[nagdu] Family Upset After Dog Removed From Eatery

minh ha minh.ha927 at gmail.com
Sat Aug 24 16:34:29 UTC 2013


Tami and Julie,

Thanks for the explanations; they help a lot. I can see how an
uneducated person would think that an emotional support dog is a
service dog. Interesting point about teaching our dogs other skills
though. I wonder if I could teach Viva to retrieve my lost shoes since
I can never seem to find them when I'm in a rush. :)

Minh

On 8/24/13, Julie J. <julielj at neb.rr.com> wrote:
> Minh,
>
> The distinction is the training.  Emotional support dogs do what they do by
>
> being a dog.  they don't have any task training.  There are service dogs for
>
> individuals with psychiatric conditions like PTSD that are task trained and
>
> those are service dogs.
>
> So some examples...Jane has a dog for her anxiety.  She feels less anxious
> when she pets Fido.  In this situation Fido is not a service dog because he
>
> isn't doing any trained task. He would be considered an emotional support
> dog.
>
> Jack has a dog, Fluffy,   for his PTSD.  Fluffy is trained to go ahead of
> him and alert to potential triggering situations.   Jack has difficulty
> being around individuals wearing camouflage clothing.  when Fluffy sees this
>
> type of clothing pattern, she nudges Jack's leg and indicates a safe route
> to leave the area.  Fluffy is doing a trained task and is a service dog.
>
> Of course the person in the equation must have a disability that fits the
> ADA definition.  I am blind and Monty is a trained guide dog, so I can enter
>
> no pets places with him.  However my sighted husband cannot take Monty
> anywhere pets are not normally allowed because my husband does not have a
> recognized disability.  Also the tasks of the dog must specifically mitigate
>
> the disability of the person.   If Monty were only trained to alert to
> sounds in the environment, like a phone ringing or an emergency vehicle
> approaching, he would not be considered a service dog for me.  I don't need
>
> those tasks and they do nothing to mitigate my particular disability.
>
> So to sum up:
> 1. the person must have a disability as defined in the ADA
> 2. the dog must be trained to provide specific tasks
> 3. the specific tasks the dog does must mitigate the disability of the
> person
>
> Of course service dogs can be taught additional things for entertainment,
> convenience or whatever.  Monty brings in the newspaper in the morning.
> that extra skill doesn't mean he isn't a guide dog.  also people with
> multiple disabilities can choose to have a service dog to mitigate any or
> all of their specific needs.  So someone who is blind and a wheelchair user
>
> might choose to have a guide dog or a dog to retrieve things for them or a
> dog who does both types of tasks.  any of those three would still be
> considered a service dog.
>
> Make sense?
> Julie
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: minh ha
> Sent: Saturday, August 24, 2013 10:31 AM
> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Family Upset After Dog Removed From Eatery
>
> I'm a little confused. So emotional support dogs for people with
> depression and stuff like that are by definition, not service animals?
> But I thought veterans that come home from the war that have PTSD and
> depression are allowed to get emotional support dogs as service
> animals.
>
> Minh
>
> On 8/24/13, Tami Jarvis <tami at poodlemutt.com> wrote:
>> Hey! This one seemed really clear about the laws and the distinctions.
>> Refreshing. It's good when the quote by the Designated Expert stresses
>> the training, especially when it comes to the different between ESAs and
>> their SD counterparts with task training. I was glad he mentioned that
>> the highly trained service dogs can be removed for the listed
>> misbehaviors.
>>
>> Tami
>>
>> On 08/24/2013 06:35 AM, Ginger Kutsch wrote:
>>> Family Upset After Dog Removed From Eatery
>>>
>>> by Jeff Rusack,
>>>
>>> August 23, 2013 8:13 PM
>>>
>>> Source:
>>> http://www.kdlt.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=29327&Itemid=5
>>> 7
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> One Sioux Falls' family is crying foul after they say they were
>>> discriminated against for having an emotional support dog at a fast food
>>> restaurant, Thursday.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Mocha may have brown fur but she seems to be in a grey area.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Thursday afternoon when Alan Steele and his mother Edwina decided to
>>> dine
>>> in
>>> at a Sioux Falls Taco Bell, they were told to do something that
>>> surprised
>>> them.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "We were asked if we were going to eat in. I said, 'yes, we are.' And he
>>> goes, 'I'm sorry. I can't allow you to do that,'" said Alan Steele.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> The Americans with Disabilities Act allows any service animal into just
>>> about any business.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "On the back it says that she is a part of the American Disabled Act of
>>> 1990," pointed out Steele.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Mocha is titled as an emotional support dog. Mocha's owner, Edwina
>>> Steele
>>> suffers from depression and anxiety and can't take prescriptions due to
>>> a
>>> heart condition, as they tried to explain to the Taco Bell staff.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "She is a service animal, emotional support. And he goes, 'that doesn't
>>> matter,'" added Steele.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "Just because a dog has a vest on doesn't mean the dog is protected,"
>>> said
>>> Steve Slavik, the CEO of Big Paws Canine, a company that trains dogs for
>>> Veterans dealing with post-traumatic stress disorder.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "What a service dog is and how it is defined, is a dog that is trained
>>> to
>>> perform work or perform a task for an individual with a disability,"
>>> quoted
>>> Slavik from the American with Disabilities Act.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> And the Steele's may be out of luck when trying to bring Mocha with them
>>> to
>>> businesses with pet policies.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "Dogs that wouldn't be protected are emotional support dogs and
>>> companion
>>> dogs. They are still considered pets and they are not defined in the
>>> protection of the ADA," added Slavik.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> But, asking someone about their dog, when it comes to determining if
>>> they
>>> are indeed a service animal, can be tricky.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Businesses are only allowed to ask two questions when it comes to
>>> service
>>> dogs.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Is the service animal required? And what work has the dog been trained
>>> to
>>> perform?
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Businesses cannot ask what the owners disability is or for the owner to
>>> provide documentation.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "If the dog is barking or being destructive to merchandise or going to
>>> the
>>> restroom on the floor, those types of things, even if it's a
>>> full-fledged
>>> 1,000 of hours training service dog, a service dog can be denied
>>> access,"
>>> added Slavik.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> The Steeles say there was no indication of any misbehavior at the Taco
>>> Bell,
>>> Thursday and they still hope for an apology from the restaurant.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> "I would like for people to ask and understand before they criticize or
>>> discriminate against her," added Steele.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> There's no doubt Mocha is a lovable pup. But, service dog experts say an
>>> emotional support dog has no protection when it comes to the Americans
>>> with
>>> Disabilities Act.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>
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>
>
> --
> "All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty
> recesses of their minds, wake in the day to find that it was vanity:
> but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act on
> their dreams with open eyes, to make them possible." T. E. Lawrence
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-- 
"All men dream, but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty
recesses of their minds, wake in the day to find that it was vanity:
but the dreamers of the day are dangerous men, for they may act on
their dreams with open eyes, to make them possible." T. E. Lawrence




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