[nagdu] The Seeing Eye & Ownership

Thu Feb 3 15:22:06 UTC 2011

Well said. My pup is also from GDB, and I agree 100%. And, your right, the 
ownership problem and the follow up services should not be related.

Nicole and Lexia (who was born in California, trained in Oregon)

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Sandra e. Finley" <finleyknits at gmail.com>
To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, February 03, 2011 4:02 AM
Subject: Re: [nagdu] The Seeing Eye & Ownership

>I kind of like GDB's policy that I don't own the dog immediately upon 
>graduation but am free to apply for ownership; I forget if it is after one 
>or two years. Through no fault of mine or theirs I had difficulty with one
> dog within the first year after she was issued and she had to be returned 
> and retired.  At the time I somehow felt good that I did not own her. I 
> truly believe this is all psychological whether we own the dog or not. 
> Repputable organizations are going to provide appropriate follow up
> regardless of ownership. In 37 years of guide dog use I have never worried
> that either of the two schools i have used would come and take back my 
> seasoned, working guide. Why would they? I recently had a major vet bill 
> to
> save my dog's life and GDB was most responsive, helping us with the parts 
> we
> felt we could not afford.  I don't think that TSE or GDB or any of the 
> other
> reputable organizations base a decision of follow up, payment of vet bills 
> or
> retirement on  who owns the dog.  I say, isn't it good we have 
> organizations with difffering policies? It Gives us some choice.
>
> Sandy
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Marion Gwizdala" <blind411 at verizon.net>
> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, February 01, 2011 6:11 AM
> Subject: [nagdu] The Seeing Eye & Ownership
>
>
>> Dear All,
>>    Let me begin by saying I am not a seeing Eye consumer. It is my 
>> opinion
>> that The Seeing Eye has it right, as it relates to ownership. In short,
>> TSE believes that the dog belongs to the consumer and it is the 
>> consumer's
>> right to make all decisions as it pertains to the dog. This includes both
>> early and end-of-work retirement,even after the consumer makes the
>> difficult choice to surrender the dog, as illustrated by Peggy's
>> experience.
>>    One untruth Mr. Russman stated during our telephone conversation, when
>> I asserted that TSE grants full ownership upon completion of training, 
>> was
>> that TSE does not offer any sort of follow-up. I told him I knew too many
>> TSE consumers and that he was absolutely wrong. Then he qualified his
>> statement by saying something like, "Well, not to the level of Fidelco!"
>> If, by that he means the type of follow-up in which they call and say, "I
>> am five minutes from your house and I am coming over to see your dog!", 
>> he
>> is right! I feel no guide dog program should impose themselves upon their
>> consumers. Such tactics are very intimidating and paternalistic!
>>
>> Fraternally yours,
>> Marion Gwizdala
>>
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Peggy" <pshald at neb.rr.com>
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Monday, January 31, 2011 11:38 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Guide Dog Handler Bill of Rights
>>
>>
>>> With Se, once you leave the school with that dog it's yours to do what
>>> you wish with, hopefully work it.  But when it retires, no matter when
>>> that is, you can choose to keep him/her or give him/her to a friend or
>>> family, or send him/her back to SE.  When I gave up my first dog, a
>>> yellow lab, that was having some definate anxiety issues, I had only
>>> worked her for a year and a half ... I could have kept her, given her to
>>> someone ... what I chose to do was send her back to SE to see if they
>>> could work with her and maybe she could continue guide dog work.  She 
>>> did
>>> retire and they notified me that she could not be retrained and even
>>> asked if I wanted her back as a pet. Just thought I'd share because I 
>>> saw
>>> at the end of the post you said you weren't sure if after a short time
>>> they'd still let you keep the dog ... at least I thought that's what you
>>> meant.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message----- 
>>> From: Cindy Ray
>>> Sent: Sunday, January 30, 2011 4:00 PM
>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Guide Dog Handler Bill of Rights
>>>
>>> If you get a dog at TSE and within the first year you find that the dog
>>> is not working out for you, they will replace it and apply the fee to 
>>> the
>>> next dog and call it an adjustment. In such a case, it would be only
>>> right for you to return the dog to them. Jordan's is the only story I
>>> have ever heard of a repossession, and I suspect there is more to the
>>> story that we don't know and probably don't have a right to know, but it
>>> seems like aserioius allegation given that this is not their policy and
>>> the dog is yours upon leaving the school. To say they don't care is
>>> really what you perceive, many of the rest of us do not see that. When I
>>> hae not been able to continue with a dog (and I two such within a year's
>>> period that had to return) I would never have found the dog a home but,
>>> rather, would hve wanted to return it there for their evaluation. The 
>>> two
>>> with which I experienced it were retired, far as I know, and the one I
>>> had for two years and returned, I did because I thought he might be a
>>> better fit for someone else. I think I could have given him away if I 
>>> had
>>> wanted to. Never tested out this theory.
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nagdu mailing list
>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nagdu:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/pshald%40neb.rr.com
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Friends are like a snow flake.
>>> If you pee on them they go away
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> nagdu mailing list
>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> nagdu:
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/blind411%40verizon.net
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> nagdu mailing list
>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nagdu:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/finleyknits%40gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nagdu mailing list
> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> nagdu:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/ntorcolini%40wavecable.com 