to ask for any number of things in a
>> settlement that you may not have gotten if you didn't legally own the 
>> dog.
>> There have been cases, and I wish I still had the citations, in which a
>> judge stated that because the school owned the dog, only it could come
>> forward to collect reimbursement of vet expenses, etc.
>>
>> This issue is less important now than it was even 10 years ago thanks to
>> many states passing guide dog protection laws that specify people be
>> reimbursed regardless of who legally owns the dog.
>>
>> The truly positive technical part of ownership is that you are the final
>> arbitrator of all decisions regarding your dog, from where it goes when 
>> it
>> retires to its medical care, etc.
>>
>> If the school retains custody of the dog for whatever reason or under
>> whatever conditions, then in most cases, it can reclaim the dog without a
>> third party being involved. Again, for most schools this is an absolute 
>> last
>> resort.
>>
>> If you want ownership because you are worried that a school will take 
>> your
>> dog, you may want to consider another school. Ownership is a trust issue.
>> Granting it is the school's way of saying that they trust you and your
>> abilities to care for and work this dog.
>>
>> Hope that helps. It in no way means that those who choose schools that 
>> don't
>> grant any form of ownership have made poor choices or are less valued by
>> their schools.
>> Jenine Stanley
>> jeninems at wowway.com
>>
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>
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