[nagdu] discrimination by taxi and othertransportation providers
cheryl echevarria
cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com
Sat Jul 30 21:52:06 UTC 2011
Thank you for correcting me.
Leading the Way in Independent Travel!
Cheryl Echevarria
http://www.echevarriatravel.com<http://www.echevarriatravel.com/>
631-456-5394
reservations at echevarriatravel.com<mailto:reservations at echevarriatravel.com>
Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Montrose Travel CST-1018299-10
Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Absolute Cruise & Travel, Inc.
----- Original Message -----
From: Marion Gwizdala<mailto:blind411 at verizon.net>
To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2011 5:49 PM
Subject: Re: [nagdu] discrimination by taxi and othertransportation providers
Cheryl,
the "national law" is the Americans with Disabilities Act! Taxicabs are
public accommodations under title III of the Act.
Fraternally yours,
Marion
----- Original Message -----
From: "cheryl echevarria" <cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com<mailto:cherylandmaxx at hotmail.com>>
To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
<nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2011 2:12 PM
Subject: Re: [nagdu] discrimination by taxi and othertransportation
providers
> per taxi cab laws if I remember if you are a legal even if you are
> independent car service, you must follow the laws, and you can loose your
> hack license if refused to take a person with a disability as well as with
> a guide dog.
>
> If there isn't, then as NAGDU we should have a national law.
>
> Leading the Way in Independent Travel!
>
> Cheryl Echevarria
> http://www.echevarriatravel.com<http://www.echevarriatravel.com/<http://www.echevarriatravel.com%3chttp//www.echevarriatravel.com/>>
> 631-456-5394
> reservations at echevarriatravel.com<mailto:reservations at echevarriatravel.com<mailto:reservations at echevarriatravel.com%3Cmailto:reservations at echevarriatravel.com>>
>
> Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Montrose Travel
> CST-1018299-10
>
> Affiliated as an Independent Contractor with Absolute Cruise & Travel,
> Inc.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Julie Phillipson<mailto:jbrew48 at verizon.net<mailto:jbrew48 at verizon.net>>
> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog
> Users<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
> Sent: Saturday, July 30, 2011 1:51 PM
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] discrimination by taxi and othertransportation
> providers
>
>
> I don't use a cab very often any more for various reasons, but when I
> have
> well I have done it both ways and I think it is easier when you don't
> tell
> them. One time though many years ago I was going out for dinner with
> someone and we both had a dog. I used this company regularly at the
> time.
> The cab came and when we went out he refused to take us. I immediately
> called the company and within 10 minutes another cab came. I remember I
> was
> pretty upset with them and didn't hold it back from them knowing it! The
> dispatcher new me and took care of it pretty quickly but I don't know
> what
> happened with the driver if anything. Some independent cab drivers use
> their own cars and when the dispatcher from another company puts a call
> out
> it goes out on the radio and the independent guy takes it. They think
> since
> it is their own personal car that they can refuse you. If it is a
> company
> car they don't care as much!
> Julie Phillipson and Viggo
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Marion Gwizdala"
> <blind411 at verizon.net<mailto:blind411 at verizon.net<mailto:blind411 at verizon.net%3Cmailto:blind411 at verizon.net>>>
> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org%3Cmailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>>
> Sent: Friday, July 29, 2011 9:00 PM
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] discrimination by taxi and other transportation
> providers
>
>
> > Dear All,
> > Let me share with you an actual experience I had. I am a
> professional
> > entertainer, a solo act generally necessitating the use of a cab. Many
> of
> > the cabbies in my area with the company I usually use, know me and like
> > transporting me because I was a cab driver when I was sighted and going
> to
> > school. I say this because I know the importance of a good tip. BTW,
> the
> > word "tip" is actually an acronym that stands for "to insure
> promptness".
> > One morning after a gig (about 3:00 am) I called for a cab. I did
> not
> > tell them I had a dog; however, my cell number is associated with my
> call
> > and there is a file on everyone who calls for a cab with some
> information,
> > such as the person's name and address. Well, my file apparently
> indicated
> > that I had a service dog. I waited an unusual length of time for a cab
> > home. When the cabbie arrived, he said he came in from the airport
> (about
> > 45 minutes from where I was) because no one was bidding on the ride. He
> > told me the dispatcher was asking, "Anyone in zone 58 willing to
> transport
> > a dog?" The cabbie said he knew it was me and, since no one else bid on
> > it, he knew it was worth the trip in to pick me up.
> > I called the company the following day and filed a complaint with
> the
> > county Public Transportation Comission, alleging I was discriminated
> > against by the company because my file was flagged as having a service
> > dog, resulting in an unequal benefit. The ADA states
> >
> > "
> > (ii) Participation in unequal benefit. It shall be discriminatory to
> > afford an individual or class of individuals, on the basis of a
> disability
> > or disabilities
> >
> > of such individual or class, directly, or through contractual,
> licensing,
> > or other arrangements with the opportunity to participate in or benefit
> > from a
> >
> > good, service, facility, privilege, advantage, or accommodation that is
> > not equal to that afforded to other individuals." (
> >
> > 42 USC 12182.)
> >
> >
> >
> > Whether the place of public accommodation is a taxicab, hotel, health
> care
> > facility, restaurant, or any other place, the presence of your service
> > animal is irrelevant. By notifying them in advance that you will be
> > accompanied by a service animal, you passively communicate that this is
> > something they need to know about and, therefore, that there is
> something
> > they need to do. Not knowing what that "something" might be, they will
> > certainly make something up, setting you up for discrimination.
> > Furthermore, alerting them in advance sends the message that this is
> > proper protocol and, when someone does not provide advance notice, sets
> up
> > an adversarial situation.
> >
> > I pose the following question on this topic for debate: What is the
> > reason for giving advance notice that you will be accompanied by a
> service
> > dog? I ask this question in an effort to offer a challenge to this
> > practice. I promise my challenges will be respectful and dignified,
> > definitely not attacking. This is a great issue for lively, respectful
> > debate!
> >
> >
> >
> > Fraternally yours,
> >
> > Marion Gwizdala
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "Michael Hingson"
> <mhingson at sbcglobal.net<mailto:mhingson at sbcglobal.net<mailto:mhingson at sbcglobal.net%3Cmailto:mhingson at sbcglobal.net>>>
> > To: "'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'"
> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org%3Cmailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>>
> > Sent: Friday, July 29, 2011 7:58 PM
> > Subject: [nagdu] discrimination by taxi and other transportation
> providers
> >
> >
> > All,
> >
> > I am with Marion on this. Although some may feel that there is no
> wrong
> > answer I think that at some point we need to take a stand. I
> personally
> > have found many instances when I gave advanced notification either I
> had
> > long delays, staff sent a huge van to take me instead of a taxi which
> in
> > turn caused delays, or other rules about how my dog was suppose to be
> > transported were made up.
> >
> > The law is clear that we and our guides are to be treated the same as
> any
> > other passenger. There is no excuse for any company providing
> > transportation to the public insisting on advanced notice for our
> guides.
> > There is no excuse for any such company permitting any of its drivers
> or
> > pilots to discriminate against us.
> >
> > At the same time I do understand why some on this list take a different
> > tact. While I will not say advanced notice is wrong I would encourage
> > everyone to work toward taking a strong stance. If we do not company
> > personnel will never learn that discriminating against us is wrong.
> >
> >
> > Best,
> >
> >
> > Michael Hingson
> >
> > The Michael Hingson Group, INC.
> > "Speaking with Vision"
> > Michael Hingson, President
> > (415) 827-4084
> > info at michaelhingson.com<mailto:info at michaelhingson.com<mailto:info at michaelhingson.com%3Cmailto:info at michaelhingson.com>>
> > To learn more about my upcoming book, speaking topics and speaking
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> >
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org%3Cmailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org>>
> [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
> > Of Marion Gwizdala
> > Sent: Friday, July 29, 2011 4:05 PM
> > To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Re Guide Dog and taxis
> >
> > Gary and all,
> > I generally advise that one not give advance notice that we will be
> > traveling with a guide dog. The presence of the service dog is
> irrelevant
> > to
> >
> > whether or not they transport you. If the dispatcher broadcasts, "I'm
> > looking for someone willing to take a fare with a dog!" you may wait
> > longer
> > for a ride than if they didn't know. This sets you up for the type of
> > discrimination known as an unequal benefit. I have dealt with several
> > people
> >
> > who gave advance notice and regretted it because of the long wait
> times.
> > JMHO!
> >
> > Fraternally yours,
> > Marion
> >
> >
> > ----- Original Message -----
> > From: "GARY STEEVES"
> <rainshadowmusic at shaw.ca<mailto:rainshadowmusic at shaw.ca<mailto:rainshadowmusic at shaw.ca%3Cmailto:rainshadowmusic at shaw.ca>>>
> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org%3Cmailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>>
> > Sent: Friday, July 29, 2011 6:13 PM
> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Re Guide Dog and taxis
> >
> >
> >>
> >> Hi:
> >>
> >> Generally, I don't have a problem just telling the company I have a
> dog
> >> since, if there is the potential for an issue this should remove it.
> The
> >> issue I have and am going to talk to my current cab company about is
> that
> >> they have one letter symbols for things. I learned this two weeks ago
> >> when
> >
> >> three trips in a row I got a van cab. I found out that my file had a V
> >> for
> >
> >> van and A for animal. I think they need to add another symbol that
> >> represents service dogs since an animal is a bit vague. I got cabs who
> >> don't mind dogs but sometimes I think they believe it is a pet,
> >> especially
> >
> >> cuz it's a poodle which they never see as guide dogs. Also, being that
> we
> >> are getting picked up right in front of my house and I've usually just
> >> been walking bogart around the block for his morning relief, he is
> often
> >> not in harness. the harness is in my hand. However, why I use the
> same
> >> company all the time is so that many drivers get to know me and often
> >> show
> >
> >> up with the front passenger seat put way forward to
> >> give Bogart more room and cute things like that.
> >>
> >> Gary
> >>
> >> ----- Original Message -----
> >> From: Tami Kinney
> <tamara.8024 at comcast.net<mailto:tamara.8024 at comcast.net<mailto:tamara.8024 at comcast.net%3Cmailto:tamara.8024 at comcast.net>>>
> >> Date: Friday, July 29, 2011 2:34 pm
> >> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Re Guide Dog Forced to Ride in Trunk
> >> To: nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org%3Cmailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
> >>
> >>> Lyn,
> >>>
> >>> Well said. When I lived nearer to downtown, I would just tell the
> >>> dispatcher about the dog, although it seems they do have a note about
> >>> her attached to my number. This actually worked in my favor
> >>> there, where
> >>> you couldn't swing a cat without hitting one of their cabs. Now I'm
> >>> still in the Portland Metro area, but apparently this does not
> prevent
> >>> me living in the boonies as far as the cab companies are
> >>> concerned. So
> >>> I've learned to just fail to mention anything at all about a dog or
> >>> being blind or anything because that does seem to increase the
> >>> odds a
> >>> cab will get out here eventually. I've tried a couple of other
> >>> companiesthat supposedly serve this area, but... Sigh. Anyway,
> >>> if they want to
> >>> drive all the way out here and then refuse to take my dog, I
> >>> guess I'll
> >>> be putting up a big fuss about that, won't I? /evil grin/
> >>>
> >>> Then again, what with having a private driver and on-demand car
> >>> serviceright here, I guess I won't be giving many cabby's an
> >>> opportunity to
> >>> refuse me a ride because of my dog. Ain't that just too
> >>> bad for
> >>> me. /lol/
> >>>
> >>> Either way, with cabs or hotel reservations or whatever, I tend
> >>> to do
> >>> what I believe is most likely to achieve the best results when
> >>> it comes
> >>> to deciding whether to mention the dog beforehand or not. Which
> >>> does not
> >>> mean I always make the right guess, but I have had few hassles, so
> >>> that's what matters to me. /smile/
> >>>
> >>> Tami
> >>>
> >>> On Thu, 2011-07-28 at 12:42 -0700, Lyn Gwizdak wrote:
> >>> > I agree with you, Bibi. I will tell the cab dispach that
> >>> I have a guide dog
> >>> > and to just send a driver who has no problem with a dog.
> >>> this way, I get my
> >>> > cab and no BSing with the driver. People do what you
> >>> feel is best for you.
> >>> > There's no right or wrong in this matter.
> >>> >
> >>> > Lyn and Landon
> >>> > ----- Original Message -----
> >>> > From: "Criminal Justice Major Extraordinaire"
> >>> <orleans24 at comcast.net<mailto:orleans24 at comcast.net<mailto:orleans24 at comcast.net%3Cmailto:orleans24 at comcast.net>>>> To: "NAGDU
> Mailing List,the National
> >>> Association of Guide Dog Users"
> >>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org%3Cmailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>>
> >>> > Sent: Saturday, July 23, 2011 5:54 PM
> >>> > Subject: Re: [nagdu] Re Guide Dog Forced to Ride in Trunk
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> > > Hi, Brenda,
> >>> > > I remember when attending a couple of guide dog schools and
> >>> not hearing
> >>> > > one word or thing mentioned about if being asked by a cab
> >>> driver to put
> >>> > > the dog in a trunk of the car.
> >>> > > Thankfully, I've not had any experiences with that and
> >>> hopefully with my
> >>> > > fourth guide, that won't happen either.
> >>> > > I know many people here won't agree with what I'm about to
> >>> say here, but
> >>> > > here it goes...
> >>> > > There were times I'd just go ahead and let the cab company
> >>> know that I
> >>> > > have a guide dog and it did help and minimize a possible problem.
> >>> > > In the same aspect, I'd get a cab quickly too.
> >>> > > I only would do this during stressful situations to avoid
> >>> getting
> >>> > > frustrated around Odie.
> >>> > > He is one sensitive boy who would pick up on my anxiety
> >>> rather quickly.
> >>> > > If I knew where that dog handler was living here in
> >>> Colorado, I'd gladly
> >>> > > help her out or at least be willing to give her some
> >>> encouragement and
> >>> > > advice on dealing with situations like that.
> >>> > > unfortunately, I have no idea if she lives in Denver or
> >>> another city close
> >>> > > by to me.
> >>> > > If someone told me to put Odie in the trunk, I'd happily say
> >>> right on tthe
> >>> > > spot, "Would you like it if I just rolled you up and stuck
> >>> you in that
> >>> > > area?"
> >>> > > I know. I'm a tough person when it comes to stuff like that.
> >>> > > *Smiles*
> >>> > > Bibi and Odie
> >>> > > the retired one
> >>> > >
> >>> > > _______________________________________________
> >>> > > nagdu mailing list
> >>> > > nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org%3Cmailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>>
> >>> > >
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> >>> >
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> >>>
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> >>>
> >> _______________________________________________
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