[nagdu] Service Dogs on Public Transportation was RE: Uber sued for allegedly refusing rides to the blindandputting a dog in the trunk

Fri Sep 12 07:55:58 UTC 2014

On buses and trains, my dog certainly remains on the floor. But in
most taxis or cars, he rides on the seat right beside me. Many people
seem to be all for cramming, crunching, and folding their dog up into
uncomfortably tight spaces. I'm not. If there is plenty of room on the
floor, I will of course put my dog there. But if not, he lays on the
seat next to me, and I don't carry a towel unless it is raining. If
anyone has ever objected to my dog being on the seat, they certainly
never have asserted themselves.

On 9/11/14, Nicole Torcolini via nagdu <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Different people do different things. For me, Lexia rides on the floor on
> all types of public transportation. The one time that she was not on the
> floor was when I was in San Francisco  on one of those open air cable cars
> where there is a bench and a platform for your feet and literally nowhere
> for a dog to sit or stand. On that one occasion, Lexia rode in my lap. This
> was not according to plan.
> I consider it inconsiderate and rude to let your dog ride on the seat of a
> taxi, particularly if the seat is leather. Some people carry a towel or
> blanket to put on the seat, but this is extra hassle for me. Lexia rides on
> the floor behind the driver, and I ride behind the passenger seat. If there
> is one other person, that person rides in the front. If the taxi is full, I
> ride in the front with Lexia between my legs. It is apparent that some of
> the taxi drivers whom I have met had a dog ride on the seat at one point
> because they tell me not to put the dog on the seat. One person even put
> newspaper on the seat.
> 	On the shuttle that I take to and from work, there is enough room
> that Lexia and I get a double seat to ourselves. Because there is not time
> for seat hunting, I always sit in the same seat. Usually, it is empty. If
> not, the driver asks the person to move.
> 	Yes, we have laws, but that does not mean that they are followed.
> And they are not easy to enforce, especially when the law enforcement does
> not know about them.
>
> Nicole and Lexia
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Larry D Keeler
> via nagdu
> Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2014 4:57 PM
> To: Fatmir Seremeti; NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide
> Dog Users
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Uber sued for allegedly refusing rides to the
> blindandputting a dog in the trunk
>
> Usually on the floor at your feet. In a larger car such as a van they can
> sit in the back or beside you. And, sometimes in personal cars on the seat.
>
> This is not usually done in public transportation though. They also go on
> busses. Iether under or slightly in front of the seat. Oh guys, the
> stroller
> seats on some busses are great for dogs! When they're not being used, I
> love
> them!
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Fatmir Seremeti via nagdu" <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> To: "Janice Toothman" <janice.toothman at verizon.net>; "NAGDU Mailing
> List,the
> National Association of Guide Dog Users" <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2014 6:31 PM
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] Uber sued for allegedly refusing rides to the blind
> andputting a dog in the trunk
>
>
>> Hi all!
>> I wish we could have at least half of your ADA here in Sweden. I see
>> guides riding in the trunk here all the time and if you complaint they
>> just don't care. Just curious; are you guys in the US always aloud to
>> have your guide beside you on a car-chair or on the flor? How do you
>> do if the car is full or there isn't enough space on the flour?
>> Here is also a lot of problems with businesses and public places
>> denying guide-dog users access referring to allergies and no pet
>> policies.
>> Sorry for my maybe stupid questions but we seam to have a totaly
>> different set of laws and regulations here.
>> By the way I've been accepted to go to my first guide-dog introduction
>> week in the end of October. I'm so exited!!!
>> Med vänliga hälsningar / best regards
>> Fatmir seremeti
>> +46705103634
>> www.goalballfatmir.blogg.se
>> Twitter: @goalballfatmir
>>
>>
>>> 11 sep 2014 kl. 23:45 skrev Janice Toothman via nagdu
>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>:
>>>
>>> Hi All,
>>> I have never used my guide dog school ID because I do not feel that
>>> is what would help me out of a situation.  It is explaining the
>>> LAW-ADA and how it applies to the situation at hand.  This is why
>>> everyone as guide dog uses have to be well versed in th ADA law so we
>>> know what the discrimination is and how to address.
>>> Janice
>>>> On 9/11/2014 1:31 PM, Amber M via nagdu wrote:
>>>> Hi Abby,
>>>> Before I say anything about the situation, I would like to say that
>>>> this is just my opinion. So it is Benoni means correct, or upheld by
>>>> majority. But... And I do reiterate, this is my opinion... When someone
>>>> who attends a guy dog school shows an ID to get out of a stressful
>>>> situation, they then make it difficult for the owner trained guy dog
>>>> who comes after them. Because the business then expects that an ID
>>>> will be shown, and can be expected.
>>>>
>>>> I will not pretend that it is easier to stand up for your rights
>>>> when you are in a hurry, or when the person just doesn't seem to get
>>>> it,
> etc.
>>>> etc. But just like you don't want a blind person who attends a
>>>> school before you, to make you look like you are not capable of
>>>> doing for yourself, and wished they would take that extra moment to
>>>> do something for themselves, owner trainers have a really hard time
>>>> going behind program trained dog handlers, who do tend to use their ID
>>>> a
> lot.
>>>> Again, just my opinion, and by no means is it what everyone else
>>>> believes.
>>>> Best,
>>>> Amber
>>>>
>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>
>>>>> On Sep 11, 2014, at 11:34 AM, Abigail Bolling via nagdu
>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> The problem of explaining  that the dog is a service animal, I know
>>>>> this may sound harsh, but as far as I know, the service animal
>>>>> schools give there handlers ID cards for a reason. A lot of Dog
>>>>> users that I know refuse to carry them, to which my opinion is a
>>>>> lot of situations could possibly be avoided just by showing an ID
>>>>> card.
>>>>> I know we shouldn't have to show an ID card to make our point and
>>>>> it is certainly annoying, but sometimes it is just easier to go
>>>>> that extra stupid step to save a little headache later.
>>>>> Also, I know I said this on another post about this article, but it
>>>>> is the responsibility of the handler to know where their dog is at
>>>>> all times, so why did the handler let the dog be taken away from
>>>>> him and placed in the trunk in the first place.
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>> Abby and my little Shadow, Jada.
>>>>>
>>>>> Abigail Bolling
>>>>> Wright State University: Social Work
>>>>>
>>>>> "Keep a smile on your face and a song in your heart, and just let
>>>>> the music play." (Julie Anderson Diamond)
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sep 11, 2014, at 8:33 AM, Ginger Kutsch via nagdu
>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Uber sued for allegedly refusing rides to the blind and putting a
>>>>>> dog in the trunk
>>>>>>
>>>>>> By Gail Sullivan September 10 Washington Post
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Source:
>>>>>> http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/morning-mix/wp/2014/09/10/uber-
>>>>>> sued-for-a
>>>>>> llegedly-refusing-rides-to-the-blind-and-putting-a-dog-in-the-trun
>>>>>> k/
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> An advocacy group for the blind is suing the app-based
>>>>>> ride-sharing service Uber, alleging the company discriminates
>>>>>> against passengers with service dogs.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The federal civil rights suit filed Tuesday by the California
>>>>>> chapter of the National Federation of the Blind cites instances in
>>>>>> California and elsewhere when blind Uber customers summoned a car
>>>>>> only to be refused a ride once the driver saw them with a service
>>>>>> dog. In some cases, drivers allegedly abandoned blind travelers in
>>>>>> extreme weather and charged cancellation fees after denying them
>>>>>> rides, the complaint said.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The complaint filed in a Northern California District Court cites
>>>>>> one instance where a California UberX driver put a service dog in
>>>>>> the trunk and refused to pull over when the blind passenger
>>>>>> realized where the animal was.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On another occasion a passenger was trying to explain that his dog
>>>>>> was not a pet but a service animal when the driver allegedly
>>>>>> cursed at him and accelerated abruptly, nearly injuring the dog
>>>>>> and striking the passenger's friend, who is also blind, with an
>>>>>> open car door.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The group said it's aware of more than 30 times blind customers
>>>>>> were denied rides in violation of the American with Disabilities
>>>>>> Act and California state law.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> As a result, blind passengers are confronting unexpected delays
>>>>>> and "face the degrading experience of being denied a basic service
>>>>>> that is available to all other paying customers," the complaint
>>>>>> said.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Services such as Uber are quickly supplanting traditional taxis, a
>>>>>> service blind people rely on due to the limitations of public
>>>>>> transportation.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The National Federation of the Blind wants Uber to educate its
>>>>>> drivers about disability rights and punish the violators in
>>>>>> addition to providing a way for disabled passengers to immediately
>>>>>> register complaints when they are refused rides because of service
>>>>>> dogs.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In a statement reported by the San Francisco Examiner, Uber said
>>>>>> its policy is to terminate drivers who refuse to transport service
>>>>>> animals. "The Uber app is built to expand access to transportation
>>>>>> options for all, including users with visual impairments and other
>>>>>> disabilities," the statement said.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> However, Uber allegedly told some passengers it can't control what
>>>>>> drivers do because they are independent contractors. The company
>>>>>> advised them to let drivers know about their animals ahead of
>>>>>> time, said the Federation, which filed suit after Uber rejected
>>>>>> its request to negotiate a solution.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> The group claims the company closely monitors and controls its
>>>>>> drivers by managing payments and services through the app, and by
>>>>>> assessing driver performance based on customer feedback.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> In September 2013,California's Public Utilities Commission
>>>>>> classified UberX as a transportation provider because it functions
>>>>>> like a taxi dispatch. The commission also said that UberX may not
>>>>>> discriminate against the disabled, the Federation noted.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Figuring out whether to treat Uber like a traditional taxi service
>>>>>> or something else is the subject of heated debate across the country.
>>>>>> Taxi
>>>>>> services are required by federal law to serve the disabled, even
>>>>>> if drivers are independent contractors.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
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> om
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-- 
Raven
"if God didn't make it, don't eat it." - John B. Symes, D.V.M.
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