[nagdu] PA Evans'BilltoHelpProtectService AnimalsReceives House Endorsement

Julie J julielj at neb.rr.com
Sun Mar 13 13:16:27 UTC 2011 

Mark,

I have thought seriously about pepper or some other sort of spray deterrent. 
The thing that has prevented me from trying it is the wind.  I live in 
Nebraska, and well it's pretty much some variety of windy every day.  The 
wind also has the annoying habit of coming from a variety of directions at 
once.  I'm not sure that I would be able to account for the wind when 
spraying and I'd end up with it in my face or my dog would get it.

A service dog trainer once suggested to me to use an umbrella.  The sort 
that are spring loaded and pop open with the push of a button.  I think it's 
a good idea.  I've not tried it though.  Of course you'd have to work with 
your own dog so they wouldn't be startled by it, but that should be totally 
doable.

Julie



----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mark J. Cadigan" <kramc11 at gmail.com>
To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, March 12, 2011 11:51 PM
Subject: Re: [nagdu] PA Evans'BilltoHelpProtectService AnimalsReceives House 
Endorsement


> Photographing the attack is all well and good, but how is that going to 
> help you in the here and now? What about in addition to the nifty camera 
> you carry some doggy pepper spray or something like that. Then, when the 
> attacking dog decides it would rather rub his green tinged pepper spray 
> covered face in the dirt than attack you can take that picture. And also, 
> a green tinged pepper spray covered yelping in pain dog will be very easy 
> for the cops to identify at the nearest vet's office.
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Tamara Smith-Kinney" <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'" 
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, March 12, 2011 3:54 PM
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] PA Evans'Bill toHelpProtectService AnimalsReceives 
> House Endorsement
>
>
>> Lisa,
>>
>> I like to do scenario planning, too, so that if it all hits the fan, I 
>> won't
>> be caught flat footed and just stand around gaping stupidly.  Then again, 
>> I
>> can still manage to do that, with or without advance planning.  /smile/
>>
>> I do like the idea of having a handheld camera -- preferably in a cell 
>> phone
>> -- on hand as an evidence gathering tool.  I figure if I can hear, I can
>> point the camera.  Whether I could pull that off in the thick of things, 
>> I
>> don't know.  My first priority is to protect my dog and then myself, 
>> while
>> diffusing things before they get too ugly...  I hope not to find out if I
>> could pull off whipping out the camera so that I could have some recourse
>> after the dust settles.
>>
>> Tami Smith-Kinney
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
>> Behalf
>> Of Lisa Irving
>> Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2011 8:52 PM
>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] PA Evans'Bill to HelpProtectService AnimalsReceives
>> House Endorsement
>>
>> Steve,
>>
>> Without getting morose it can be beneficial to role play  in your mind
>> various situations. "Some one" included the owner or human aggressor, and
>> yes, the aggressive dog. Years ago A probably mentally unstable woman's
>> smallish dog attacked my very docile golden retriever. I started to swing 
>> my
>>
>> foot to separate the aggressive dog from my dog that just sat there. The
>> unstable woman came at my face; clawing my neck and my face. I didn't see 
>> it
>>
>> coming and I was badly rattled. I know there's no chance I could have 
>> taken
>> photos as everything happened so fast. In that instance people stood and
>> gawked, but no one was courageous enough to step forward to talk to the
>> police when they arrived.If something similar happened today I'd probably
>> still end up taking a hit. I also know I'd make a lot of noise and hope 
>> an
>> empathetic good Samaritan steps forward. Only as a very last resort would 
>> I
>> incorporate my martial arts skills to create space between me and the 
>> human
>> aggressor. Martial arts promotes stepping back and creating space when at
>> all possible. In other words I would not contribute to a hostile
>> environment. As for my dog, I suspect if  I unclipped his leash or tossed
>> something, Bernie would likely take off. That's both positive and 
>> negative.
>> The alternative, him getting seriously hurt isn't an option.
>>
>> Lisa and Bernie
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Steven Johnson" <blinddog3 at charter.net>
>> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2011 3:23 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] PA Evans'Bill to Help ProtectService AnimalsReceives
>> House Endorsement
>>
>>
>>> Lisa, good question.
>>> My role first and foremost is my safety then my dogs.  Depending on the
>>> nature of an assault by another dog, the first thing I would do is not 
>>> try
>>> to break up the fight and let the dog go.  Of course, this creates
>>> opportunity to possibly take a picture as this what I am guessing you 
>>> are
>>> hinting at.  However, My next concern and role is not to lose track of 
>>> my
>>> dog, and after an incident or even for that matter, during an incident, 
>>> my
>>> focus would be on what is happening, and I highly doubt I would event 
>>> hink
>>> about taking a picture, or what resembles attempting to take a picture 
>>> of
>>> a
>>> tangled mess of dogs.  I have not been in this situation, nor do I ever
>>> hope
>>> I am nor do I ever wish this upon anyone else, and would like to hear 
>>> what
>>> others think about their roles when harm is being caused to one's dog.
>>> Now,
>>> just to clarify, this is eluding to that of an attack by another dog on 
>>> a
>>> working dog, not that of a person as this brings in a whole different
>>> level
>>> of reactions.  Your post states, someone, but the prior posts refer to
>>> that
>>> of an attacking dog...what then, is your role and how does this play out
>>> given the slight change as I am not clear of if it is a dog or someone
>>> meaning human.
>>>
>>> Thanks,
>>> Steve
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
>>> Behalf
>>> Of Lisa Irving
>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2011 9:50 PM
>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] PA Evans'Bill to Help Protect Service 
>>> AnimalsReceives
>>> House Endorsement
>>>
>>> Steve, how do you see your self in a situation where some one is causing
>>> harm to your dog? If you play this out in your mind, how do things go--
>>> how
>>> do they work out and what is your role?
>>>
>>> Lisa and Bernie
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: "Steven Johnson" <blinddog3 at charter.net>
>>> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'"
>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2011 3:38 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] PA Evans'Bill to Help Protect Service 
>>> AnimalsReceives
>>> House Endorsement
>>>
>>>
>>>> Lynn, help me understand this...
>>>> If your dog is under attack, who is really going to think about 
>>>> shooting
>>>> a
>>>> snapshot and keying on a sound of where an owner might be?  Think about
>>>> how
>>>> frantic one would be...taking a picture is the last thing I would even
>>>> think
>>>> of, and isn't the average person going to be focusing on their dog and 
>>>> if
>>>> they were or were not hurt?  I find this just a little off.
>>>> Just my opinion, and if you can explain as to how this is really
>>>> effective
>>>> that would be great.
>>>>
>>>> Thanks,
>>>>
>>>> Steve
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>>> Behalf
>>>> Of Lyn Gwizdak
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, March 09, 2011 4:59 PM
>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] PA Evans'Bill to Help Protect Service Animals
>>>> Receives
>>>> House Endorsement
>>>>
>>>> Lisa,
>>>> Passle's advice is great aboout the picture taking.  Aim the camera at
>>>> the
>>>> sound. I do this with my video camera or still camera if I can't quite
>>>> see
>>>> what I'm taking and it works.
>>>>
>>>> Lyn and Landon
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> From: "Passle Helminski" <passle at roadrunner.com>
>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 08, 2011 8:14 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] PA Evans'Bill to Help Protect Service Animals
>>>> Receives
>>>> House Endorsement
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Lisa,
>>>>>
>>>>> I just hope that I am getting them in my shot.  Focus on the sound and
>>>>> try
>>>>
>>>>> to take a photo.
>>>>>
>>>>> Passle
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>Passle, thanks for the idea. My next question is how do you know 
>>>>>>you're
>>>>>>taking a photo of the offending person. I have photo capability on my
>>>>>>not
>>>>>>sophisticated cell phone. However,even though I can take a photo, I
>>>>>>can't
>>>>>>see what I'm aiming at. Any ideas?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>Lisa and Bernie
>>>>>>----- Original Message ----- From: "Passle Helminski"
>>>>>><passle at roadrunner.com>
>>>>>>To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>>>>>><nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>Sent: Tuesday, March 08, 2011 7:06 PM
>>>>>>Subject: Re: [nagdu] PA Evans'Bill to Help Protect Service Animals
>>>>>>Receives House Endorsement
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Hello Lisa,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>My guide was attacked 6 times. I carry  a cell phone that I can try 
>>>>>>>to
>>>>>>>take a photo of the attacking dog.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>Passle
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Please tell me how you deal with identifying the offending dog 
>>>>>>>>owner.
>>>>>>>>During the past 15 or so years I've had my  guide dog (first one)
>>>>>>>>attacked twice. No one stepped forward to give a description to the
>>>>>>>>police. They told me there was nothing they could do without a
>>>>>>>>description of the offending dog owner.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>Lisa and Bernie
>>>>>>>
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>>> .
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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