[nagdu] Hooters Denies Access To Service Animals

[Lyn Gwizdak]

The waitresses are NOT topless.  they wear a little halter top.

I personally don't care what they do.  I just don't go there and I did 
mention some of the things Hooters has gotten in trouble with in the past.

Lyn and Landon
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Pickrell, Rebecca M (TASC)" <REBECCA.PICKRELL at tasc.com>
To: "'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'" 
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, August 06, 2012 12:11 PM
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Hooters Denies Access To Service Animals


>        Isn't the point of Hooters to be served by topless waitresses? Fine 
> if that isn't your thing, but that doesn't mean the place shouldn't be 
> patronized.
> And of course they wouldn't hire male waiters since they don't have the 
> equiptment that the clientile go to see.
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf 
> Of Lyn Gwizdak
> Sent: Monday, August 06, 2012 3:03 PM
> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Hooters Denies Access To Service Animals
>
> Wow!  What a story!
> I have never been in a Hooters although there is one in the Gaslamp 
> Quarter
> in San diego.
>
> Hooters has been in trouble for sex discrimination because they don't hire
> guys to be waiters.  they've been in trouble with feminists because of the
> sexist and skimpy outfits their waitresses must wear.  Even the name,
> HOOTERS.  that is a slang term for female breasts.   I have never had any
> desire to go into that place - they're expensive as well from what I hear
> from folks who go there.
>
> Bibi, unfortunately, your letter was WAY too ambling and most likely not
> read by whoever you sent it to.  It shouold have been written short and
> sweet with the basic facts of your encounter with that manager.  Maybe
> written when you were feeling well and calm.  You are very justified in 
> your
> feelings but busy executives don't have time to read a long and rambling
> letter.  You were denied access to the place.  You were treated very 
> rudely.
> You were threatened.  The manager's henchman broke the door as he went 
> after
> your husband.  I think the whole thing warrented a 911 call to the police
> because of the violence from the manager and the henchman - security?
>
> Unfortunately for you and other non-blind disabled people, the "fakers" 
> have
> ruined it for you.  I have seen so many of these so-called "service dogs"
> being brought into public that have no business being out in public.  the
> dogs have not received any training at all and no socialization to human
> environments.  this is a real problem for all of us who use dogs for
> disabilities.  It is really hard for those of you who have hidden
> disabilities for which a dog is trained to help you.  It is very 
> unfortunate
> that people decide to bring their untrained pets.  These problems have
> caused the DOJ to revamp the ADA regs in regards to service animals.  I am
> sorry you have to be caught up in this backlash from uneducated business
> owners.  These folks have no idea that they, too have rights and can 
> expell
> anyone who has a dog that is causing troouble with out-of-control 
> behavior.
> I have experienced this myself and have educated the person to their 
> rights
> and how we have responsibilities along with our rights to bring our dogs
> into places.
>
> People have no idea about hidden disabilities but barely understand the
> disabilities that they can see - like blindness and people in wheelchairs.
> However, no business should tolerate rude personnel.  that harms their
> business' reputation and that in turn harms the business itself.
>
> Let us know what happens.
>
> Lyn and Landon
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Criminal Justice Major" <orleans24 at comcast.net>
> To: <Undisclosed-Recipient:;>
> Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 4:28 PM
> Subject: [nagdu] Hooters Denies Access To Service Animals
>
>
>> WARNING...
>> Be aware that the posting I'm putting on the list is intensed, so if you
>> aren't able to handle reading it, feel free to delete.
>> After reading this, I feel like I'm going to violently throw up upon the
>> feeling that I get when I know I'm going to have a seizure.
>> The left hand side of my head is throbbing and it probably looks as if 
>> I'm
>> angry.
>> I thought I had some anger management issues, but I think the manager of
>> this place seriously has problems and definitely needs to be arrested for
>> not only violating the ADA but penal codes in California all together.
>> I plan on sending this to the attorney general's office undet the US
>> Department of Justice.
>> I do hope I can find an email link on the ADA.Gov's web site as well.
>> Definitely gives me flashback of how Greyhound treated Odie and I badly
>> four years ago.
>> Bibi, husband Dale and son Odie
>> Sent: Saturday, August 04, 2012 4:53 AM
>> Subject: Hooters Denies Access To Service Animals
>> website
>> dogheirs.com
>> Encounter was between Beverly (Person with a
>> disability) and Keesmo (Hooter's Employee).
>> Hooters Denies Access To Service Animals
>> <http://www.dogheirs.com/bevykona/posts/1564-hoote
>> rs-denies-access-to-service-animals>
>> http://www.dogheirs.com/bevykona/posts/1564-hooter
>> s-denies-access-to-service-animals
>> THIS IS THE LETTER I SENT TO HOOTERS. IT WILL EXPLAIN WHAT THEY DID TO ME
>> JUNE 23, 2012. BOYCOTT HOOTERS!
>> HOOTERS,
>> 3541 Truxel Rd,
>> Sacramento, CA 95834
>> 916-929-9464
>> MGR name: Keesmo
>> This is Beverly, the person with disability (PWD)
>> who experienced the appalling incident with "Keesmo" at your truxel
>> location. started raising his voice saying NEED YOUR PAPERS.
>> Of course, since this isn't nazi germany, I had no idea to what he was
>> referring. So I asked him.. "pardon
>> me?" he then raised his voice more and appeared to be angry and said "I
>> NEED TO SEE YOUR PAPERS FOR YOUR DOG".
>> I said, "I don't have to show you any papers and it's against the law to
>> ask."
>> He then proceeded to tell me that anyone can put a vest on a dog and
>> accuse me of being fraudulent with my service dog.
>> Let me tell you something. I have had this dog for 5 years. He has saved
>> my life time after time and I do NOT have to explain ANYTHING to your
>> company nor your employee. PERIOD. I told him that I volunteer as a
>> service dog advocate in my county
>> and gave him a card with the ADA service dog laws and their 800 number 
>> and
>> he wadded it up and THREW iT! Really? THIS is who you want representing
>> your company? Because I have a phone call in to several local tv stations
>> who are interested in covering this ridiculous behavior. The only way to
>> stop it, is to expose the violators of my civil rights. And, since mr.
>> Keesmo liked to brag to me how he NEVER lets service dogs in because
>> people don't have "their papers", I realize that this is NOT the first
>> incident at this store And I am led to believe any if not all of your
>> stores, as well.
>> This man is a bigot. He is prejudiced against PWDs and is only too happy
>> to brag about it.
>> That is shameful and breaks California penal code 365.5 through 365.7 as
>> well as the federal Americans with Disabilities Act. Your first fine
>> through the DEPT OF JUSTICE will be 55,000.00 if Hooters has never been
>> cited for violating the ADA before. your second fine is 110,000.00 and so
>> on. Then there are punitive damages, bad publicity, court ordered 
>> training
>> for your staff, company wide and so on.
>> Since I tried to explain the law to him and he belittled me over and over
>> and even called attention to me and tried to get the people at the table
>> nearest the hostess stand involved, I will be filing a federal complaint.
>> I had called 911 because I was so afraid. he was so aggressive, that even
>> when my husband, who was clearly upset at being called a liar, went
>> outside, Keesmo got a large black man to come with him and then he hit
>> (Keesmo hit) the door so hard, running after my husband, that he broke 
>> the
>> security bar on your door and it hit the ground.
>> He then had the audacity to scream YOU BROKE MY DOOR, when my husband was
>> 15 feet away from the door.
>> Really? You hire ex cons or felons or simply gang members to manage your
>> stores? His bringing this large man was clearly racially motivated and
>> shows his intent to possibly harm my husband.
>> Because once he went outside, he kept sarcastically saying "You're a real
>> nice guy" to my husband, trying to goad him on.
>> I was still indoors, on the phone with the police and I couldn't hear the
>> 911 operator because Keesmo was yelling so loud.
>> seriously. This is how you train your employees? And it is HOOTERS
>> responsibility to train him properly. This is why you will be fined and
>> not him.
>> By the way. I can still have him arrested under California penal code for
>> violating my civil
>> rights under the statutes I referred to previously. They will come to his
>> work, arrest him and he will be taken before a judge and have to pay a
>> fine and possibly serve jail time.
>> The ONLY reason I didn't stay and wait for the police (you can find my
>> phone calls to 911 and the the non emergency police number on record) is
>> because I was sick. Too sick to go through this ridiculous interrogation,
>> aggression and accusations.
>> I was humiliated to the point of panic. by the time I left, I was in 
>> tears
>> and it takes a lot to make me cry.
>> a huge concern I have was his body language and gang speak. He repeatedly
>> accused me of
>> "disrespecting" him. i asked him how so? and his reply was because you
>> told me you don't have to
>> show me any papers. well......... I don't.
>> He broke the law and if he's so overly concerned with
>> being "disrespected" perhaps he should not be working with the public. He
>> repeated it over and
>> over with gang type language and then when he burst out the door with the
>> large man and was
>> screaming to my husband, "you disrespected me" i was afraid. I mean it.
>> In my head I was thinking "omg, he's going to shoot or otherwise harm my
>> husband". Especially with his "body guard" standing watch.
>> Seriously? this is how Hooters  trains its MANAGERS to act?
>> My husband asked the other man if he even knew why he was out there and 
>> he
>> said no. He seemed to be soft spoken and confused as to what was going
>> on....So the "disrespect" and possible altercation was in Keesmo's head.
>> My husband is an IT engineer for the largest medical non profit on the
>> west coast. We are not idiots nor are we gang bangers.
>> We are educated, smart and easy going. But sadly, we live in an area that
>> has a lot of gang activity, so we recognize those qualities and speech
>> patterns when we see them.
>> As a paralegal, I have seen more things than I ever wanted to in my life.
>> And since I have interviewed all kinds of
>> people, I know how to calmly get my point across, which is what I did 
>> with
>> Keesmo. He was the angry
>> one. I had an answer to each and everyone of his accusations and it
>> obviously "disrespected" him
>> and made him angry. Too bad.
>> All I did was point out the law and try to educate him on the ADA even
>> though that's your job, not mine. He wasn't having it.
>> When I went back inside to get my cane, he was trash talking us to your
>> customers, the staff and
>> so on. When he saw me he rushed back to the door to berate me some more
>> and this time he had an
>> evil little smirk on his face. He then proceeded to point to the people 
>> at
>> the table nearest me and try to bring them in on this.
>> I am disabled. It is a FEDERAL violation to draw attention to that or
>> belittle me because of it. Keesmo didn't care. All he wanted to do was
>> "win". How sad.
>> Then he proceeded to say, "Well I believe your dog is a real service dog
>> because you didn't back down." Wait. This was a contest? To see if I 
>> would
>> stick to my guns before I could be seated?
>> how appalling and insulting! Then he also bragged again about running off
>> PWD with dogs because they don't carry "their papers".
>> He admitted that maybe i was right about not needing papers to carry with
>> us but insisted that "even though the law says I don't have to, HE thinks
>> I should and so should everyone else with a service dog" "to avoid this
>> problem in the future". I have to laugh.
>> So all this hassle and me giving him the law and explaining to him how he
>> had broken it over and over meant nothing. Because in Keesmo's mind,
>> Keesmo can make up his own laws and isn't intimidated or can't be 
>> bothered
>> with the truth or actual laws.
>> And during these last moments of our conversation, when I was trying to
>> explain to him how he was opening himself up to being arrested and fined
>> and costing your company a lot of money, he rolled his eyes, smirked and
>> said he could afford it.
>> Ok then. So be it.
>> He doesn't care if you get sued or he gets arrested as long as he gets to
>> run off disabled people.
>> While I was talking, he kept screaming at me and interrupting me.
>> I finally said, look, I have 6 children and you are probably young enough
>> to be one of mine. Will you please
>> let me finish my sentence before you start talking?
>> He rolled his eyes once again and smirked. He then stated he was 36 years
>> old and knew a lot.
>> I have no idea what that had to do with anything but I let him finish his
>> arrogant rant.
>> When he was done, i said, may I speak now? so I explained to him that I
>> was actually trying to help him as well as other disabled people who may
>> try to come to Hooters with a service dog.
>> All he did was interrupt me more and say "well last week someone came in
>> and I know it wasn't a service dog...blah blahblah blah"
>> I told him "that has NOTHING to do with me and if you doubt they have a
>> service dog and that they are lying, call the police and report them."
>> There are stiff penalties for "fakers", too. And I have reported fakers
>> myself! It makes it difficult for those of us who need our dogs when
>> others lie.
>> But i digress. To interrogate me for 30 minutes, berate and belittle me,
>> try to start a fight with my husband, humiliate me in front of staff and
>> the entire restaurant and cause me to have to wait too long to eat is not
>> only in violation of many laws, but just plain inhumane.
>> Why would one human being want to treat another so poorly? Did he feel
>> like he was proving something to all those beautiful ladies? Or the
>> clientele?
>> Did it make him feel big because he humiliated me in front of all those
>> people? Does being a bully come within his job description?
>> When he told me he "believed" my dog was "real" because I stood my 
>> ground,
>> it made me want to vomit. I told him, "How many people with "real" 
>> service
>> dogs do you think you have run off, simply because they didn't want the
>> confrontation and don't even know what you are talking about when you ask
>> for "papers"? He just smirked. I don't find it remotely amusing, myself.
>> And I told him the reason i did stick to my guns was because of all those
>> other disabled people out there that have PTSD, or have been humiliated 
>> by
>> him or simply don't have the health to put up with his embarrassing
>> behaviour.
>> I reminded him that I am an advocate. I  don't even think he knows what
>> that means. I help people with access issues so how hypocritical would it
>> have been for me to simply walk away?
>> The only reason I left is because my husband saw me getting sicker and
>> sicker and made me leave.
>> I even told Keesmo, I was trying real hard not to pass out and if I did,
>> not to touch me. He didn't even offer me a glass of water. He didn't even
>> care that i was fading fast. THIS IS HOW YOU TRAIN YOUR PEOPLE? Actions
>> like what I experienced in your restaurant is why people with 
>> disabilities
>> (PWD) don't go anywhere very often. Would you?
>> If you never knew if someone would attack you at a restaurant or
>> interrogate you, would you want to go anywhere?
>> What if I was in a wheelchair (which I am many times because of an
>> illness) and he started to ask me for my papers to prove that I needed
>> that chair.
>> Like he said anyone can put a vest on a dog "anyone can sit in a
>> wheelchair".
>> My dog's vest is a service dog vest, but the law doesn't require him to
>> wear one. It's clearly
>> marked as to avoid issues such as this. It was apparently a waste of
>> money.
>> And just so you know, there are NO papers required of service dogs. I
>> suppose if you have a program trained dog, they have a little certificate
>> for you to hang on your wall, but there is no "paper" required.
>> I personally have my dog registered with my county and he has a service
>> dog tag. It cost me 55.00 and is not required on any level.
>> My dog has to be licensed just like a pet. But service animals are NOT
>> pets. I don't have to pay a deposit when I rent a place to live, he flies
>> with me free of charge, the airlines have to seat me in bulkhead to
>> accommodate his size, I ride trains, buses, ferries, all for free.
>> If someone kills or harms a service dog, it's a 10,000.00 fine, last time
>> I checked. So it's serious! My dog is allowed places where humans can be
>> turned away. He has federal rights that humans do not have. You can tell 
>> a
>> human to leave a business but not a service dog unless he's acting up.
>> Even if he barks in your establishment, and it's because he's warning me
>> that I am in trouble, you cannot make him leave. He must be well trained
>> and behave properly. He is. He is my lifeline.
>> So just like you wouldn't turn away a wheelchair (I hope) or someone 
>> using
>> oxygen, you cannot turn away a service animal.
>> Oh one more thing Keesmo said. he told me he's even turned away blind
>> people with fake canes. having him as an employee is going to get you
>> sued. He REALLY questions blind people as to if they are really needing
>> their white canes? And how does he know they aren't blind. Does he hold 
>> up
>> fingers and ask how  many? Why DOES HE WORK FOR YOU? When he said that to
>> me, I was speechless. honestly, I couldn't think of anything to say in
>> reply. Who does he think he is? Fake blind people.... Wow. I am in a
>> community for people with service animals and other disabled people.
>> I have already relayed my experience to them. Each of them has their own
>> community and this story will spread like wildfire.
>> I also have other newsletters and accounts and will warn PWD not to 
>> bother
>> coming too hooters as they are not PWD friendly. And for my blind
>> friends... well, i guess they will have to have a note from their
>> physician if they want to come inside.
>> I cannot explain to you how sick this makes me feel. It is a violation of
>> our civil rights and just as bad as any other hate crime. It's bigoted 
>> and
>> unacceptable.
>> I intend to do everything in my power to make sure it never happens again
>> and I would hope you would, too.
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