[nagdu] Fake service dogs provoke resentment, possible rule changes
Bunny Davidson
bunnydavidson at live.com
Sat Dec 1 00:43:58 UTC 2012
WOW! great thread everyone, thanks for sharing - and thanks for posting this article...
I concur with those who mentioned the 'nerve' of complete strangers who think they
are entitled to ask the most private things just because we use a service dog-
I have been asked by many 'what is your dog for?' , you don't look disabled, what's wrong with you?
or my favorite one; what can i do to get a vest like that for my dog?
Like Lyn said, i tell people stuff depending on where they seem to be 'coming from'.
Sometimes when a nosy Nellie asks what my disability is and what does my dog do for me,
i like to (tongue in cheek) say something like;
"I have severe PTSD and my dog will disarm me if i draw my weapon at rude people...."
that one is one of my favorite 'i'm not the person you wanna F with answers'
or sometimes if im not that feisty and i sense the person thinks they are "just making conversation"
I smile at them and say; you know what- since you seem so interested in my private medical issues
why don't you show me your personal medical files from all your doctors, once i read it i'll get back to you
with a copy of mine for you to pursue...
or the short nicer response, " Do you know how many years and people Ive dealt with those who don't have the manners to know that that kind of questioning is very inappropriate to ask a complete stranger?"
I have to say, some days i just 'wish' i could use the PTSD one on somebody just to blow off some frustration of having to figure out and struggle how to do stuff, or ask a stranger for help on something everyday-mundane that 'seems' EASY or no big deal to someone without a disability.
blessings to you all...
bunny & Sugar ray (one day at a time)
========================================
> From: linda.gwizdak at cox.net
> To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
> Date: Fri, 30 Nov 2012 12:57:35 -0800
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Fake service dogs provoke resentment, possible rule changes
>
> Hahahahahahaha! Yeah, I've gotten a variation of that one with, "How can I
> get one of those dogs?" (meaning a guide dog and not the breed of dog) I
> say, "We can poke your eyes out! Then you can go to a school and get your
> very own guide dog!" I wish I could see the look on their face - you could
> then hear the sounds of crickets with the overwhelming silence! Hahaha!
>
> Lyn and Landon
> "Education creates tolerance towards diversity."
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Buddy Brannan" <buddy at brannan.name>
> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Friday, November 30, 2012 11:25 AM
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Fake service dogs provoke resentment,possible rule
> changes
>
>
> > Yeah Lyn, you wanna talk about snarky answers? To the "I wish I could
> > bring my dog everywhere with me" people, I say, "Oh, well, that can be
> > arranged, but I'm pretty sure you won't like the arrangement." Usually,
> > people get it and shut up, but there was this one time (there's always
> > this one time, isn't there?) Anyway, there was this one time when this guy
> > didn't. He said his thing, I said my thing, then he said, "Oh, no, my
> > dog's stupid, blah blah blah", and so I said, "Oh, no. See, we could poke
> > your eyes out, and then you could have a dog just like this one." Needless
> > to say, he didn't really like that answer, but he left me alone
> > thereafter.
> > --
> > Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV - Erie, PA
> > Phone: (814) 860-3194 or 888-75-BUDDY
> >
> >
> >
> > On Nov 30, 2012, at 1:50 PM, "Lyn Gwizdak" <linda.gwizdak at cox.net> wrote:
> >
> >> Hi folks,
> >> These quotes from that article were interesting:
> >>
> >> "These people should be grateful they don't have a disability," Rappaport
> >>>> said. "Do they think we want to be disabled so we can take our dogs
> >>>> anywhere? Don't they realize we would trade our service dogs to get rid
> >>>> of
> >>>> our disabilities?"
> >>
> >>
> >> I can see where you could read thesse as people being down on having a
> >> disability but I think I know what they mean. Obviously, those of us
> >> born with a disability see it as a part of ourselves - a charactoristic -
> >> that we accept as part of ourselves. I think the writer of these quotes
> >> was meaning that we wouldn't exactly go out of our way to create a
> >> disability just so we could bring a service dog around with us.
> >>
> >> Let's face it - we live in a world that is made for the majority of
> >> people who have no disability. We have to learn how to make a good life
> >> work for us in that able-bodied world. Things like getting around,
> >> driving, reading print, signs, etc. Having a disablilty is a royal pain
> >> inn the butt but we do learn to embrace it just like we accept anything
> >> else about ourselves. It is, after all, all we know. Those who lived a
> >> good portion of their lives without a disability and then aquire one,
> >> well, many have a different view of having a disability and people's
> >> reaction to that disability. They feel a sense of loss of their old life
> >> and must learn how to deal with a new life where we have to deal with
> >> others and their incessant questions about our dogs, our disabilities and
> >> invasions of our privacy. Hey, looking on the sunny side, at least we
> >> aren't being asked about oour genitals like transsexual people have to
> >> put up with! LOL! They and we need to be aware of our personal
> >> boundaries and tell people that they are crossing that line and just say,
> >> "None of your business." But that can be said pleasantly.
> >>
> >> People are curious animals and it is annoying to have strangers go up to
> >> us at inopportune moments to ask us about our blindness or about ouor
> >> dogs. It really amazes me that people feel that they can take the
> >> liberty in asking us stuff they would never ask some other stranger.
> >> I've even heard that pregnant women even experience this when a stranger
> >> puts their hand on the belly.
> >>
> >> I think it is good if we can turn many of these times into a teaching
> >> moment and I do that but I can also be annoyed when the person chooses to
> >> say or ask stuff when it is obvious that it isn't the time or place for
> >> it - like if I'm in the middle of a conversation or doing a transaction
> >> at the bank or store.
> >>
> >> To the idiots who think we "fake" blindness, I have just one very snarky
> >> answer for them. In a nice voice with a smile, I'll say, "Oh yes, you're
> >> right. I'm actually faking blindness... (without a smile) just so I can
> >> meet an AH like you!!!" Only I say the AH out clearly. Then I walk
> >> away. I have patience to teach folks who are respectful and want to
> >> learn. This helps us in the long run. But, I don't suffer idiots very
> >> well. That is the people who don't really want to learn. After dealing
> >> with these latter folks for 61 years, well, you get to know the
> >> difference. And I respond accordingly. LOL!
> >>
> >> Lyn and Landon
> >> "Education creates tolerance towards diversity."
> >> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Cindy Ray" <cindyray at gmail.com>
> >> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
> >> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> >> Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2012 7:19 AM
> >> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Fake service dogs provoke resentment,possible rule
> >> changes
> >>
> >>
> >>> Julie, I am prety much in agreement with Tracy here. Don't you suffer
> >>> some indignities from time to time? Aren't there incredible
> >>> inconveniences that you would give anything to have if it were a perfect
> >>> world. Transportation, for instance, is an ongoing struggle for blind
> >>> guys. As Rebecca said, I'd like the perk of having it readily at my
> >>> fingertips, so to speak. No, I don't long to get sight that I've never
> >>> had because, realistically, that would have trama just as losing your
> >>> sight would, but there are things, like transportation, that I covet.
> >>> And I grow weary of the invasion of my privacy, too. What kind of dog?
> >>> How long have you had him? What's his name? What kind is he? Those are
> >>> innocent questions that are leveled at me, interrupting conversations
> >>> that I am having with others about religion, politics, friends, family,
> >>> the weather, books. And then, beyond that, the other day at the airport,
> >>> a woman asked me the reason for my blindness. Was it illness or what?
> >>> Really now, when you don't even know us, do you ask that kind of
> >>> questions? It's OK to do that if the person has a disability, though
> >>> manners would prevail if the person you encountered was "normal" and had
> >>> no disability. So, though my blindness is mostly not an issue, I would
> >>> trade it in for some kind of privacy. And the woman was just saying,
> >>> "Why would I fake a disability just so my dog could be with me." Anyhow,
> >>> nuf of me. *smile*
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> CL
> >>>
> >>> On Nov 29, 2012, at 9:06 AM, Pickrell, Rebecca M (TASC) wrote:
> >>>
> >>>> I agree with Tracy.
> >>>> I don't really want to be able to see, but I'd sure like the
> >>>> convienence of being able to see.
> >>>> I broke a Christmas dcoration yesterday and it was a pain in the butt
> >>>> figuring out first if it was broken (it sounded like it might be but I
> >>>> wasn't sure) and then cleaning it up.
> >>>> Reading print would be nice not because its print but because that's
> >>>> what most of the world uses, and they use it in real time, the ticker
> >>>> on the tv, sports scores at a game, signs that get updated quickly,
> >>>> that sort of thing.
> >>>> So yes, I do get what the woman in the article is saying.
> >>>>
> >>>> -----Original Message-----
> >>>> From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tracy
> >>>> Carcione
> >>>> Sent: Thursday, November 29, 2012 9:59 AM
> >>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
> >>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Fake service dogs provoke resentment, possible
> >>>> rule changes
> >>>>
> >>>> Julie M, I understand what you're saying. But I think I understand
> >>>> what
> >>>> the person quoted was saying, too. A friend of mine with low vision
> >>>> tells
> >>>> me that people often act as if he's just pretending to be blind, as if
> >>>> there were so many privileges given to blind guys or something.
> >>>> I'm OK with being blind, but it can be very annoying. I'm not bringing
> >>>> my
> >>>> Benny with me because he's a wonderful companion, which he is. But I'm
> >>>> bringing him to help me get where I'm going more quickly and easily,
> >>>> and
> >>>> to keep me from getting run over by some idiot who's not paying
> >>>> attention.
> >>>> And, well, I think I would give up having a guide dog, if it meant I
> >>>> could
> >>>> drive and read print as easily as sighted people can.
> >>>> Tracy
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>> It is a very good article, except...
> >>>>>
> >>>>> "These people should be grateful they don't have a disability,"
> >>>>> Rappaport
> >>>>> said. "Do they think we want to be disabled so we can take our dogs
> >>>>> anywhere? Don't they realize we would trade our service dogs to get
> >>>>> rid of
> >>>>> our disabilities?"
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I don't blame this woman for her opinion, but she does not speak for
> >>>>> the entire disability community. Using that quote like that just
> >>>>> erked me because it was right at the end of the article--the final
> >>>>> stamp, if you will. I don't want the world thinking I would trade in
> >>>>> my dog to be able to see. I'm comfortable being a person with a
> >>>>> disability and would not trade in my guide for something I've never
> >>>>> had in the first place.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Please, please don't think I'm judging her or hating... That was just
> >>>>> my reaction to the use of that quote and the generalization.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On 11/28/12, Tami Jarvis <tami at poodlemutt.com> wrote:
> >>>>>> Lyn,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Thanks for saying that so very well!
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I'll be honest. The nitpicky, legalistic, etc., etc., part of me is
> >>>>>> offended as all get out by people taking their perfect pets where my
> >>>>>> perfect (except for when she's not!) guide dog can go by law.
> >>>>>> However,
> >>>>>> realistically, where is the actual problem?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Then I look at all the offered solutions to the actual non-problem,
> >>>>>> and
> >>>>>> my hair stands on end. Each and every one of them will cause me, and
> >>>>>> not
> >>>>>> only me, a problem. If not lots of problems! Thank you, but no! /lol/
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Oh, I haven't heard the latest on the sitch over in Portland where I
> >>>>>> don't live anymore. But apparently, the solution to problems with
> >>>>>> dogs
> >>>>>> on the transit system who don't belong there is to check licenses and
> >>>>>> vaccination records. Hm... They have, apparently, caught some
> >>>>>> unlicensed/unvaccinated dogs, so yay them! The county gets more fees!
> >>>>>> Yay! I'm still scratching my head wondering what effect either has on
> >>>>>> ensuring a licensed, vaccinated pet doesn't chomp my poodle guide
> >>>>>> next
> >>>>>> time I"m over there riding a bus or train. Or that it doesn't just
> >>>>>> harass my guide so we have to get off where we don't want to be while
> >>>>>> she is so over-harassed she can't work for the next half hour. Or...
> >>>>>> I'm
> >>>>>> just saying. The transit company is certainly being *seen* to be
> >>>>>> doing
> >>>>>> something, and they are very impressed with themselves, or so it also
> >>>>>> seems. I'm just not seeing the usefulness there.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Then again, what do I know? I'm blind! /snide smirk/
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Well, I'm still feeling kinda snotty about the entire issue, since
> >>>>>> within the last year, I did have to take my dog out because of her
> >>>>>> reaction to a dog of some sort in a restaurant that appeared to be
> >>>>>> not
> >>>>>> in control... Only, once I got out and could take a deep breath, I
> >>>>>> realized that my guide dog had settled down and ceased misbehavior...
> >>>>>> The actual team member I had to remove for incipient aggression was,
> >>>>>> you
> >>>>>> know, me. /lol/ I was about to do someone, anyone, in however I
> >>>>>> could.
> >>>>>> It was that aggravating! Still, I would rather that someone who
> >>>>>> brings
> >>>>>> some small, floppy thing into a restaurant would notice that there
> >>>>>> was
> >>>>>> something doggish going on before she/he plops down nearby to chat
> >>>>>> with
> >>>>>> someone 3 feet from another dog while her party goes on to their
> >>>>>> actual
> >>>>>> table... And without noting that the dog has 4 feet of leash and is
> >>>>>> still flopping and flouncing adorably... Next to a much larger dog
> >>>>>> that
> >>>>>> has stuck its nose out from under a table and snarked at it!
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Honestly! My dog should not have shot to her feet, stuck her nose out
> >>>>>> and snarked decisively. But... If you had a 15 to 20 pound dog and a
> >>>>>> 55
> >>>>>> pound dog made noises at it, would you just, I dunno, plop down and
> >>>>>> chat
> >>>>>> without noticing anything was going on? I mean, it's like there was
> >>>>>> an
> >>>>>> Irish Wolfhound (want one!) or St. Bernard or something of uncertain
> >>>>>> temperament 3 feet from one of our guide dogs... Would you just,
> >>>>>> like,
> >>>>>> not even wonder if maybe you should move on a bit to be further away?
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Okay. So it was 2 or 3 months ago, and I am clearly just not over it.
> >>>>>> /lol/ I guess it's safe to say that I am no longer worried about the
> >>>>>> legal status of any given dog but whether or not they come
> >>>>>> accompanied
> >>>>>> by a human that is stupid enough to not notice that their dog is not
> >>>>>> following proper etiquette which causes another dog to not follow
> >>>>>> proper
> >>>>>> etiquette, however briefly, which sends that dog's handler into a
> >>>>>> tizzy
> >>>>>> so she has to leave the place to keep from biting anyone. Of course,
> >>>>>> there was the spousal unit there, in the same state of
> >>>>>> exhaustion/stress/exhaustion/stress as his female companions... He
> >>>>>> was
> >>>>>> the first one to be bitten by me! /lol/ Don't worry. He bites back,
> >>>>>> then
> >>>>>> we were over it. The guide dog was happy to jump in the truck, get
> >>>>>> home
> >>>>>> and collapse somewhere on her own away from her badly behaved,
> >>>>>> ill-tempered humans. /lol/
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Tami
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On 11/28/2012 04:31 PM, Lyn Gwizdak wrote:
> >>>>>>> Tami,
> >>>>>>> I feel the same way - I don't care what the dog is there for as long
> >>>>>>> as
> >>>>>>> it is behaving properly and not causing negative feedback to come
> >>>>>>> back
> >>>>>>> on me. If the "fakes" keep on the low-down with their well behaved
> >>>>>>> "fake" service dogs, who would be the wiser? I don't care if a well
> >>>>>>> trained and behaved pet is in a store, on the bus, in a restaurant -
> >>>>>>> just so long as it isn't creating a rukus or attacking my dog.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> So yeah, it's the behavior that irks people not the fact a person
> >>>>>>> has a
> >>>>>>> card or a vest that says "service dog". I really don't think the
> >>>>>>> public
> >>>>>>> gives a rat's behind about if a person has a disability or not and
> >>>>>>> has
> >>>>>>> a
> >>>>>>> well behaved dog on the premesis.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Just my two cents worth.
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Lyn and Landon
> >>>>>>> "Education creates tolerance towards diversity."
> >>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Tami Jarvis"
> >>>>>>> <tami at poodlemutt.com>
> >>>>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
> >>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> >>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, November 25, 2012 4:56 PM
> >>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Fake service dogs provoke resentment,possible
> >>>>>>> rule
> >>>>>>> changes
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Jenine,
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Thanks for adding that. I always try to emphasize that in my own
> >>>>>>>> attempts at educating, because it really is key. I honestly don't
> >>>>>>>> care
> >>>>>>>> if it's a real service dog or not, so long as it behaves in public
> >>>>>>>> as
> >>>>>>>> we all expect our dogs to behave. Conversely, if our real service
> >>>>>>>> dogs
> >>>>>>>> decide to misbehave, and for some reason we can't get things under
> >>>>>>>> control, it is our responsibility to take our low down scurvy curs
> >>>>>>>> out
> >>>>>>>> the nearest door as quickly as possible. Or be thrown out on our
> >>>>>>>> ears.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> That's actually the gist of my current spiel, since it seems to get
> >>>>>>>> the point across more effectively than more delicate approaches
> >>>>>>>> I've
> >>>>>>>> tried, especially if I'm speaking to a business owner or someone on
> >>>>>>>> "the other side" of the service dog equation. "Oh. That makes
> >>>>>>>> sense,"
> >>>>>>>> is a good response in my book. /smile/
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Ah, well. The debate will go on and it will be good for us. As an
> >>>>>>>> owner-trainer, I just get extra snarky sometimes because of how
> >>>>>>>> requiring me to pay a bunch o' money to get a nice piece of
> >>>>>>>> laminated
> >>>>>>>> paper will solve the problem of frauds... I can pass that off about
> >>>>>>>> 9
> >>>>>>>> times running, then just go nuts at repeat #10. On the local list
> >>>>>>>> scene, I'm kinda at #10 plus before I have a chance to get the nuts
> >>>>>>>> out of my system, so... Probably someone should check to ensure I'm
> >>>>>>>> safe to be out in public or something in case of bad behavior.
> >>>>>>>> /lol/
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Tami
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> On 11/25/2012 04:42 PM, Jenine Stanley wrote:
> >>>>>>>>> Julie is correct. The only thing this article did leave out was
> >>>>>>>>> the
> >>>>>>>>> requirement for any service animal to be under control of the
> >>>>>>>>> handler
> >>>>>>>>> at all
> >>>>>>>>> times. This means any service animal regardless of its training
> >>>>>>>>> origins.
> >>>>>>>>> It's the controlled behavior that earns us the right to have our
> >>>>>>>>> animals
> >>>>>>>>> working with us in public, not the mere presence of the animal or
> >>>>>>>>> presence
> >>>>>>>>> of task training for such an animal. That's a point that is often
> >>>>>>>>> overlooked.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Jenine Stanley
> >>>>>>>>> jeninems at wowway.com
> >>>>>>>>> http://www.twitter.com/jeninems
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
> >>>>>>>>> From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Julie
> >>>>>>>>> J.
> >>>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, November 25, 2012 7:14 PM
> >>>>>>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog
> >>>>>>>>> Users
> >>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Fake service dogs provoke resentment,
> >>>>>>>>> possible
> >>>>>>>>> rule
> >>>>>>>>> changes
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Tami,
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Definitely read the article. It's good, accurate, addresses the
> >>>>>>>>> big
> >>>>>>>>> issues,
> >>>>>>>>> mentions owner training as a viable option and explains the laws
> >>>>>>>>> correctly.
> >>>>>>>>> I was very pleasantly surprised.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Julie
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> On 11/25/2012 5:41 PM, Tami Jarvis wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>> Okay... I should read the article before commenting. But my
> >>>>>>>>>> comment
> >>>>>>>>>> is
> >>>>>>>>>> that I just can't read another of these articles right now. Our
> >>>>>>>>>> local
> >>>>>>>>>> transit company made a decision about how to deal with "the dog
> >>>>>>>>>> problem" here... I'm reading what the locals have to say about
> >>>>>>>>>> this
> >>>>>>>>>> big move...
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> When I get over being too irritable on the subject to talk about
> >>>>>>>>>> any
> >>>>>>>>>> of it without cursing, I'll come here to ask some questions or
> >>>>>>>>>> something.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Mutter, mumble, grumble... /loll/
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Tami
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> On 11/25/2012 01:31 PM, Ginger Kutsch wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>> Fake service dogs provoke resentment, possible rule changes
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> By Christine Stapleton
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Palm Beach Post Staff Writer
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Source:
> >>>>>>>>>>> http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/lifestyles/pets/fake-service-dogs-p
> >>>>>>>>>>> rovoke-
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> resentment-possible-rule/nTD9C/
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Macy and Milo, blond Labs with constantly wagging tails, look
> >>>>>>>>>>> and
> >>>>>>>>>>> goof off like the other pooches at the dog park.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Their owner, 20-year-old college student Shoshana Rappaport,
> >>>>>>>>>>> looks
> >>>>>>>>>>> like the
> >>>>>>>>>>> other doting dog moms, telling her dogs to knock it off when
> >>>>>>>>>>> they
> >>>>>>>>>>> play too
> >>>>>>>>>>> rough and smothering them with hugs when they are worn out.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> But Macy and Milo are not like the other dogs at the dog park.
> >>>>>>>>>>> When
> >>>>>>>>>>> Rappaport turns her head to the right and her neon orange
> >>>>>>>>>>> hearing
> >>>>>>>>>>> aid is
> >>>>>>>>>>> visible, it is obvious that she also is not like the other dog
> >>>>>>>>>>> moms
> >>>>>>>>>>> at the
> >>>>>>>>>>> park.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Macy and Milo are service dogs. They have been trained to alert
> >>>>>>>>>>> Rappaport,
> >>>>>>>>>>> who is profoundly deaf and also has vertigo, to vital sounds
> >>>>>>>>>>> that
> >>>>>>>>>>> many of us
> >>>>>>>>>>> take for granted - car horns, door bells or a stranger
> >>>>>>>>>>> approaching
> >>>>>>>>>>> from
> >>>>>>>>>>> behind. Shoshana also uses the dogs to support, stabilize and
> >>>>>>>>>>> right
> >>>>>>>>>>> her
> >>>>>>>>>>> during vertigo episodes.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Because of the Americans with Disabilities Act, Macy and Milo
> >>>>>>>>>>> can
> >>>>>>>>>>> go
> >>>>>>>>>>> wherever Rappaport goes - including restaurants, hotels,
> >>>>>>>>>>> taxicabs
> >>>>>>>>>>> and
> >>>>>>>>>>> theaters. Also because of the ADA, Rappaport doesn't have to
> >>>>>>>>>>> prove
> >>>>>>>>>>> she is
> >>>>>>>>>>> disabled - a provision in the law designed to protect the
> >>>>>>>>>>> privacy
> >>>>>>>>>>> of
> >>>>>>>>>>> people
> >>>>>>>>>>> with disabilities and to prevent discrimination.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> In fact, all any dog owner needs to do to be eligible for access
> >>>>>>>>>>> privileges
> >>>>>>>>>>> guaranteed under the ADA is to say that the dog is a service
> >>>>>>>>>>> dog.
> >>>>>>>>>>> And
> >>>>>>>>>>> that
> >>>>>>>>>>> has led some dog owners who do not have disabilities and whose
> >>>>>>>>>>> dogs
> >>>>>>>>>>> are not
> >>>>>>>>>>> service dogs to use the ADA as a loophole to take their pets
> >>>>>>>>>>> everywhere they
> >>>>>>>>>>> go.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> As more dogs are being trained to assist people whose
> >>>>>>>>>>> disabilities
> >>>>>>>>>>> are not
> >>>>>>>>>>> readily apparent, such as deafness, post-traumatic stress
> >>>>>>>>>>> disorder
> >>>>>>>>>>> and
> >>>>>>>>>>> diabetes, fake service dogs are seen more in public places, said
> >>>>>>>>>>> John
> >>>>>>>>>>> Ensminger, a New York attorney and author of the books "Service
> >>>>>>>>>>> Dogs in
> >>>>>>>>>>> America" and "Police and Military Dogs."
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> "I think it's definitely increasing," said Ensminger, who said
> >>>>>>>>>>> he
> >>>>>>>>>>> is
> >>>>>>>>>>> receiving more requests for interviews and more reports of fake
> >>>>>>>>>>> dogs
> >>>>>>>>>>> on his
> >>>>>>>>>>> blog, The Dog Law Reporter. Among the most recent reports, show
> >>>>>>>>>>> dogs
> >>>>>>>>>>> being
> >>>>>>>>>>> passed off as emotional support dogs, he said.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> The phenomenon can infuriate people with real disabilities who
> >>>>>>>>>>> rely
> >>>>>>>>>>> on their
> >>>>>>>>>>> highly trained dogs to lead as normal and active a life as
> >>>>>>>>>>> possible.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> "For everybody that needs a service dog, it's a slap in their
> >>>>>>>>>>> face
> >>>>>>>>>>> for
> >>>>>>>>>>> somebody to go on-line and get a service dog vest so they can go
> >>>>>>>>>>> into a
> >>>>>>>>>>> store or a restaurant with their dog," said Joe Rainey, a Marine
> >>>>>>>>>>> who was
> >>>>>>>>>>> wounded in Vietnam.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Rainey, of Greenacres, relies on his service dog, Tanker, who
> >>>>>>>>>>> has
> >>>>>>>>>>> had
> >>>>>>>>>>> mobility and stability training to assist Rainey when he is
> >>>>>>>>>>> unsteady or
> >>>>>>>>>>> cannot get up. "I am a Marine and it's like someone pretending
> >>>>>>>>>>> to
> >>>>>>>>>>> be
> >>>>>>>>>>> a
> >>>>>>>>>>> Marine who was wounded while serving their country."
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> The problem stems in part from the protections for the disabled
> >>>>>>>>>>> set
> >>>>>>>>>>> up under
> >>>>>>>>>>> ADA. Businesses can ask only two questions when a dog enters
> >>>>>>>>>>> their
> >>>>>>>>>>> establishment: Is your dog a service dog? What tasks has the dog
> >>>>>>>>>>> been
> >>>>>>>>>>> trained to perform?
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Businesses cannot require special identification for the dog or
> >>>>>>>>>>> ask
> >>>>>>>>>>> about
> >>>>>>>>>>> the person's disability. It does not matter whether the dog is
> >>>>>>>>>>> wearing a
> >>>>>>>>>>> service-dog vest or the owner's disability is visible.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> "A business person is very limited in what they can do when
> >>>>>>>>>>> someone
> >>>>>>>>>>> declares
> >>>>>>>>>>> they have a service animal," said Geoff Luebkemann, vice
> >>>>>>>>>>> president
> >>>>>>>>>>> of
> >>>>>>>>>>> the
> >>>>>>>>>>> Florida Restaurant and Lodging Association. "The average
> >>>>>>>>>>> restaurant
> >>>>>>>>>>> owner or
> >>>>>>>>>>> hotelier just isn't versed in this and they are concerned they
> >>>>>>>>>>> will
> >>>>>>>>>>> be the
> >>>>>>>>>>> subject of an ADA lawsuit."
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Other laws supersede the ADA when it comes to air travel and
> >>>>>>>>>>> housing,
> >>>>>>>>>>> but
> >>>>>>>>>>> the service-dog issue is posing special problems for airlines,
> >>>>>>>>>>> especially
> >>>>>>>>>>> those that no longer allow pets in the cargo hold.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Many passengers falsely believe that the ADA covers air travel
> >>>>>>>>>>> and
> >>>>>>>>>>> are
> >>>>>>>>>>> surprised to learn they must abide by the stricter rules of the
> >>>>>>>>>>> Air
> >>>>>>>>>>> Carrier
> >>>>>>>>>>> Access Act if they want to fly with their dog. Unlike the ADA,
> >>>>>>>>>>> the
> >>>>>>>>>>> Air
> >>>>>>>>>>> Carrier Access Act allows airlines to require passengers with
> >>>>>>>>>>> emotional
> >>>>>>>>>>> support and psychiatric service dogs to prove they are disabled
> >>>>>>>>>>> and
> >>>>>>>>>>> that
> >>>>>>>>>>> their dog is trained to assist them.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Many airlines require a letter on the letterhead of a licensed
> >>>>>>>>>>> psychiatrist,
> >>>>>>>>>>> psychologist or clinical social worker stating that the
> >>>>>>>>>>> passenger
> >>>>>>>>>>> has a
> >>>>>>>>>>> medically recognized mental or emotional disability and is under
> >>>>>>>>>>> the
> >>>>>>>>>>> professional's care. The letter must be dated within one year of
> >>>>>>>>>>> the
> >>>>>>>>>>> flight
> >>>>>>>>>>> and also include the state in which the professional is
> >>>>>>>>>>> licensed.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> "People are going to be hard pressed to get psychologists and
> >>>>>>>>>>> psychiatrists
> >>>>>>>>>>> to sign letters," Ensminger said. "I think this is an area where
> >>>>>>>>>>> we
> >>>>>>>>>>> are
> >>>>>>>>>>> going to see a lot of friction."
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Nevertheless, there are enough passengers trying to board with
> >>>>>>>>>>> emotional
> >>>>>>>>>>> support and psychiatric service dogs - which fly in the cabin
> >>>>>>>>>>> for
> >>>>>>>>>>> free -
> >>>>>>>>>>> that agents at ticket counters have been provided written
> >>>>>>>>>>> guidelines
> >>>>>>>>>>> on the
> >>>>>>>>>>> law and the U.S. Department of Transportation has opened up
> >>>>>>>>>>> rule-making for
> >>>>>>>>>>> changes in rules on allowing such dogs on planes.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Ensminger owns a therapy dog, which is trained to go to schools,
> >>>>>>>>>>> hospitals,
> >>>>>>>>>>> nursing homes and other institutions to comfort and offer
> >>>>>>>>>>> companionship.
> >>>>>>>>>>> Therapy dogs are not protected by the ADA or the Air Carriers
> >>>>>>>>>>> Act
> >>>>>>>>>>> and
> >>>>>>>>>>> although he knows he could pass her off as a service dog and fly
> >>>>>>>>>>> with
> >>>>>>>>>>> her to
> >>>>>>>>>>> his winter home in Arizona, he does not. Instead, he drives the
> >>>>>>>>>>> 2,600
> >>>>>>>>>>> miles.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> "To be honest, I've been tempted," Ensminger said. "But she is a
> >>>>>>>>>>> therapy
> >>>>>>>>>>> dog, not a service dog."
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> When it comes to allowing service animals in condos and
> >>>>>>>>>>> apartments
> >>>>>>>>>>> with
> >>>>>>>>>>> no-pet or weight-limit rules, the ADA is again trumped by
> >>>>>>>>>>> another
> >>>>>>>>>>> federal
> >>>>>>>>>>> law - the Fair Housing Act.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Unlike the ADA, which defines dogs and occasionally miniature
> >>>>>>>>>>> horses as
> >>>>>>>>>>> service animals, the FHA is broader and protects other species,
> >>>>>>>>>>> such
> >>>>>>>>>>> as cats
> >>>>>>>>>>> and birds.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Just as restaurants and airlines are seeing more unqualified
> >>>>>>>>>>> service
> >>>>>>>>>>> dogs,
> >>>>>>>>>>> landlords and condo associations say tenants are seeking
> >>>>>>>>>>> exceptions
> >>>>>>>>>>> for
> >>>>>>>>>>> their pets under the FHA.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> "The trend has gone up and down since this service dog issue
> >>>>>>>>>>> first
> >>>>>>>>>>> arose,"
> >>>>>>>>>>> said West Palm Beach attorney John Sheppard, who specializes in
> >>>>>>>>>>> condominium
> >>>>>>>>>>> and homeowner association litigation. "When it initially came
> >>>>>>>>>>> up,
> >>>>>>>>>>> there was
> >>>>>>>>>>> a fairly high standard the owner had to meet to keep the dog."
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Those standards loosened and "if they could show a doctor's
> >>>>>>>>>>> prescription
> >>>>>>>>>>> saying they needed a dog for some reason, that was enough to
> >>>>>>>>>>> pass
> >>>>>>>>>>> muster,"
> >>>>>>>>>>> Sheppard said. The pendulum is swinging back and now condominium
> >>>>>>>>>>> associations can ask specific questions about the disability and
> >>>>>>>>>>> how the
> >>>>>>>>>>> animal assists, Sheppard said.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Still, he said, "There are people who come in and have a dog and
> >>>>>>>>>>> they
> >>>>>>>>>>> say,
> >>>>>>>>>>> 'It's my sister's dog. I'm just watching it.' Then they come out
> >>>>>>>>>>> and say
> >>>>>>>>>>> they have a disability."
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Is there a solution?
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Corey Hudson, secretary of Assistance Dogs International, which
> >>>>>>>>>>> has
> >>>>>>>>>>> a
> >>>>>>>>>>> well-known accreditation program that sets minimum standards for
> >>>>>>>>>>> behavior
> >>>>>>>>>>> and training, suggests some form of government-sanctioned
> >>>>>>>>>>> certification for
> >>>>>>>>>>> service dogs.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> "We all get drivers' licenses after somebody impartially figures
> >>>>>>>>>>> out
> >>>>>>>>>>> that
> >>>>>>>>>>> you are capable of driving," Hudson said.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Ensminger sees problems with that approach. Who will set those
> >>>>>>>>>>> standards and
> >>>>>>>>>>> how much will credentials cost? Professionally trained service
> >>>>>>>>>>> dogs
> >>>>>>>>>>> can cost
> >>>>>>>>>>> more than $20,000. Each dog is individually trained to meet the
> >>>>>>>>>>> specific
> >>>>>>>>>>> needs of its owner's disabilities. Many people with disabilities
> >>>>>>>>>>> are on
> >>>>>>>>>>> limited budgets and train their dogs themselves.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> "What I'm afraid of is that if the government doesn't want to
> >>>>>>>>>>> get
> >>>>>>>>>>> in the
> >>>>>>>>>>> business and turns it over to private entities, that will mean
> >>>>>>>>>>> people
> >>>>>>>>>>> will
> >>>>>>>>>>> essentially have to pay a significant amount of money to some
> >>>>>>>>>>> organization
> >>>>>>>>>>> that will bless their service dog," Ensminger said. "I see that
> >>>>>>>>>>> as
> >>>>>>>>>>> a big
> >>>>>>>>>>> problem."
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Rappaport, who herself trained Macy and Milo, has her own
> >>>>>>>>>>> solution:
> >>>>>>>>>>> confronting pet owners and businesses when she encounters
> >>>>>>>>>>> misbehaving
> >>>>>>>>>>> dogs
> >>>>>>>>>>> wearing service dog vests.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> "These people should be grateful they don't have a disability,"
> >>>>>>>>>>> Rappaport
> >>>>>>>>>>> said. "Do they think we want to be disabled so we can take our
> >>>>>>>>>>> dogs
> >>>>>>>>>>> anywhere? Don't they realize we would trade our service dogs to
> >>>>>>>>>>> get
> >>>>>>>>>>> rid of
> >>>>>>>>>>> our disabilities?"
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> ----
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Service dog laws
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Three federal laws grant service dogs special privileges:
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Americans with Disabilities Act: Gives service dogs access to
> >>>>>>>>>>> public
> >>>>>>>>>>> places,
> >>>>>>>>>>> such as restaurants, stores and offices. Owner may not be
> >>>>>>>>>>> questioned
> >>>>>>>>>>> about
> >>>>>>>>>>> disability but may be asked about the tasks the dog performs.
> >>>>>>>>>>> Harnesses or
> >>>>>>>>>>> leashes must be worn at all times unless it interferes with the
> >>>>>>>>>>> dog's
> >>>>>>>>>>> work.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Air Carrier Act: Enables service dogs to fly in cabin of
> >>>>>>>>>>> airplane.
> >>>>>>>>>>> Passengers with emotional support or psychiatric service dogs
> >>>>>>>>>>> may
> >>>>>>>>>>> be
> >>>>>>>>>>> asked
> >>>>>>>>>>> to provide proof of disability and treatment from mental health
> >>>>>>>>>>> professional.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Fair Housing Act: Allows people with disabilities to keep
> >>>>>>>>>>> emotional-support
> >>>>>>>>>>> animals, even when landlord's or association's policy prohibits
> >>>>>>>>>>> pets.
> >>>>>>>>>>> Allows
> >>>>>>>>>>> limited questioning about disability and animal support.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Types of support animals
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Federal laws give access privileges to service dogs, including
> >>>>>>>>>>> guide and
> >>>>>>>>>>> hearing dogs. Therapy dogs and emotional support animals can be
> >>>>>>>>>>> denied
> >>>>>>>>>>> access to public places, airplanes and housing.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Guide dogs: Highly disciplined and trained service dogs. Assist
> >>>>>>>>>>> blind
> >>>>>>>>>>> and
> >>>>>>>>>>> visually impaired people by avoiding obstacles, stopping at
> >>>>>>>>>>> curbs
> >>>>>>>>>>> and
> >>>>>>>>>>> steps,
> >>>>>>>>>>> and negotiating traffic.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Hearing dogs: Service dogs trained to alert the deaf and hard of
> >>>>>>>>>>> hearing to
> >>>>>>>>>>> common sounds, such as a doorbell, telephone, baby crying or
> >>>>>>>>>>> smoke
> >>>>>>>>>>> alarm.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Service dogs: Provide assistance unrelated to vision or hearing
> >>>>>>>>>>> disabilities. Individually trained to meet unique physical,
> >>>>>>>>>>> medical
> >>>>>>>>>>> or
> >>>>>>>>>>> psychiatric needs of owner.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Therapy dogs: Provide comfort and companionship to people in
> >>>>>>>>>>> hospitals,
> >>>>>>>>>>> nursing homes and other institutions. To encourage petting and
> >>>>>>>>>>> avoid
> >>>>>>>>>>> confusion with service dogs, often do not wear vests seen on
> >>>>>>>>>>> service
> >>>>>>>>>>> dogs.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Emotional support animal: Domesticated animals - not necessarily
> >>>>>>>>>>> dogs
> >>>>>>>>>>> - that
> >>>>>>>>>>> provide therapeutic companionship and affection. No training
> >>>>>>>>>>> required
> >>>>>>>>>>> beyond
> >>>>>>>>>>> that of a pet.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
> >>>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> >>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> >>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
> >>>>>>>>>>> info
> >>>>>>>>>>> for
> >>>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
> >>>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tami%40poodlemutt.com
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
> >>>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> >>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> >>>>>>>>>> for
> >>>>>>>>>> nagdu:
> >>>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/julielj%40neb.rr.com
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> -----
> >>>>>>>>>> No virus found in this message.
> >>>>>>>>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> >>>>>>>>>> Version: 2012.0.2221 / Virus Database: 2629/5418 - Release Date:
> >>>>>>>>>> 11/25/12
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
> >>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> >>>>>>>>> for
> >>>>>>>>> nagdu:
> >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jeninems%40wowway.com
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
> >>>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> >>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> >>>>>>>>> for
> >>>>>>>>> nagdu:
> >>>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tami%40poodlemutt.com
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
> >>>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> >>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> >>>>>>>> for
> >>>>>>>> nagdu:
> >>>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/linda.gwizdak%40cox.net
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>>>> nagdu mailing list
> >>>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> >>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> >>>>>>> for
> >>>>>>> nagdu:
> >>>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/tami%40poodlemutt.com
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>>> nagdu mailing list
> >>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> >>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> >>>>>> nagdu:
> >>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/kaybaycar%40gmail.com
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> --
> >>>>> Julie McG
> >>>>> Lindbergh High School class of 2009, National Federation of the Blind
> >>>>> of Missouri recording secretary,
> >>>>> Missouri Association of Guide dog Users President,
> >>>>> and proud graduate of Guiding Eyes for the Blind
> >>>>>
> >>>>> "For God so loved the world that he gave his only Son, so that
> >>>>> everyone who believes in him may not perish but may have eternal
> >>>>> life."
> >>>>> John 3:16
> >>>>>
> >>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>> nagdu mailing list
> >>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> >>>>> nagdu:
> >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/carcione%40access.net
> >>>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> nagdu mailing list
> >>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> >>>> nagdu:
> >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/rebecca.pickrell%40tasc.com
> >>>> CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This message and any attachments or files
> >>>> transmitted with it (collectively, the "Message") are intended only for
> >>>> the addressee and may contain information that is privileged,
> >>>> proprietary and/or prohibited from disclosure by law or contract. If
> >>>> you are not the intended recipient: (a) please do not read, copy or
> >>>> retransmit the Message; (b) permanently delete and/or destroy all
> >>>> electronic and hard copies of the Message; (c) notify us by return
> >>>> email; and (d) you are hereby notified that any dissemination,
> >>>> distribution or copying of the Message is strictly prohibited.
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> nagdu mailing list
> >>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> >>>> nagdu:
> >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/cindyray%40gmail.com
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> nagdu mailing list
> >>> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> >>> nagdu:
> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/linda.gwizdak%40cox.net
> >>
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> nagdu mailing list
> >> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> >> nagdu:
> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/buddy%40brannan.name
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > nagdu mailing list
> > nagdu at nfbnet.org
> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> > nagdu:
> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/linda.gwizdak%40cox.net
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nagdu mailing list
> nagdu at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for nagdu:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/bunnydavidson%40live.com
More information about the NAGDU
mailing list