[nagdu] I Talked to the guy in Michigan

Wed Nov 9 00:14:01 UTC 2011

Chasity,
    He already has a lawyer to pursue this. That lawyer is the State's 
Attorney! In Michigan it is a criminal offense. BTW, feel free to give him 
my phone number and have him give me a call. It is below my signature.

Fraternally yours,
Marion Gwizdala, President
National Association of Guide Dog Users (NAGDU)
National Federation of the Blind
813-626-2789
President at NAGDU.ORG
HTTP://WWW.NAGDU.ORG

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Chasity Jackson" <chasityvanda at charter.net>
To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2011 5:46 PM
Subject: [nagdu] I Talked to the guy in Michigan


>I called the guy in Grand Rapids. He called me back. I have a friend who is 
>an advocate in New York. She has been an advocate for over 40 years. I 
>connected the two of them. She is advising him on how to legally pursue 
>this from here. Marion, he would also like to speak with you, and I will be 
>emailing you his info. He is looking for a lawyer to pursue this. Thanks.
> Chasity
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Larry D. Keeler" <lkeeler at comcast.net>
> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2011 4:26 PM
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby
>
>
>> At State Convention I met a few.  We are in the beginning stages of 
>> organizing but most of them appear to be from the Southeast and Grand 
>> Rapids is on the West.
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Marion Gwizdala" <blind411 at verizon.net>
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2011 4:24 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby
>>
>>
>>> Larry,
>>>    Do we have any guide dog users on that side of the Wolverine State?
>>>
>>> Marion
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: "Larry D. Keeler" <lkeeler at comcast.net>
>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2011 3:56 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby
>>>
>>>
>>>> Its on the other side of the state from me or I would!
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> From: "Marion Gwizdala" <blind411 at verizon.net>
>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users" 
>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2011 2:35 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>I would like to see a NAGDU member go to this restaurant and file a 
>>>>>criminal complaint aginst the manager. Violation of Michigan's access 
>>>>>law is a second degree misdemeanor.
>>>>>
>>>>> Fraternally yours,
>>>>> Marion
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>> From: "Dan Weiner" <dcwein at dcwein.cnc.net>
>>>>> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog 
>>>>> Users'" <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2011 10:50 AM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>I would like to see that restaurant go out of business.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Dan
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
>>>>>> Behalf
>>>>>> Of Ginger Kutsch
>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, November 08, 2011 10:42 AM
>>>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>>>>> Subject: [nagdu] Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Restaurant ordered service dog to lobby
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Frank Eckl goes everywhere with Spruce
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Published : Monday, 07 Nov 2011,
>>>>>>
>>>>>> By Leon Hendrix
>>>>>>
>>>>>> CASCADE TOWNSHIP, Mich. (WOOD) - Frank Eckl and his family --  
>>>>>> including his
>>>>>> service dog -- went to dinner Saturday night at Don Julio's 
>>>>>> restaurant in
>>>>>> Cascade Township. But the manager said the dog had to stay in the 
>>>>>> lobby.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Eckl told 24 Hour News 8 he takes the dog with him wherever he goes. 
>>>>>> He uses
>>>>>> the dog because of a disability he has that causes occasional 
>>>>>> seizures. When
>>>>>> he's alone, it's his service dog Spruce that calls for help and helps 
>>>>>> him
>>>>>> get up if he's fallen to the ground.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> He said he's never had a problem bringing Spruce with him since the 
>>>>>> law
>>>>>> allows it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But the manager at Don Julio's wouldn't allow the dog in the dining 
>>>>>> area.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "She [the manager] said we were more than welcome to stay, but 
>>>>>> patrons in
>>>>>> the restaurant and the manager didn't want dog hair in the 
>>>>>> restaurant," he
>>>>>> said. "I was shocked that we were asked to have the dog leave and we 
>>>>>> could
>>>>>> stay."
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The manager-on-duty admitted they insisted the dog stay in the 
>>>>>> entrance way
>>>>>> to the restaurant, and that she would make the same request it again. 
>>>>>> She
>>>>>> said patrons at the restaurant complained about the dog and that some 
>>>>>> opted
>>>>>> to leave because of sanitation concerns.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "I asked for him to bring the dog out to the main entrance to the 
>>>>>> lobby,"
>>>>>> the manager said. She refused to provide her name to 24 Hour News 8. 
>>>>>> "I
>>>>>> didn't ask for him to take his dog back home, to take his dog to the 
>>>>>> car or
>>>>>> leave him outside in the middle of the parking lot at all."
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Eckl and his family simply left the restaurant and went to the IHOP
>>>>>> restaurant next door, where they were welcomed with Spruce.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Others that use service dogs have been asked to comply by the same 
>>>>>> rules
>>>>>> without complaint, the manager at Don Julio's said.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "I can't keep every customer happy," she said, adding that she was 
>>>>>> aware
>>>>>> that Spruce was a service dog but didn't realize it was Eckl who used 
>>>>>> him.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "I knew it was not for him. He didn't tell me the service dog was for 
>>>>>> him...
>>>>>> He wasn't clear to me either."
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Jocelyn Dettloff, a representative for the Disability Advocates of 
>>>>>> Kent
>>>>>> County, said the violation is more serious than unhappy customers.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "That's insane!" Dettloff said. "I mean, who would say that you have 
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> leave your cane or your mobility device at the door. People who rely 
>>>>>> on
>>>>>> service animals -- it's the exact same thing."
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> But Dettloff says there is a problem with the laws prohibiting
>>>>>> discrimination against the disabled because they are rarely enforced. 
>>>>>> The
>>>>>> most someone like Eckl can do, she said, is file a complaint that 
>>>>>> could take
>>>>>> more than a year to get attention. Even then, she said, there is no
>>>>>> punishment for establishments that break the law.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Eckl could file a civil lawsuit as well, Dettloff said, but he would 
>>>>>> not
>>>>>> likely be awarded damages.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "The law definitely needs some sort of stricter enforcement," she 
>>>>>> said.
>>>>>> "There is no strict enforcement like the health department or the 
>>>>>> fire
>>>>>> department."
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Eckl says he isn't seeking monetary damages and doesn't really want 
>>>>>> anything
>>>>>> from Don Julio's, other than an apology and training for its staff.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "I'm not out for malice here," he said, adding that he wouldn't go 
>>>>>> back to
>>>>>> the establishment again.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The manager at Don Julio's said she stands by her actions and would 
>>>>>> do the
>>>>>> same thing again if Eckl returned.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> "I have to," she said. "I can't have any kind of animal be around 
>>>>>> food. It's
>>>>>> kinda hard having most of my customers leave out on me because of one
>>>>>> customer."
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -- 
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Eckl wrote a letter about his experience and sent it to area media 
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> groups that advocate for the disabled:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> To whom it may concern,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This past Saturday, November 4th, 2011, at 6pm, my family and I 
>>>>>> wanted to
>>>>>> eat at you establishment. This included my wife Karen, and my 
>>>>>> daughter Lydia
>>>>>> (who happens to have Special Needs.) My Service Dog, Spruce, was with 
>>>>>> me.
>>>>>> Spruce was wearing her jacket that displays "SERVICE DOG." I have her 
>>>>>> for
>>>>>> medical needs and she regularly assists me in my daily life.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> We entered your restaurant, were seated in the back where no one else 
>>>>>> was
>>>>>> seated. The gentleman that seated us even turned on lights for us. We 
>>>>>> were
>>>>>> given menus and served water. It was at this time that a waitress 
>>>>>> addressed
>>>>>> us and stated: "You can stay but your dog must wait outside." I 
>>>>>> explained
>>>>>> the public law which states that I can have my Service Dog with me. 
>>>>>> We were
>>>>>> then told that the manager had complaints about "dog hair" and that a 
>>>>>> dog
>>>>>> was disruptive to the other patrons. When I said that Spruce stays 
>>>>>> and helps
>>>>>> me, we were asked to take Spruce out. We then left. Upon calling
>>>>>> authorities, the police stated this was a "civil matter" and to seek
>>>>>> council.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am an Honorably Discharged (10 yr) USAF veteran, who served his 
>>>>>> country in
>>>>>> both war and peace-time. It's hard to belief that discrimination such 
>>>>>> as
>>>>>> this exists today. My disability is due to of my service. The real 
>>>>>> issue is
>>>>>> no one with a disability should be told they can't have their 
>>>>>> assistance
>>>>>> with them and then have to leave an establishment.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I find myself with the opportunity to help educate your organization 
>>>>>> with
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> the Law and others by making this incident public. I choose not to 
>>>>>> seek
>>>>>> council, but rather inform you and other organizations of this 
>>>>>> incident in
>>>>>> hopes that this type of discrimination will not take place again.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> From the ADA: Service animals are animals that are individually 
>>>>>> trained to
>>>>>> perform tasks for people with disabilities such as guiding people who 
>>>>>> are
>>>>>> blind, alerting people who are deaf, pulling wheelchairs, alerting 
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> protecting a person who is having a seizure, or performing "other" 
>>>>>> special
>>>>>> tasks. Service animals are working animals, not pets.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Under the Americans with Disabilities Act (ADA), businesses and
>>>>>> organizations that serve the public must allow people with 
>>>>>> disabilities to
>>>>>> bring their service animals into all areas of the facility where 
>>>>>> customers
>>>>>> are normally allowed to go. This federal law applies to all 
>>>>>> businesses open
>>>>>> to the public, including restaurants, hotels, taxis and shuttles, 
>>>>>> grocery
>>>>>> and department stores, hospitals and medical offices, theaters, 
>>>>>> health
>>>>>> clubs, parks, and zoos.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Michigan Statutes, 1953, Section 750.502c (last amended in 1984 by 
>>>>>> Public
>>>>>> Act 110)
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Michigan statutory law guarantees a blind person the legal right to 
>>>>>> be
>>>>>> accompanied by a dog guide in harness in all public accommodations 
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> educational institutions and on all public conveyances. The dog guide 
>>>>>> user
>>>>>> can be required to produce identification, such as the I.D. card 
>>>>>> furnished
>>>>>> by the dog guide school from which the dog was obtained.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Public accommodations include trains, buses, taxis, elevators, boats, 
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> other common carriers...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Violation: Any person who interferes with the above enumerated rights 
>>>>>> is
>>>>>> guilty of a misdemeanor and therefore punishable under Michigan 
>>>>>> law...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In acknowledgement of this letter, I ask only for a formal apology 
>>>>>> and for
>>>>>> you to conduct training with your staff on the Laws concerning 
>>>>>> customers
>>>>>> with Service Dogs. This is the only compensation I wish to ask of 
>>>>>> you. This
>>>>>> incident was embarrassing and offensive. I would hope that anyone 
>>>>>> with a
>>>>>> disability who chooses to dine at Don Julio's would never encounter 
>>>>>> this
>>>>>> intolerance.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Frank J. Eckl
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Comment Privately
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Comment to 24 Hour News 8
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>> publicly?
>>>>>> Email us here.
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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>>>>>> dog-to-lobby
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>>>>>> nagdu:
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>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
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>>>>>> nagdu:
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
>>>>> nagdu:
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/lkeeler%40comcast.net
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>
>>>
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>
>
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