[nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
Lyn Gwizdak
linda.gwizdak at cox.net
Fri Apr 22 21:51:17 UTC 2011
Hey Tami, you'll have to visit us in San Diego so Mitzi can meet Landon and
Bernie!
Lyn and Landon
----- Original Message -----
From: "Lisa Irving" <lirving1234 at cox.net>
To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2011 3:03 PM
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
> Tami,
>
> Bernie is part lab and Goldie. He may be stubborn, but I'm the "parent".
>
> Lisa and Bernie
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Tamara Smith-Kinney" <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'"
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Thursday, April 21, 2011 2:17 PM
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
>
>
>> Lisa,
>>
>> Who are you and how did you manage to get a black poodle down to San
>> Diego
>> disguised as a golden retriever named Bernie? /lol/ Same deal with her.
>> Love the strong-willed stubborness when she's guiding me. Have learned
>> to
>> accept the accommodations I end up making with her to get around it
>> everywhere else. Who's the boss around here? Mitzi's the boss! Who
>> else
>> do you think it would be? Teehee.
>>
>> Tami Smith-Kinney
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>> Behalf
>> Of Lisa Irving
>> Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2011 9:35 PM
>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
>>
>> Hi Traci and Rebecca,
>>
>> This is the "Yin and the Yang" for my darling, Bernie. I love that he is
>> overall pretty laid back. The other side; not the reverse side, is that
>> Bernie is stubborn. If I were to go back into Mommy mode, I'd be asking
>> myself, how can I make this stubborn streak; strong willed, a plus for
>> both
>> of us? That's how I, if you will, parent Bernie. I want him to be strong
>> willed when we're walking. I trust him; most of the time. In the morning,
>> Bernie generally wants to get up when he feels like getting up. I know
>> this
>> and I accept it. I make this work by talking to him, scratching him all
>> over
>>
>> and gently tugging on a paw. No problem, he get's up. We go through a
>> similar dance in the evening when I take him out for his last "park
>> time".
>>
>> Lisa and Bernie
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Tracy Carcione" <carcione at access.net>
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2011 6:21 AM
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
>>
>>
>>> Hi Rebecca.
>>> Very well put.
>>> I'm doing just that with Ben. I have a whole list of things I like, and
>>> things that could be better. Trouble is, some of the dislikes are the
>>> flip side of what I like. For example, I wish he'd take my corrections
>>> more seriously, but I love that he will stand up to me when I'm wrong.
>>> Yin and yang. The yin/yang symbol has a light and a dark side, but each
>>> side has a bit of the other in it. So it is.
>>> Tracy
>>>
>>>> Britney,
>>>> I'd suggest you treat this as a lessons learned event.
>>>> Write down what you like about your dog and what you don't like. Then
>>>> hang
>>>> onto it and think about it a bit later.
>>>> Your experiences and impressions are valid and you should not discount
>>>> them. You got a dog to do a job for you. The school needs to know what
>>>> worked and what didn't. Every business does.
>>>> If we were talking about a heating system and yours worked 75 percent
>>>> of
>>>> the time and the other 25 percent it heated your house way too hot,
>>>> you'd
>>>> let somebody know. You may choose to live with it because hey, it saves
>>>> you a lot of money, and you aren't home when it heats too hot, but
>>>> you'd
>>>> certainly say "Whenyou install another system, let's fix this problem".
>>>> Look at your dog and your school in the same way.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>>> Behalf
>>>> Of Brittney N. Mejico
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 19, 2011 6:44 PM
>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
>>>>
>>>> hi Mariane and every body else,
>>>> Its all so complicated. As a consumer you want the best dog
>>>> possible.and
>>>> yes I think we should get the best dog possible.
>>>> but where do we draw the line between consumer who is asking to much
>>>> and
>>>> we
>>>> are the consumer we have a right to know. There so many things I would
>>>> have
>>>> loved to know about my guide dog that I had to find out about later. I
>>>> am
>>>> starting to think that I am expecting to much from my school. But at
>>>> the
>>>> same time I want to give them the benefit of the dout, sometimes they
>>>> miss
>>>> things, things do happen, dogs get sick etc. Sometimes I think I am
>>>> complaining and other times I think "hay this is what you signed up for
>>>> deal
>>>> with it."
>>>> Take care!
>>>> .
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message----
>>>> From: Marion Gwizdala
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 19, 2011 2:32 AM
>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
>>>>
>>>> Brittney,
>>>> I object to the characteristic of the guide dog consumer as a
>>>> "beggar".
>>>> Guide dog training programs raise millions of dollars each year with
>>>> the
>>>> assertion that they are doing something beneficial and enhancing for
>>>> the
>>>> blind. Donors - many of whom are their own consumers - donate these
>>>> millions
>>>> with the same intent. If it were not for us, those employed by the
>>>> training
>>>> programs would not be earning their livings.
>>>> The idea that we have no say and must settle for whatever we
>>>> receive
>>>> with no rights to address abuse or maltreatment is archaic. Most
>>>> training
>>>> programs obviously view their blind consumers as nothing more than
>>>> wards
>>>> who
>>>> are unable to govern their own lives, let alone take care of a dog.
>>>> What
>>>> other reason would they have for not transferring ownership upon
>>>> completion
>>>> of the program? I have heard many justifications and rationalizations
>>>> for
>>>> this paternalistic practice but none of them are convincing. It is time
>>>> for
>>>> us to discard the notion that we are beholden to the training programs
>>>> and
>>>> demand to be treated equitably and with the dignity many of these
>>>> programs
>>>> mistakenly assert they provide.
>>>>
>>>> Fraternally yours,
>>>> Marion Gwizdala
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Brittney N. Mejico" <brittneymejico at verizon.net>
>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Monday, April 18, 2011 7:08 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Hi,
>>>>> Do we have rights as guide dog users? Most schools give us our dogs
>>>>> for
>>>>> free or they charge a small fee that I think is extremely cheap.
>>>>> Beggers
>>>>> can't be choosers I guess. I think we should be informed of any
>>>>> alergy
>>>>> or behavior problem but sometimes we aren't. I think the schools try
>>>>> there best we can't blame them for things that they may have missed.
>>>>> My
>>>>> guide has alergies, I found this after I brought her home. I contacted
>>>>> the
>>>>> school I got her from, and they helped me find a food that didn't
>>>>> cause
>>>>> her problems. A lot of people I know there guide dogs have alergies,
>>>>> I
>>>>> don't know why, I guess things just happen.
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: Lyn Gwizdak
>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 18, 2011 2:43 PM
>>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
>>>>>
>>>>> Hi guys,
>>>>> As a side discussion to this, it seems to me that many more dogs are
>>>>> cropping up with one kind or another allergy these days. When I lived
>>>>> back
>>>>> east I never really encountered this problem until I moved to
>>>>> California.
>>>>> Now I hear that the dogs in the east coast have this problem as well -
>>>>> actually dogs all over the US. Is this my imagination or are the dogs
>>>>> coming out of the schools now actually having more allergies? Input
>>>>> anyone?
>>>>>
>>>>> The Bill of Rights thing sounds good to me. I think the schools do
>>>>> what
>>>>> they can to try to make sure that the dogs we get are in good health.
>>>>> But
>>>>> these same dogs go through the hands of puppy raisers who either want
>>>>> their
>>>>> dog to suceed as a guide for a blind person or they want it to fail so
>>>>> they
>>>>> can keep it as a pet (I actually encountered a puppy raiser like
>>>>> this -
>>>>> they
>>>>> got found out and dropped from the program.). I wonder if the only
>>>>> info
>>>>> on
>>>>> a given dog is only that provided by the puppy raiser in their reports
>>>>> to
>>>>> the school. then there are the problems that nobody forsees like
>>>>> regional
>>>>> allergies or other problems that come up after the dog is exposed to
>>>>> something as a ongoing thing after it goes out with a graduate.
>>>>>
>>>>> JUst wondering about these things. And then a dog is a living being
>>>>> and
>>>>> there's no guarentees.
>>>>>
>>>>> Lyn and Landon
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Lisa Irving" <lirving1234 at cox.net>
>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2011 10:43 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Marion, I'm not quite sure what I'm doing here.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Consumers shall receive verbal and written notification by the school
>>>>>> when a food allergy has been identified by the puppy raiser and or
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> assigned veterinarian. With holding such vital information could
>>>>>> have
>>>>>> devastating results for the guide dog team.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Lisa and Bernie
>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>> From: "Marion Gwizdala" <blind411 at verizon.net>
>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2011 3:26 AM
>>>>>> Subject: [nagdu] Lisa and All: Bill of Rights
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Lisa,
>>>>>>> Let me ask you to complete this statement as it pertains to the
>>>>>>> issues you raise. Please keep the statement succinct, about one or
>>>>>>> two
>>>>>>> sentences. Anyone else who wants to take a stab at it is welcome to
>>>>>>> do
>>>>>>> so. As a guideline, here is the statement that would precede this
>>>>>>> one.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> a. Consumers shall expect that every effort shall be made to
>>>>>>> provide dogs in excellent health and appropriate temperament
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Now, complete this statement to provide that the program discloses
>>>>>>> this
>>>>>>> information:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The guide dog training program shall disclose ....
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I look forward to your input on our Bill of Rights!
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> fraternally yours,
>>>>>>> Marion Gwizdala
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>> From: "Lisa Irving" <lirving1234 at cox.net>
>>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog
>>>>>>> Users"
>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, April 17, 2011 1:16 AM
>>>>>>> Subject: [nagdu] when should schools give information about dog
>>>>>>> guides
>>>>>>> and re issued guides
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I believe the school has an obligation to be up front with the
>>>>>>>> student. I respect that the school doesn't want to set the student
>>>>>>>> or
>>>>>>>> the dog up for frustration and failure. This is what I base my
>>>>>>>> belief
>>>>>>>> on.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> My first guide dog was a sweet and stubborn Goldie. She was a
>>>>>>>> finicky
>>>>>>>> eater too. The school said nothing about her propensity to not eat.
>>>>>>>> However, the puppy raiser did tell me on the sly. I was told that
>>>>>>>> from
>>>>>>>> the "get-go" my Goldie was a fussy eater. The puppyraisers used
>>>>>>>> unconventional ways to get her to eat. They sprinkled Parmashon
>>>>>>>> cheese
>>>>>>>> on her food. That's all right by me. They also 'fessed up to
>>>>>>>> slipping
>>>>>>>> her people food. I'm glad they told me. It helped me be on the
>>>>>>>> alert.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> My second dog, Louie, was a ever hungry Labrador. The puppyraisers
>>>>>>>> said
>>>>>>>> something about all of his allergies and how he needed special
>>>>>>>> food.
>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>> disregarded what they said because I figured if my dog had various
>>>>>>>> food
>>>>>>>> allergies the school would know and they would tell me. Louie is
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> dog I returned because I thought he had behavioral issues. No, he
>>>>>>>> had
>>>>>>>> very severe food allergies which explained why he learned to get
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> bungy cords off the trash cans and feast. He also feasted on animal
>>>>>>>> feces too.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Bernie, my third guide dog, probably has some food allergies. Not
>>>>>>>> wanting a sad repeat of the previous food related experiences with
>>>>>>>> Louie, I nipped the problem in the bud. That is, Bernie ate two
>>>>>>>> different dog foods that left him with gooey poo. Bernie eats a
>>>>>>>> fresh and whole food quality dog food. The joke is, I can eat the
>>>>>>>> dog's
>>>>>>>> food if I really want a truly healthy and balanced diet.{In
>>>>>>>> Bernie's
>>>>>>>> food is: salmon, barley, beets, carrots and ginger and other
>>>>>>>> items{.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Lisa and Bernie , ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>> From: "Tracy Carcione" <carcione at access.net>
>>>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog
>>>>>>>> Users"
>>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 12:05 PM
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] should guides be given a second
>>>>>>>> ownerifitdoesn'tworkout with the first owner?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Hi Sarah.
>>>>>>>>> Quite true. Though I'd be happy if the puppy raiser would let me
>>>>>>>>> know
>>>>>>>>> if,
>>>>>>>>> say, the dog was a habitual counter surfer. Though they probably
>>>>>>>>> wouldn't, for fear of getting their puppy dropped from training.
>>>>>>>>> I figure knowledge is power, and I'm a big girl who won't go nuts
>>>>>>>>> over
>>>>>>>>> little problems. But you're probably right that no one is going
>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>> tell
>>>>>>>>> me all I'd like to know.
>>>>>>>>> Tracy
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Hi Tracy,
>>>>>>>>>> I was just comparing it to what we know about the guides we
>>>>>>>>>> receive
>>>>>>>>>> who
>>>>>>>>>> are
>>>>>>>>>> not reissues. They normally don't tell us about those things
>>>>>>>>>> when
>>>>>>>>>> we
>>>>>>>>>> receive a nonreissue, so I wouldn't really expect them to for a
>>>>>>>>>> reissue
>>>>>>>>>> just
>>>>>>>>>> because it was a reissue.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Sarah & Miguel
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>>>> From: "Tracy Carcione" <carcione at access.net>
>>>>>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog
>>>>>>>>>> Users"
>>>>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 11:20 AM
>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] should guides be given a second
>>>>>>>>>> ownerifitdoesn'tworkout
>>>>>>>>>> with the first owner?
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Sarah.
>>>>>>>>>>> I don't think I buy your argument. There could be plenty of
>>>>>>>>>>> undesirable
>>>>>>>>>>> behaviors I might never think to mention. For example, Ben
>>>>>>>>>>> empties
>>>>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>>>>> route. The best I've managed to do is teach him to pull over
>>>>>>>>>>> first.
>>>>>>>>>>> To
>>>>>>>>>>> me, this is a very undesirable behavior, but it did not occur to
>>>>>>>>>>> me
>>>>>>>>>>> during
>>>>>>>>>>> the matching process to say so, any more than I would think to
>>>>>>>>>>> mention
>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>> a shoe salesman that I don't want my shoe laces coming untied
>>>>>>>>>>> every
>>>>>>>>>>> 5
>>>>>>>>>>> minutes.
>>>>>>>>>>> Personally, I'd like to at least be made aware of any
>>>>>>>>>>> undesirable
>>>>>>>>>>> behavior
>>>>>>>>>>> the school is aware of, so I could either take immediate steps
>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>> correct
>>>>>>>>>>> it, or decide I don't want to deal with it at all. You can bet,
>>>>>>>>>>> next
>>>>>>>>>>> time, I'll say very loudly that I don't want a dog who empties
>>>>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>>>>> route.
>>>>>>>>>>> Then they'll probably give me a counter surfer instead.
>>>>>>>>>>> <grimace.>
>>>>>>>>>>> Tracy
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Peggy,
>>>>>>>>>>>> Thinking about it, you probably don't even really need to know
>>>>>>>>>>>> why
>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>> match
>>>>>>>>>>>> didn't work, if its not something that is going to impact you.
>>>>>>>>>>>> The
>>>>>>>>>>>> only
>>>>>>>>>>>> reason I can think of that a handler would need to know is if
>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>> dog
>>>>>>>>>>>> has
>>>>>>>>>>>> some kind of medical condition where it is going to need
>>>>>>>>>>>> prescription
>>>>>>>>>>>> dog
>>>>>>>>>>>> food, or baths every couple weeks, or something else that is
>>>>>>>>>>>> going
>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>> real hassel and/or cost a lot more money than usual. But then
>>>>>>>>>>>> again,
>>>>>>>>>>>> I'd
>>>>>>>>>>>> think a handler should know this about any dog regardless if
>>>>>>>>>>>> its
>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>> reissue
>>>>>>>>>>>> or not.
>>>>>>>>>>>> As long as the reissue matches what the new handler wants, and
>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>> handler
>>>>>>>>>>>> is specific in what they want, there shouldn't be any problems.
>>>>>>>>>>>> If
>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>> previous handler returned the dog because they didn't like
>>>>>>>>>>>> something
>>>>>>>>>>>> such
>>>>>>>>>>>> as
>>>>>>>>>>>> that the dog scavenged a lot or counter surfed, etc, that
>>>>>>>>>>>> shouldn't
>>>>>>>>>>>> matter
>>>>>>>>>>>> too much either because if the new handler specifically doesn't
>>>>>>>>>>>> want to
>>>>>>>>>>>> deal
>>>>>>>>>>>> with a major food distraction issue, they'd want to request a
>>>>>>>>>>>> dog
>>>>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>>>> isn't
>>>>>>>>>>>> too food distracted, or ideally, who doesn't have a food
>>>>>>>>>>>> distraction
>>>>>>>>>>>> problem
>>>>>>>>>>>> at all.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Sarah & Miguel
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Peggy" <pshald at neb.rr.com>
>>>>>>>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog
>>>>>>>>>>>> Users"
>>>>>>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, April 15, 2011 6:29 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] should guides be given a second
>>>>>>>>>>>> ownerifitdoesn'tworkout
>>>>>>>>>>>> with the first owner?
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> That's just it, you have no idea why the match didn't work,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'd
>>>>>>>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>>>>>>>> curious
>>>>>>>>>>>>> to find out, but schools don't always provide that
>>>>>>>>>>>>> information.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> My
>>>>>>>>>>>>> current Seeing Eye dog is a reissued dog and she is one of the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> best
>>>>>>>>>>>>> dogs
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>>>>>> have ever had. As I said I'll always wonder why her previous
>>>>>>>>>>>>> match
>>>>>>>>>>>>> didn't
>>>>>>>>>>>>> work out but she is wonderful ... she was taken back to the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> school,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> re-evaluated and whatever else they have to do. She lived in
>>>>>>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> instructor's offices for supervision for quite a while. It
>>>>>>>>>>>>> was
>>>>>>>>>>>>> determined
>>>>>>>>>>>>> that she was still workable and was then matched with me and
>>>>>>>>>>>>> it's
>>>>>>>>>>>>> turned
>>>>>>>>>>>>> out wonderful.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: Sarah Clark
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2011 10:15 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Users
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] should guides be given a second owner
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ifitdoesn'tworkout with the first owner?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I don't think you can turn down all reissues, or classify them
>>>>>>>>>>>>> all
>>>>>>>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> same category. True that an occasional dog that is a reissue
>>>>>>>>>>>>> may
>>>>>>>>>>>>> have
>>>>>>>>>>>>> been
>>>>>>>>>>>>> sent back for unpleasant reasons like being too hard to handle
>>>>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> handler, or certain health conditions that wouldn't stop the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> dog
>>>>>>>>>>>>> from
>>>>>>>>>>>>> working but that the handler didn't want to deal with, etc,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> but
>>>>>>>>>>>>> many
>>>>>>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>>>>> them
>>>>>>>>>>>>> are sent back for reasons that are not negative at all. Maybe
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> dog
>>>>>>>>>>>>> just
>>>>>>>>>>>>> walked too fast for the handler and they got home and realized
>>>>>>>>>>>>> this
>>>>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>>>>> they couldn't slow the dog down (this happened to my husband
>>>>>>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>> guide
>>>>>>>>>>>>> many years ago). Maybe it just wasn't a good match. Or maybe
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> person
>>>>>>>>>>>>> lived in a very hot climate and the dog just couldn't handle
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> extreme
>>>>>>>>>>>>> heat (also happened with someone I know).
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I wouldn't think twice about taking a reissue if the school
>>>>>>>>>>>>> thinks
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> dog
>>>>>>>>>>>>> is a good match for me and what I'm looking for. Its also
>>>>>>>>>>>>> true
>>>>>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>>>>> they
>>>>>>>>>>>>> have the experience under their belt so are often more
>>>>>>>>>>>>> seasoned
>>>>>>>>>>>>> than
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> younger dogs. Though it is clear that some applicants don't
>>>>>>>>>>>>> want
>>>>>>>>>>>>> them
>>>>>>>>>>>>> because each school I have applied to has asked during the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> interview
>>>>>>>>>>>>> if
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'd
>>>>>>>>>>>>> be open to having one.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sarah & Miguel
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Lyn Gwizdak" <linda.gwizdak at cox.net>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Users"
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2011 3:01 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] should guides be given a second owner if
>>>>>>>>>>>>> itdoesn'tworkout with the first owner?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>I know a guy who had a guide who had been reissued. This dog
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> was
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>with
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>guy who got himself arrested and a jail term and the dog was
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> taken
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>him and my friend got this same dog. Boy, what stories this
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>dog
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>could
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>have told if he could talk! It was a very nice dog and she
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> worked
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> well
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>for my friend and she had a good long working life.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Lyn and Landon
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Lisa Irving" <lirving1234 at cox.net>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Users"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2011 1:24 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] should guides be given a second owner if
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> doesn'tworkout with the first owner?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi there, Tami and Brittney,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The more I contemplate the re issuance of a guide dog, I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> keep
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> thinking
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> how much it means to me when someone gives me a second
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> chance.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Our
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dogs
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> deserve as many chances as we can give them; first time out,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> or
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> re
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> issued.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Lisa and Bernie
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Tamara Smith-Kinney" <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dog
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Users'"
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2011 10:36 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] should guides be given a second owner
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> if
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> doesn'twork out with the first owner?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Brittney,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm glad you asked this question. That's one of those
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> program
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> policies
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ran across while researching for owner-training, and my
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> first
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> response
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the notion was very negative.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Since then, I've heard of enough positive experience with
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dogs
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> who
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> were
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reissued after being returned to have a more favorable view
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> practice.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Most of what I've heard is from people who have done well
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> re-issued
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dogs or from people who know people... /smile/ Still, I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> get
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> now
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and understand the reasoning others have explained, and it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> does
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> seem
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> work
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for the most part. There will certainly be times when it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> doesn't,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> but
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is true of matches in general.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> As for whether you're over-reacting... As a still pretty
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> new
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> only
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> somewhat experienced guide dog handler, also an
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> owner-trainer
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> then
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> self-taught handler, I've been observing the attitudes and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ways
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> thinking
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of handlers at or just above my level of experience as
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> closely
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> as I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> those of the long-timers. I can watch my peers in that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> regard
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> give
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> myself a reality check as to how I'm coming along not just
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> skill
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> but
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> maturity as a handler while I'm learning from those with
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> much
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> more
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> experience.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So here's my observation, based not just on myself but on a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> generalized
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> group of other first time handlers going through or just
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> coming
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> past
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> team building phase: We over-react. To everything. /lol/
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> good,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bad, the mundane... It is all new and exciting and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> frightening
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wonderful and awful, all beyond belief. We popped out to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dinner
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> just
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> evening, and at the restaurant there was just this one
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> little
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> thing
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that no
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> one would have noticed beyond our table... Outwardly, I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> remained
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> calm
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> responded correctly and it was all okay. Inwardly, what
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> did
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> do?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> /lol/
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> OMG! How can this be? What can it mean? Oh, no, this is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> so
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> terrible!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Then I noticed nothing had actually happened that was worth
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> all
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> fuss and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> got over it. /smile/ More and more, it's all old hat, but
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> apparently
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I can
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> still freak out just fine over absolutely nothing.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> As for working through bad habits in your re-issue dog...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> think
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> others
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are right in their observations that during the first year
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> or
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> so,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> there
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> will
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> always be something that will make you absolutely crazy
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> about
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> your
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dog.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> In
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> your first dog, these will be far more magnified in your
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> own
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mind
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> than
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> those you work with later on as a truly experience
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> dhandler.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bad
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> habits
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> need to be dealt with and modified, certainly, but it's not
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> really
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> habit for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you yet to deal with those ups and downs. So you really
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> think
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> your
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> way through it and notice every little thing and try to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> figure
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> out
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> how
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> counteract and... Well, on and on. It just takes awhile
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> all
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> become havit and natural. I've only been there for a short
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> while
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> minor blips where I freak out over nothing -- and that sure
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nice!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Good luck with your dog; sounds like you're coming through
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tream
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> building phase and are starting on the next one -- which is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> where
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> all
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> falls together and you're just you working your guide.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> /smile/
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> loving
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that, and trying to hold onto that feeling as I move into
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> taking
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> all
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for granted phase.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Tami Smith-Kinney
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Behalf
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Of Brittney N. Mejico
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, April 13, 2011 3:20 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: the National Association of Guide Dog Users NAGDU
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Mailing
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> List
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [nagdu] should guides be given a second owner if
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> doesn't
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> work
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> out with the first owner?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hello all,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> My dog had another handler before me. I don't think that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> guides
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> should
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> given another handlerbecause the dog picksup a lot of bad
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> habits
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are really hard to get rid of. I love my dog very
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> muchand
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> harvard
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> has
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> changed my life, but it took me a year to stop a lot of her
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bad
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> habbits, and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> we still have some work to do. What do you guys think? am
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> over
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> reacting?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> account
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> info
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/lirving1234%40cox.net
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> info
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/linda.gwizdak%40cox.n
>> et
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> info
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/goldflash9%40sbcgloba
>> l.net
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>>>>>>>>> info
>>>>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/pshald%40neb.rr.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Dream as if you'll live forever, live as if you'll die today.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>>>>>>>>> info
>>>>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/goldflash9%40sbcgloba
>> l.net
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>>>>>>>> info
>>>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/carcione%40access.net
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>>>>>>> info
>>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/goldflash9%40sbcgloba
>> l.net
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
>>>>>>>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/carcione%40access.net
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
>>>>>>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/lirving1234%40cox.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>> nagdu:
>>>>>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/blind411%40verizon.ne
>> t
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>> nagdu:
>>>>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/lirving1234%40cox.net
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>>> nagdu:
>>>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/linda.gwizdak%40cox.n
>> et
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> nagdu:
>>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/brittneymejico%40veri
>> zon.net
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> nagdu:
>>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/blind411%40verizon.ne
>> t
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nagdu:
>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/brittneymejico%40veri
>> zon.net
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nagdu:
>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/rebecca.pickrell%40ta
>> sc.com
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> nagdu:
>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/carcione%40access.net
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nagdu mailing list
>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nagdu:
>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/lirving1234%40cox.net
>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nagdu mailing list
>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nagdu:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tamara.8024%40comcast
>> .net
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nagdu mailing list
>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nagdu:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/lirving1234%40cox.net
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nagdu mailing list
> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nagdu:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/linda.gwizdak%40cox.net
More information about the NAGDU
mailing list