[nagdu] note from the moderator Re: Natural Remedies

Marsha Drenth marsha.drenth at gmail.com
Mon Jul 28 13:18:46 UTC 2014

Raven and all, 
although very informative, this list is for guide dogs.  The below post, discusses more about human health than dog health, thus is not permitted by the rules of this list. If we could please get the discussion back on guide dogs it would be appreciated. any Lister who is wanting to discuss matters that are mentioned in the below email, please email Raven off list.
Thank you!

Marsha drenth  
email: marsha.drenth at gmail.com  
Sent with my IPhone  
Please note that this email communication has been sent using my iPhone. As such, I may have used dictation and had made attempts to mitigate errors. Please do not be hesitant to ask for clarification as necessary. 

> On Jul 27, 2014, at 11:59 PM, Raven Tolliver via nagdu <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Ladies,
> There is research on and documented cases pertaining to an array of
> natural modalities. If you look, you will certainly find it. The FDA
> will not approve it because they will not make money from it. How can
> they make money off of a healthy person who eats right and adds
> nutritional herbs and botanicals to their food. They can't.
> The side effects that many people suffer from when they venture into
> botanical medicine or other natural modalities is actually detox
> symptoms. People who are not educated about what they are doing and
> simply do something because someone suggested it will not know what to
> expect from their bodies. Just as doctors ought to educate patients
> about what might happen when they take a certain medication, so should
> anyone else offering medical advice whether it is natural or not,
> especially if the person is certified in their field.
> Anyhow, detox symptoms are often mistaken for allergies, side effects,
> and bad reactions. What it happening is the body is eliminating toxins
> through the skin, its largest organ, and sometimes through the
> digestive or urinary system. To illustrate this better, let's consider
> homeopathy. The rule of homeopathy is "like cures like." This means
> using botanicals to treat the very reaction that they are able to
> elicit. By doing this, it speeds the body's healing since the symptom
> or sign of imbalance is provoked and drawn out of the body. Of course,
> it is miserable when it happens, but pain and discomfort are a
> necessary part of healing.
> Also, this may come as a shock, but the studies that many people put
> faith in concerning allopathic medicine are not as in-depth as they
> would believe, especially when it comes to pet products. What often
> happens is a medicine is given for a certain amount of time. Let's say
> 4 months. Scientists realize that after 4 months, the animals start
> having bad reactions or just pass away. So they'll perform more
> studies, but shorten them to 2 months or 3 months, just so the bad
> reactions are rare or eliminated. Then they can say that side effects
> are rare. Consumers believe it, but the researchers know that
> reactions are only rare within a certain time period. So the side
> effects that we know about for meds are usually not comprehensive or
> all-inclusive. Money talks.
> About side effects to natural medicine, of course it is possible to be
> allergic to certain things. And in that case, there's something wrong
> with the body in question, not the treatment. When your body starts
> mistaking good things for bad things, the body has an imbalance that
> needs fixing or accommodating.
> Also, botanical medicine and other natural modalities do not involve
> lengthy or excessive exposure to known poisons. Yes, there are some
> natural substances that are dangerous in large or long term doses, and
> in that case, limited exposure is used. Many times in naturopathy, the
> rule is "less is more." On the other hand, people practicing and
> subscribing to allopathic medicine seem to believe that more is most
> effective. More pills, more antibiotics, more steroids, more medicine,
> more vaccinations, more pesticides, more poison. So what if any of it
> is known to cause liver damage, kidney failure, immune disease,
> cancer, or neurotoxicity? All that matters is that you make the
> symptoms stop.
> Allopathic medicine is about stopping the symptoms rather than working
> with the body to heal itself. Suppress the problem don't draw it out.
> Prevent and treat sickness rather than promoting health. My problem is
> not just the poisons, but the whole mindset. Scientifically proven
> means nothing to me when you want to approach medicine in a way that
> causes disease via exposure to toxin after toxin under the guise of
> disease prevention, rather than working actively to prevent sickness
> by promoting balance in the body. That is what health is. Not the
> absence of disease, but the presence of balance and optimal bodily
> function overall.
> Whether you use naturopathy or allopathy, you should never just follow
> anyone's advice. You should educate yourself and act based on your
> conclusions. The health care of you and those in your care is your
> responsibility and no one else's. In the age of information, there is
> no excuse for ignorance. Too many people don't research what they are
> putting into their own and their pets bodies, and they expect that
> doctors or vets just know what's best because they have a degree, and
> they could not be more far from the truth. Those people specialize in
> marketing skills and customer satisfaction. They just need to know how
> to pedal the meds, and give people what they want, which is something
> to make the nastiness go away in most cases.
> I was there. When I first got my dog, I believe that all the
> professionals knew what they were talking about since they had been
> doing this for x number of years and I was new to it all. Boy, was I
> wrong! After my dog's minor health problems, I started researching,
> and never stopped. I quickly learned that I had been lied to, and it
> was no one's fault but my own. It was my choice to accept advice at
> face value without researching it first. This is why I usually post
> research whenever I spout off about one natural remedy or another.
> Because I understand the value of educating yourself. I understand the
> feeling that you were dooped and cheated by a person whose advice you
> trusted. I understand the shame of realizing that it was your ow fault
> for acting without questioning first.
> I put this stuff out there for people to consider it, and to let
> others know that there is always an alternative. Even to the dreaded
> conventional heart worm treatment that people fear, there are
> alternatives. Most people wouldn't think there is because they
> subscribe to allopathy and worship it as if that very type of medicine
> is not destroying lives with its supposed advances in medicine.
> Naturopathy understands that there are always alternatives, and that
> no 2 people will receive one treatment for the same issue.
> Naturopathic medicine is tailored to the workings of each individuals
> body in order to restore balance. Naturopathy, like positive
> reinforcement training, is about starting with the least invasive
> methods, then progressing to more invasive treatments if the previous
> ones were ineffective.
>> On 7/27/14, Sherry Gomes via nagdu <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>> I actually tend to agree with you Becky. I'
>> I've stayed out of the conversation because I have strong feelings against
>> natural remedies for humans, let alone pets. I was born with a juvenile
>> rheumatoid arthritis. It's an auto immune disease. But as a child, I was
>> bombarded by the well meaning but insensitive prattle of adults, telling me
>> the things my parents should do to cure my arthritis. Finally, my parents
>> had my doctors tell me the truth about my disease. I became a skeptic by
>> necessity. as an adult, just for the heck of it, I tried a couple natural
>> things, I think alfalfa tablets once and fish oil capsules once. Of course
>> neither worked, because they can't fix an auto immune disease. Several
>> years
>> ago, someone actually told me if I followed a specific diet and used things
>> like glucosamine, it would regenerate my damaged joints, even the
>> artificial
>> ones and the fused knee that doesn't have a real knee joint either. So, I
>> approach natural remedies for dogs with the same innate skepticism. Now, I
>> do live in Colorado, and we don't have to do flea treatments here, but I do
>> give my dogs monthly heartworm preventative in the warm weather months, and
>> I'm not worried about the possible consequences of it, because I'd rather
>> do
>> that than risk the dog getting heartworm, as the treatment for it is far
>> more severe than the prevention. I hesitated a long time to give my old
>> retired dog glucosamine, and though I do it, I'm not at all convinced it
>> does anything for her either way, but she likes the edible pills, so I'm
>> okay with her eating them.
>> Sherry
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Becky
>> Frankeberger via nagdu
>> Sent: Sunday, July 27, 2014 5:12 PM
>> To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
>> Subject: [nagdu] Natural Remedies
>> You know all I respect your right to do whatever is kind to your dogs. But
>> most of the natural stuff is not and I repeat not scientifically proven.
>> They do not do double blind studies. So this vet group is just making lots
>> of money using our dogs as lab rats. Now granted there are some things that
>> they can prove that work in double blind studies with different scientists
>> and vets getting the same results. But they would rather sell you unproven
>> snake oil.
>> I know a gal with a master's degree who will not use vets unless nothing
>> she
>> tries is working. Many of her herbs and sprays do work in part. But her
>> natural flea spray she does faithfully every day give her at least one bout
>> of flea infestation a year. I have had one in twenty one years. I live
>> around cedar trees use cedar beds thus according to the natural vets I
>> shouldn't have to use the pesticides on my dogs. Got news for the natural
>> vets, you're wrong again. That one flea infestation was following your
>> advice by my husband.
>> Now do I use the pesticides on my dogs every month, no, as those cedar
>> trees
>> do give a level of protection. Under all the blond hair is a brain I use
>> liberally.
>> Do I think vets and naturalist vets are a good idea, I do. But to throw
>> western medicine out is just foolish talk. The oil my friend rubs on her
>> arthritic hands works well for her. Having only hard wood in my friend's
>> home is keeping her asthma at bay. Using the spray in her dog's mouth she
>> says is keeping tarter down in her dog's teeth. I have no idea if this
>> spray
>> works. She doesn't go to vets so I doubt her dog has had their teeth
>> checked
>> from the last rabies shot.
>> I am not into vaccinating every year. This was great to hear from Dr. Hauly
>> in 07 when I was at Seeing eye.
>> Anyway, read everything on the product good and bad that you want to use.
>> Don't use your $60,000 dog as a lab rat. Look for good studies using many
>> many dogs. What are the side effects so you can be prepared to act if you
>> need to. What are the signs to look for? Even natural herbs and stuff has
>> side effects. Remember marijuana  is a herb. You will poison your dog if he
>> gets an edible. If he does get an edible marijuana  , take him to the vet
>> fast. Don't smoke around your dogs.
>> Look for only board certified herbalists and Doctors for you and your pup.
>> I
>> remember buying a herbal supplement from my Chiropracter. I broke out in a
>> rash. She told me that rash was not one of the side affects she, by the
>> way,
>> never told me about. I told her add it to the list, as I showed her my
>> broken out area. She with twenty five years experience selling snake oil,
>> as
>> she was not Board certified, gasped. I stopped the herb and the horrible
>> rash went away.  So think about that as you give your dog concocktions of
>> herbs.
>> Just my opinion, never ever meant to hurt anyone's feelings..
>> Just giving another viewpoint, shy smile.
>> Becky and Jake
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> -- 
> Raven
> "if God didn't make it, don't eat it." - John B. Symes, D.V.M.
> http://dogtorj.com
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