[nagdu] Hypothetical Situation

Thu Mar 20 19:54:04 UTC 2014

+Larry,

That is tragic, and it does happen. We were really cautious about 
leaving Mitzi home alone with Daisy in case something set off Daisy's 
anxieties and fear aggression. The two of them got along just fine, but 
Daisy did have her triggers. In her case, we knew well enough what we 
were dealing with to not take chances. With the mutt, I don't worry when 
they're home alone together, but that hardly ever happens anyway.

Given the amount of money the programs put into the dogs they train, I 
think liability if a pet in the house injures or kills the service dog 
must be a consideration somewhere... Would the state's service dog 
protection law come into play so that the owner of the offending dog 
would have to pay the replacement value?

Whether the program would provide a replacement to that handler is 
something to wonder about... There's probably a lot of "it depends" in 
there. Did the handler know the other dog was aggressive? Were there 
warning signs? Under what circumstances were the two dogs left 
unsupervised? Is there a likelihood the owner of the aggressive dog 
would bring in another just like it or do something to turn a 
non-aggressive dog mean? I suddenly wonder if the various programs have 
policies about such things or if they would examine it on a case-by-case 
basis. I can't see it coming up often, but over the years, it must have 
come up somewhere. Hm...

Tami

On 03/20/2014 12:07 PM, Larry D. Keeler wrote:
> zzno, that really isn't the point. I'm just curious about what could
> happen. I've already learned to live with the real situation. I'm just
> curious about what might happen if it were a service animal from a
> school what could happen.
> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Star Gazer" <pickrellrebecca at gmail.com>
> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'"
> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2014 2:37 PM
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Hypothetical Situation
>
>
>> Thank you Larry. In that case, just let it go. Sometimes really bad
>> things
>> just happen.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Larry D.
>> Keeler
>> Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2014 2:35 PM
>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Hypothetical Situation
>>
>> A tragic accisent. The dog was maybe a year old.
>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Star Gazer"
>> <pickrellrebecca at gmail.com>
>> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2014 2:25 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Hypothetical Situation
>>
>>
>>> Was the dog aggressive (had been taught to fight) or was this a tragic
>>> accident?
>>> My retired guide dog went to live with my parents. She had some health
>>> problems which they were trying to treat. One day they left the retired
>>> dog
>>> alone with their dog, and their dog killed my retired dog. Interestingly
>>> enough, my sister's pit bull was also there, and did not get involved. I
>>> don't want to go into how we know this, but believe me, the evidence was
>>> not
>>> pleasant.  And yes, my dad put his dog down the next day. That's really
>>> all
>>> you can do.
>>>
>>> Believe me that day was horrible. My dad called to tell me what had
>>> happened. I knew something was very wrong because he called when I was
>>> giving my then toddler a bath. He never called during that time. He also
>>> insisted I get my husband, something he didn't even do when my grandpa
>>> died,
>>> or when my sister had been rushed to the hospital and was on life
>>> support
>>> after a very serious auto accident. When my dad called to tell me about
>>> Jersey, he was crying so hard and was so incoherent, I thought he was
>>> going
>>> to tell me my mom or sister had died in some sort of accident. I have
>>> never
>>> seen my dad cry like that before or since. I hope I never do again.
>>> My parents' dog was a mutt, one they got at a chicken auction. She was a
>>> puppy when they got her and hadn't been aggressive before. I've read how
>>> dogs will kill an injured member of the pack. I'd just never seen it
>>> happen
>>> until that day.
>>> Larry, I wouldn't worry about this unless you know for a fact that
>>> someone
>>> is training dogs to be aggressive. Some things are just tragic
>>> accidents.
>>> "Would have, could have, should have" don't help after the fact.
>>> Your friend's boyfriend probably feels a lot of guilt over what
>>> happened.
>>> I
>>> wouldn't cause him any more pain. I also wouldn't encourage legal
>>> action.
>>> What would be gained?  And for those of you still with us, my sister is
>>> ok.
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Larry D.
>>> Keeler
>>> Sent: Thursday, March 20, 2014 10:11 AM
>>> To: doggie
>>> Subject: [nagdu] Hypothetical Situation
>>>
>>> Well, this inquiry is based on a true situation. However, the dogs
>>> involved
>>> were not service dogs. A friend of mine had a really mellow black
>>> lab. Her
>>> boyfriend got a pit mix. They left the 2 dogs alone after a couple of
>>> months
>>> and the pit mix basically killed the lab. The dog was put down. What got
>>> me
>>> thinking is that one of the folks involved got a guide dog. I started
>>> wondering what if her boyfriend wanted another aggressive dog and
>>> something
>>> happened like that again. Who would be responsible for the loss of the
>>> dog.
>>> Sence she is a new handler, she is still not the dogs owner. This she is
>>> ok
>>> with. And, I don't think they will get another dog iether. I was just
>>> thinking what a mess it could be if you had a partner or spouse who
>>> got an
>>> aggressive dog and who would ultimately be responsible for in effect the
>>> damage of school or perhapse your property. If the other dog was
>>> attained
>>> after the service dog was, I'd think it would complicate issues. Of
>>> course,
>>> I know that you can ask questions and get help from schools if you
>>> already
>>> have a pet. I did. But, I know folks might forget or think its none of
>>> there
>>> schools buisness whether or not they get another pet. I'm sure that
>>> if the
>>> dog is yours then you could file a claim against your partner but how
>>> many
>>> folks would do that and, if you aggreed to let them bring a new dog in,
>>> I'd
>>> think you would share the responsibility. However, if the school
>>> still had
>>> ownership, who would be charged ans would they the student or partner
>>> have
>>> to pay? Or, could a school refuse to train the person with a second dog?
>>> just food for thaught. I'm a curious guy, what can I say!!
>>> Intelligence is always claimed but rarely proven!
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>>> om
>>>
>>>
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