[nagdu] audible steet lights and O&M

Fri Nov 4 15:25:48 UTC 2011

Agreed. I don't mind having an added cue to what's going on in all the 
city sound I may be listening to before I decide to cross the street. 
But it is one cue out of many. I've decided to make it a low priority 
cue at that. My primary cue is still the sound of traffic; second the 
sound of other pedestrians crossing. Even then, those are cues and don't 
make my decision for me. If I'm unsure, I will just hang back near the 
curb and listen for patterns in movement so that I can better judge when 
it is safe for us to cross. Even if I'm with a sighted companion, I will 
always be sure *I* am satisfied and then that Mitzi is satisfied before 
we step off the curb into the street. It's all pretty automatic by now, 
and I can judge the sounds more quickly than I could at first, when I 
would  end up listening to traffic cycle two or three times before I 
figured it out. /lol/

I do find that the O&M instructors hereabouts are just thrilled by those 
signals as the end all and be all of street crossings. I've heard them 
advise people to travel blocks out of the way just to cross at an 
audible signal because then the blind cane traveler can just listen to 
the signal to know when to cross the street. They don't have to listen 
to traffic or anything like that to know when to cross, just go when the 
chirping starts so you can get across the street before the light 
changes. OMG!!! Well, I told the O&M instructor who laid that one on me 
exactly how far I was going to follow that advice and why. No way, no 
how. When the chirping or cuckoo starts, I know a light has changed, and 
I factor that into my sense of the environment. And that's as far as 
that goes.Period. I think that might have gone into my file as an 
example of "failure to cooperate." Also, it was an indication that I use 
my really great vision somehow... So I just generally suck altogether... 
Needless to say, when I need to figure out a new route or how to manage 
a tricky crossing with either cane or dog, the *last* thing I am likely 
to do is to call an O&M instructor for help with that. The audible 
crossing thing may be the *worst* advice they've ever given me, but it's 
not the only bad advice, and all the personal insult and you shouldn't 
go there in the first place because you would have to cross the street 
and The Blind can't and... Never mind!

So I hear blind people telling me and each other to do that with the 
audible crossingss. "That's what my instructor told me to do!"they'll 
say cheerily, confident that they are doing things the right way. Oh, no 
way, no how!

My hair really started to stand on end over that when I started hearing 
it elsewhere. Apparently, there is a whole crop of O&M instructors out 
there being paid by our tax dollars to teach blind people how to get 
themselves killed. So then I do what you did in your message. I fight a 
rearguard action to try to get some notion of crossing safety past the 
teachings of the certified O&M instructor... Sometimes it gets through 
enough to inspire thought. Other times, it turns out that I am the one 
who needs to get an O&M instructor to teach me how to listen to those 
audible signals so I can use them to cross the street. Sigh. Ain't gonna 
happen.

 From the man (or woman?) on the street, I have gotten to hear how 
wonderful it is they have those audible signals so that my dog can know 
when to cross the street, since everyone knows dogs are color blind and 
can't see the colors of the traffic lights. Oh, goody! I was getting so 
tired of back when nobody could figure out how my guide dog knew when to 
cross the street because dogs are color blind. So I still miss safe 
crossing opportunities because I am standing there at the curb 
attempting to educate about how street crossing with a guide dog really 
works. Then the person I'm patiently explaining to as simply as I can 
sees the light change and leaps into the crosswalk trying to take me 
with them, with the result that they end up standing in the middle of 
the street in a busy instersection calling that it's safe to go and 
calling my dog. and all that... I tell them calmly that I will wait, 
while clicking and popping a reward into Mitzi's mouth for not coming 
when other people call her. I used to just turn around to express my 
adamance about not crossing the street because the person standing in 
the middle of it is telling me it's safe. However, I've discovered that 
the click and treat action, praising Mitzi specifically for doing what 
she should, gets the fool out of the middle of the street more quickly 
because they invariably throw up their hands in disgust and hustle on 
their way in a huff. Whew! Now I can stop worrying about their safety 
and just hope they don't get themselves killed crossing the next street. 
Good grief!

Tami

On 11/04/2011 03:25 AM, cheryl echevarria wrote:
> No offense about what I am going to say about Audible lights.
>
> Whether in NYC or out here on Long Island.
>
> I in fact had a good instructor with Helen Keller Service, but I had a better person teaching me from the NFB.
>
> Not every place we go will have audible lights or signs, and  with power outages or even them just not working.
>
> The best way is to just learn good O&M Skills.  Always stop that the corner and listen for the traffic pattern, you are sometimes going to be in a new one from time to time, so take an extra few minutes to figure it out.
>
> Some roadways even on long island are terrible to cross, not just NY City or any other big intersection.  So having chirping or other noise when there are 4 lanes of traffic to cross or just a wide road, the sound may not be heard.
>
> We had someone who was hit up in Albany that is a vendor that was leaving for work and waited for the chirping and the traffic and someone still hit him.
>
> Sighted people still get when even they do the right thing.
>
> Leading the Way in Independent Travel!
>
> Cheryl Echevarria
> http://www.echevarriatravel.com<http://www.echevarriatravel.com/>
> 631-456-5394
> reservations at echevarriatravel.com<mailto:reservations at echevarriatravel.com>
>
> For daily updates read our blog at
> http://www.echevarriatravel.wordpress.com<http://www.echevarriatravel.wordpress.com/>
>
>
>
>
>    ----- Original Message -----
>    From: t21114 at optonline.net<mailto:t21114 at optonline.net>
>    To: nagdu at nfbnet.org<mailto:nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>    Sent: Thursday, November 03, 2011 6:25 PM
>    Subject: [nagdu] audible steet lights and O&M
>
>
>    Hi Julie and Everyone,
>    I don't know how the new audible lights are in NYC but I can share how they are here in Suffolk County on Long Island. Just today I demonstrated one to a consumer and his father on the corner where my agency is.
>    When we got outside I was talking to them explaining which way we are going to walk when we get out of the parking lot. I said to the blind person where is your cane. in my bag. I said take it out and start counting your steps from the door here to where I am taking you to where the audible light is. I was glad the father said I was right the person should be using a cane and not taking the parents arm. I explained if you don't practice everyday you won't have good skills. the father complained that the person has poor direction . I said even sighted people have poor sence of direction so you can't blame blindness. This person still has some sight. they were impressed how fast I walked with Anna. The audible street lights in Suffolk make a chirping noise so you know where there is one on a corner. then you push the button , it tells you what street and cross street your on , tells you wait and then starts counting down from 17 to 0 giving you that time to cross the stree
t when its safe.
>    Marilyn and Anna
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