[nagdu] The Differences in Dogs and Canes

Cindy Ray cindyray at gmail.com
Fri Jun 28 13:57:33 UTC 2013 

No one has ever thanked me for not barhging into their place in line. In my experience, most of them are looking for a way to do it themselves, and they do. Maybe that's just my old age and cybnicism. LOL.

Cindy Lou

On Jun 28, 2013, at 8:36 AM, "Danielle A. Creapeau" <dcreapeau at gmail.com> wrote:

> LOL, well, if they're in line for something, they're just standing
> there anyway, right? Might as well take advantage of a captive
> audience. :D
> 
> On 6/28/13, Osmarc <osmarc at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>> Wow, imagine that, a little common sense works. LOL
>> 
>> Sent from my iPhone
>> 
>> On Jun 28, 2013, at 9:29 AM, "Danielle A. Creapeau" <dcreapeau at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>> 
>>> I don't use my dog to find the end of a line and I don't use a cane
>>> either. about 100% of the time, I use my mouth. You'd be surprised how
>>> many people will actually thank you for not just barging in on their
>>> spot in line. Most of the time, if the person I've asked isn't at the
>>> end of the line, they call to the end and say something like "hey,
>>> someone call her towards the end of the line." It's as simple as that
>>> for me. :)
>>> 
>>> On 6/28/13, Julie J. <julielj at neb.rr.com> wrote:
>>>> Yes, it's fine to use a cane to check out something the dog is showing
>>>> you
>>>> and you can't figure it out.  Using a cane on sidewalkless routes to
>>>> check
>>>> your proximity to the edge is common.  Also using a cane to pattern a dog
>>>> to
>>>> 
>>>> a specific turn, like the fourth sidewalk after the mailbox, is fairly
>>>> common.
>>>> 
>>>> In some other countries a shorter white cane and the dog are used
>>>> simultaneously all the time.  Here, in the U.S., the more common practice
>>>> is
>>>> 
>>>> to get out a folding cane when it is needed and then to return to the
>>>> dog.
>>>> 
>>>> I have owner trained my guides, so they are all accustomed to me using a
>>>> cane because I have to early in the process.  However if a dog isn't used
>>>> to
>>>> 
>>>> the handler using a cane, it can cause a bit of confusion at first.  I
>>>> think
>>>> 
>>>> most of the programs are incorporating the cane into the training though.
>>>> 
>>>> HTH
>>>> Julie
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Carol Osmar
>>>> Sent: Friday, June 28, 2013 8:54 AM
>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] [nard] The Differences in Dogs and Canes
>>>> 
>>>> As a potential dog user, I have a question.  Is it ever
>>>> recommended to use a cane while with your dog to locate the
>>>> things you mentioned, or would that somehow undermine the
>>>> trusting partnership you have with your dog?
>>>> 
>>>> Carol
>>>> 
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Julie J." <julielj at neb.rr.com
>>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog
>>>> Users" <nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>> Date sent: Fri, 28 Jun 2013 07:30:32 -0500
>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] [nard] The Differences in Dogs and Canes
>>>> 
>>>> There are mobility things a cane can accomplish more easily than
>>>> a dog.
>>>> Finding the fourth sidewalk after the mailbox is tough with a
>>>> dog, but a
>>>> breeze with a cane.  Finding the mailbox in the first place is
>>>> easier with a
>>>> cane.  Mingling in a crowd is easier with a cane.  Dogs just want
>>>> to go
>>>> around and will avoid taking you up to clusters of people.  As
>>>> was mentioned
>>>> earlier, finding and standing in line is tough with a dog.  Odd
>>>> situations
>>>> you haven't encountered before are easier with a cane, for
>>>> example the weird
>>>> steps to the curb and street that I described a few months ago.
>>>> Any
>>>> information from echolocation from the tap of the cane tip is
>>>> virtually
>>>> nonexistent with a dog.  Getting information about your immediate
>>>> surroundings, like am I walking past a flower bed or a giant mud
>>>> puddle, is
>>>> easier with a cane.  Knowing what surface you are about to step
>>>> onto before
>>>> taking that first step is way easier with a cane.  Ever take a
>>>> step onto a
>>>> brick road early on a fall morning after a frost?  It is slick
>>>> and a dog
>>>> can't see any ice.
>>>> 
>>>> Julie
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Raven Tolliver
>>>> Sent: Thursday, June 27, 2013 10:56 PM
>>>> To: nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] The Differences in Dogs and Canes
>>>> 
>>>> Hi,
>>>> I do not view the cane or cane users negatively.  I would never
>>>> say
>>>> that I am better than cane users as a collective because I뭢 sure
>>>> there are people who travel more efficiently with their cane than
>>>> I do
>>>> with my dog.  But apart from handlers/users, guide dogs simply do
>>>> more
>>>> than canes do.  That is a fact, not an opinion.
>>>> It is a personal choice, just as what kind of dog, car, phone, or
>>>> laptop people decide to obtain, or what school people decide to
>>>> attend.  Everyone will make their ultimate decisions based on
>>>> needs,
>>>> wants, affordability, and ability to handle.
>>>> However, I will stand firm that the guide dog is a better
>>>> mobility aid
>>>> because it has more capabilities and is more precise.  No one has
>>>> disputed this fact with evidence or explanations.
>>>> I understand there are advantages and disadvantages to
>>>> everything, but
>>>> that does not mean all things are on some neutral ground.  Some
>>>> cars
>>>> are better than others, some phones are better than others, and
>>>> some
>>>> foods are better than others, regardless of what people can
>>>> afford,
>>>> are willing to put up with, or are able to handle.
>>>> I am sorry if anyone finds this offensive.  My intentions are
>>>> simply to
>>>> debate and share thought-provoking ideas, not to stir up trouble
>>>> or
>>>> cause some kind of divide.
>>>> 
>>>> --
>>>> Raven
>>>> 
>>>> Original Message:
>>>> From: "Star Gazer" <pickrellrebecca at gmail.com
>>>> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,       the National Association of Guide
>>>> Dog
>>>>       Users'" <nagdu at nfbnet.org
>>>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] The Differences in Dogs and Canes
>>>> 
>>>> You obviously view the cane as negative, your posts are full of
>>>> negative
>>>> language.  You yourself have said you hate the cane.  That
>>>> baffles me, as the
>>>> cane doesn't feel anything about you, one way or another.
>>>> You are entitled to your opinion, just realize it is exactly
>>>> that, your
>>>> opinion.
>>>> 
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>>>> 
>>>> -----
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>>>> 06/27/13
>>>> 
>>>> 
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>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
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>>>> 
>>>> 
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>>> 
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> 
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