[nagdu] Driver's License & state I.D.

Mon Apr 9 17:30:23 UTC 2012

What do you do when they deny you the rental of a car? I have had this
happen to me in Michigan. My husband has the license and it is valid.
I have the credit card in my name. This is serious. I have also had
friends say they were denied a car rental for this reason. I also have
a State ID that is valid. Thanks so much.

Sharonda

On 4/9/12, Larry D. Keeler <lkeeler at comcast.net> wrote:
> Thats good to know.  So, if I have a driver I can legally rent a car under
> my own name?
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Marion Gwizdala" <blind411 at verizon.net>
> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Monday, April 09, 2012 11:06 AM
> Subject: [nagdu] Driver's License & state I.D.
>
>
>> Dear All,
>>    Do you all know that a car rental agency cannot refuse to rent you a
>> vehicle just because you do not have a valid driver's license? In a case
>> involving Ed Eames, the Department of Justice negotiated a settlement
>> agreement requiring vehicle rental agencies to rent blind people vehicles
>> if they meet the other requirements for renting a vehicle, e.g. valid
>> identification and a credit card, and a licensed driver to drive the
>> vehicle. The rental agency must also waive "additional driver" fees for
>> the first qualified driver.
>>    I was denied the rental of a stump grinder from a tool rental company
>> because I did not have a valid driver's license. I didn't know I needed a
>> driver's license to grind a stump! I was also denied the right to rent a
>> movie for the same reason! I wonder if you need a valid driver's license
>> to drive someone crazy! (grin)
>>
>> Fraternally yours,
>> Marion Gwizdala
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Larry D. Keeler" <lkeeler at comcast.net>
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Monday, April 02, 2012 11:27 AM
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Discrimination is Still Discrimination
>>
>>
>>>I was denied a fishing license because it wasn't a drivers license.
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>> From: "Marion Gwizdala" <blind411 at verizon.net>
>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Monday, April 02, 2012 6:49 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Discrimination is Still Discrimination
>>>
>>>
>>>> Rebecca,
>>>>    With all due respect, such a some-all fallacy is fundamentally
>>>> incorrect. Everyone does not know that a state-issued photo
>>>> identification is as valid as a driver's license. We have had many cases
>>>>
>>>> in which an individual was denied the right to purchase or rent items
>>>> because the company policy stated they must present a valid driver's
>>>> license. In any case, the point of my example is that discrimination of
>>>> any type, including the presentation of documentation that a service
>>>> animal is legitimate, is best resisted. If we allow it to happen once,
>>>> we allow it to happen often.
>>>>
>>>> Fraternally yours,
>>>> Marion Gwizdala
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Pickrell, Rebecca M (TASC)" <REBECCA.PICKRELL at tasc.com>
>>>> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'"
>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2012 2:17 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Discrimination is Still Discrimination
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Everybody knows a state issued id is legal.  The cashier can say
>>>>> whatever they want, the manager wouldn't.  State issued id's are quite
>>>>> common. Guide dogs really aren't.
>>>>> My other solution would be to tell the cashier that I offered to pay,
>>>>> had the means to pay and if wasn't going to be accepted, then my items
>>>>> are a gift.
>>>>>
>>>>> I had something like this happen at a fast food place when the cashier
>>>>> claimed she couldn't give me change. I told her that was fine, she
>>>>> could make me a gift of the food.
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>>>> Behalf Of Marion Gwizdala
>>>>> Sent: Thursday, March 29, 2012 7:57 AM
>>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>>>> Subject: [nagdu] Discrimination is Still Discrimination
>>>>>
>>>>> Rebecca,
>>>>>    First of all, let me state categorically, that the requirement to
>>>>> produce documentation as a precondition to access is not "NFB
>>>>> guidance";
>>>>> rather, it is the guidance of the United States Department of Justice.
>>>>> Let's
>>>>> say that you are done with your shopping and you are paying for your
>>>>> diapers
>>>>> and formula with your credit card. The cashier asks you for
>>>>> identification
>>>>> to ensure that you are truly the cardholder. You present your state
>>>>> issued
>>>>> photo identification and the cashier says it is not acceptable because
>>>>> the
>>>>> company's policy clearly states that you must present a driver's
>>>>> license.
>>>>> This, too, is a violation of the ADA. Where do you stop accepting
>>>>> discriminatory behavior and stand up for your civil rights?
>>>>>
>>>>> Fraternally yours,
>>>>> Marion
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Pickrell, Rebecca M (TASC)" <REBECCA.PICKRELL at tasc.com>
>>>>> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'"
>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2012 10:07 AM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Advance Notification
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>I understand what everybody is saying. And, I agree with it.
>>>>>> Here is my question.  I go to Costco because I need or want something.
>>>>>> Let's assume it's a need. One of the things Costco sells is diapers
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> formula. They sell them cheaply and of course they sell in bulk.  So,
>>>>>> let's say I need diapers and formula (and believe me that stuff is
>>>>>> expensive at say Giant or Safeway).  I go to Costco and somebody wants
>>>>>>
>>>>>> me
>>>>>> to show ID.  I normally need to have someone drive me to Costco,
>>>>>> partly
>>>>>> because it isn't walkable, and partly because once I buy what I need,
>>>>>> I
>>>>>> have to haul all that stuff home.  So, I've gone to a bit of trouble
>>>>>> and
>>>>>> usually expense to make this trip happen which is fine, but does mean
>>>>>> that
>>>>>> I really do intend to walk out with my intended purchases.  So, the
>>>>>> store
>>>>>> asks for ID, and I call the police. If they decide they don't care (I
>>>>>> did
>>>>>> have this happen once) what exactly will my NFB state president do?
>>>>>> Fine
>>>>>> that he or she can resolve the issue in time, but I'm here now, I need
>>>>>>
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> buy what I need to buy, and ona higher level, while I
>>>>>> care about the next person, I also need to think of myself.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Using my example, why should I follow NFB's guidelines when the only
>>>>>> bennifit is the greater good?
>>>>>> Why do I need to be a test case for this?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Why isn't NFB making what Costco is doing a criminal offense, or
>>>>>> pushing
>>>>>> so that if somebody does ask for ID, they risk loosing their job.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Not everybody can or wants to be a precident setter.  For me, this is
>>>>>> more
>>>>>> practical then emotional, we only have one Costco, it's close to my
>>>>>> house,
>>>>>> and I shop there because they have stuff I need and or want at prices
>>>>>> I
>>>>>> like. Suggesting that I can just shop elsewhere while this gets
>>>>>> resolved
>>>>>> isn't practical
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Telling me what I should do when you (and I don't mean the below
>>>>>> poster)
>>>>>> won't be there to assist on a practical and real time level does me no
>>>>>> good at all.
>>>>>> I could argue that NFB has the resources both legally and person-wise
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> fix this issue without the expectation that I should screw up both my
>>>>>> short term and long-term plans as well as my pocketbook.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Anybody else have the same issue with NFB's direction?
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>>>>>> Behalf
>>>>>> Of cheryl echevarria
>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, March 27, 2012 9:27 AM
>>>>>> To: nagdu
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Advance Notification
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I am in agreement with what President Gwizdala has said, being in
>>>>>> situations recently where the places such as costco has asked for
>>>>>> paper
>>>>>> work or id card was just wrong, but the fact that people in the area
>>>>>> are
>>>>>> doing it, whether they are bullied into it or not shouldn't make a
>>>>>> difference.
>>>>>> You need to think of the next person that comes after you, you are
>>>>>> setting
>>>>>> the example, be correct, be polite, but most of all, know what you are
>>>>>> talking about, if the stores are doing the or location, just call the
>>>>>> police, if that doesn't work, call one of us either your state
>>>>>> president
>>>>>> of your local chapter of NAGDU, or President Gwizdala.
>>>>>> Cheryl Echevarria, PresidentTravel and TourismNational Federation of
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> Blind
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Leading the Way in Independent Travel!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Cheryl Echevarria
>>>>>> http://www.echevarriatravel.com
>>>>>> 631-456-5394
>>>>>> reservations at echevarriatravel.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>> For daily updates read our blog at
>>>>>> http://www.echevarriatravel.wordpress.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> From: blind411 at verizon.net
>>>>>>> To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> Date: Tue, 27 Mar 2012 08:09:15 -0400
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Advance Notification
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Natalie,
>>>>>>>     NAGDU is working diligently to provide accurate information about
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> rights and responsibilities of service dog users and the
>>>>>>> accommodations
>>>>>>> we
>>>>>>> patronize. For now, I think the "best answer" is to encourage all
>>>>>>> service
>>>>>>> dog users to follow the same protocol so as to not create confusion.
>>>>>>> I am
>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>> the opinion that, since the presence of a service dog is irrelevant
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>> access and the services provided, service dogs are best served by not
>>>>>>> giving
>>>>>>> advance notice nor producing documentation of training. Such a
>>>>>>> practice
>>>>>>> sends the message that this is the norm and should be expected. I
>>>>>>> have
>>>>>>> had
>>>>>>> hotels, restaurants, and other places of public accommodations tell
>>>>>>> me
>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>> someone else called in advance and/or produced identification, why
>>>>>>> not
>>>>>>> me?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Fraternally yours,
>>>>>>> Marion
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>> From: "Natalie" <nrorrell at qwest.net>
>>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, March 26, 2012 9:48 PM
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Advance Notification
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> >I know what you're saying, Marion.  I wish I had an easy answer for
>>>>>>> >this.
>>>>>>> >I think the best thing to do is to push for more training of these
>>>>>>> >companies. Of course, people should not have to tell if they are
>>>>>>> >gay,
>>>>>>> >black, Muslim, whatever.  I wish I had an easy answer.
>>>>>>> > Best,
>>>>>>> > Nat and Liam Joshua
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>> > From: "Marion Gwizdala" <blind411 at verizon.net>
>>>>>>> > To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog
>>>>>>> > Users"
>>>>>>> > <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> > Sent: Friday, March 23, 2012 5:54 AM
>>>>>>> > Subject: [nagdu] Advance Notification
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> >> Natalie,
>>>>>>> >>    In this message, you say that you tell them you will be
>>>>>>> >> accompanied
>>>>>>> >> by
>>>>>>> >> a guide dog because you don't want any surprises. What I think is
>>>>>>> >> the
>>>>>>> >> biggest surprise is that taxi companies do not adequately train
>>>>>>> >> their
>>>>>>> >> employees on the civil rights provisions of the ADA. Just as it is
>>>>>>> >> illegal to discriminate against us by reason of our disability, it
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >> is
>>>>>>> >> another's civil right to not be discriminated against because of
>>>>>>> >> other
>>>>>>> >> characteristics. Should someone call a taxi company and tell them
>>>>>>> >> they
>>>>>>> >> are African American, Muslim, or gay? Why or why not? What if
>>>>>>> >> someone
>>>>>>> >> contends they are afraid of black people or that their religion
>>>>>>> >> forbids
>>>>>>> >> them from being in the presence of homosexuals? Should they be
>>>>>>> >> allowed
>>>>>>> >> to
>>>>>>> >> refuse service to them based upon these irrational concerns or
>>>>>>> >> should
>>>>>>> >> they be required to abide by the law?
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >> Fraternally yours,
>>>>>>> >> Marion Gwizdala
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>> >> From: "Natalie" <nrorrell at qwest.net>
>>>>>>> >> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog
>>>>>>> >> Users"
>>>>>>> >> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> >> Sent: Thursday, March 22, 2012 7:22 PM
>>>>>>> >> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Taxi Refusal
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >>> Hi Cindy, et al,
>>>>>>> >>> I've had it go both ways.  Usually, I do tell them I have the dog
>>>>>>> >>> when I
>>>>>>> >>> make my call, because, like Nicole, I'd prefer there to be no
>>>>>>> >>> surprises.
>>>>>>> >>> However, I've had delays and minor challenges happen whether I
>>>>>>> >>> prewarn
>>>>>>> >>> of the dog or not.  Just depends on the time of day, who's on
>>>>>>> >>> staff,
>>>>>>> >>> and
>>>>>>> >>> probably God knows what else.
>>>>>>> >>> Best,
>>>>>>> >>> Nat and Liam Joshua
>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>> >>> From: "Cindy Ray" <cindyray at gmail.com>
>>>>>>> >>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog
>>>>>>> >>> Users"
>>>>>>> >>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> >>> Sent: Monday, March 19, 2012 6:49 PM
>>>>>>> >>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Taxi Refusal
>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>>>I don't understand why you do this when you have the lawful right
>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>> >>>>to
>>>>>>> >>>>take the dog with you, and I think I did explain, or tried to. I
>>>>>>> >>>>don't
>>>>>>> >>>>mean for you to need to be so defensive about it. I mean, at this
>>>>>>> >>>>point,
>>>>>>> >>>>I expect that the fact I have my dog with me is likely in the cab
>>>>>>> >>>>company's computer, too, because I've taken him. I actually
>>>>>>> >>>>hadn't
>>>>>>> >>>>thought of that angle before. I won't be asking though because it
>>>>>>> >>>>might
>>>>>>> >>>>give them ideas that they wouldn't have had otherwise. Here, of
>>>>>>> >>>>course,
>>>>>>> >>>>we are small enough and we ride enough that they would know that
>>>>>>> >>>>the
>>>>>>> >>>>dog
>>>>>>> >>>>is with me. Probably they would with you as well. But when you
>>>>>>> >>>>tell
>>>>>>> >>>>them
>>>>>>> >>>>you have a dog, then it lets cab drivers opt out of driving you.
>>>>>>> >>>>That's
>>>>>>> >>>>all I was saying about it.
>>>>>>> >>>> Cindy
>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>> >>>>
>>>>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> >>>> nagdu mailing list
>>>>>>> >>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>>> >>>> info
>>>>>>> >>>> for
>>>>>>> >>>> nagdu:
>>>>>>> >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/nrorrell%40qwest.net
>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> >>> nagdu mailing list
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>>>>>>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
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>>>>>>> >>>
>>>>>>> >>> for
>>>>>>> >>> nagdu:
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>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> >> nagdu mailing list
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>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>> > _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> > nagdu mailing list
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>> nagdu:
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>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
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>>>>>> nagdu:
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>>>>>> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This message and any attachments or files
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>>>>>> Message; (b) permanently delete and/or destroy all electronic and hard
>>>>>> copies of the Message; (c) notify us by return email; and (d) you are
>>>>>> hereby notified that any dissemination, distribution or copying of the
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>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nagdu mailing list
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>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> nagdu:
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>>>>> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This message and any attachments or files
>>>>> transmitted with it (collectively, the "Message") are intended only for
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>>>>> the addressee and may contain information that is privileged,
>>>>> proprietary and/or prohibited from disclosure by law or contract. If
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>>>>> email; and (d) you are hereby notified that any dissemination,
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>>>>>
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>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>
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>>
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>
>
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-- 
Sharonda Greenlaw
President (Phoenix Chapter)
National Federation of the Blind
-------------
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