[nagdu] Opinions and thoughts from the moderator.

Wed Aug 12 01:56:03 UTC 2015

I think we want to step back here. Some of the things said here tend to get
rather harsh. We all have a right to our opinions, but let's please try to
express those opinions with some tact, some thought as to how they come
across to the others. Someone here will have as strong an opinion as another
person will on the other side of the topic, so we need to be careful how
those opinions are expressed. This is a list to discuss guide dogs or other
service dogs, some of their joys and trials, the problems that come from
people's lack of knowledge as to what service dogs are. If we disagree on a
topic, and if we want to take someone here to task for what they said about
us, please take it off the list and embark on a private discussion. I think
if we carefully weigh what we are saying, consider how it is coming across,
express opinions tactfully, we will all get along. Take a deep breath, write
your rage, and then hit the escape button and not the send button.
Thank you.

Cindy Lou Ray
cindyray at gmail.com

Cindy Lou Ray
cindyray at gmail.com

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of S L Johnson via
nagdu
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2015 7:55 PM
To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Cc: S L Johnson <SLJohnson25 at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Going to Prison.

Hi Steve, ,

Yes, you were very rude.  The last I knew this is a free country and we do
have freedom of the press and freedom of speech.  We all are entitled to our
individual opinions.  I am sixty years old and have been a successful guide
dog user for forty years.  I am just as aware of what is going on and what I
want in my life as any of the rest of you so, keep your personal opinion of
what I have to say to yourself.  I personally have no respect for anyone who
commits a crime and personally don't want them having anything to do with my
guide dog and, that is my right as a citizen of the United States.  If we
can't share different opinions and ideas, this would be a very dull world.

Sandra and Eva

-----Original Message-----
From: Steven Johnson via nagdu
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2015 8:24 PM
To: 'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
Cc: Steven Johnson
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Going to Prison.

Unfortunately, you really need more education on how the correctional dog
programs work.  These dogs are not solely confined to the correctional
facility with the inmates.  In fact, they have exposure to the same things
that a dog raised by a non-correctional dog does.  In the case of dogs
raised through the Correctional systems with Leader Dogs, they work closely
with Lion members who have the dogs on weekends and other days to give them
the same exposure, social, and wide variety of experiences the same way
other guides are raised.  In fact, sometimes, these dogs are more
disciplined, but in the end of course, it all comes back to the handler.

I know I am going to sound rude, but you might want to take a couple of
steps back before you start making such harsh and offensive statements.  You
seem to be a person who is very isolated from the real world that is around
you...just my observation from this post and many past  posts.  Sometimes,
your responses seem reactive.  Step back, read a few responses and think
about making an opinion on what you learn, and not on what you don't know.

Steve

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of S L Johnson via
nagdu
Sent: Tuesday, August 11, 2015 8:29 AM
To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
Cc: S L Johnson
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Going to Prison.

I would not accept a dog that had been raised in a prison.  I would be
concerned that the dog hadn't been exposed to everyday life in a normal home
environment, children playing, noisy traffic etc...

-----Original Message-----
From: larry d keeler via nagdu
Sent: Monday, August 10, 2015 11:01 PM
To: 'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
Cc: larry d keeler
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Going to Prison.

And, lets not forget! Some prisoners may have had a hand in training some of
our dogs!Which is a great thing both for them and us! Not saying or judging
the prison system but, like anything else it has holes in it. But, if they
can help train dogs and get comfort from it, well the better for them!

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Cindy Ray via
nagdu
Sent: Monday, August 10, 2015 10:43 PM
To: 'NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
Cc: Cindy Ray
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Going to Prison.

Sandra, I don't really quite get the hostility. Many have made good points
about this issue already. I will confirm what Julie has said. This is a
women's prison where there is a prison ministry that one of my friends from
seminary runs, and it is very successful. I know someone there who really
should not be, and there are probably countless others who have learned from
their errors. These are people, too, and where there is life there is hope
for change and rebirth. As for my innocent dog, no matter what my point for
going is, his innocence wouldn't be compromised by the visit to the prison.
For him it is an opportunity to work, end of story, and he will gladly blaze
the trail with me if he is able to do so.

Best,
Cindy Lou Ray
cindyray at gmail.com

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of S L Johnson via
nagdu
Sent: Monday, August 10, 2015 6:02 PM
To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Cc: S L Johnson <SLJohnson25 at comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Going to Prison.

I would never consider visiting  prison with or without my dog.  They are
criminals and do not deserve to even look at my dog.  Keep your poor
innocent dog away from the criminals.  Why should you feel sorry for someone

who committed a crime?

-----Original Message-----
From: Sherry Gomes via nagdu
Sent: Monday, August 10, 2015 6:52 PM
To: 'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
Cc: Sherry Gomes ; 'Julie J.'
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Going to Prison.

The times I took my dog with me into prisons, it was emotional for the
inmates, but they thanked me repeatedly and profusely for doing it. At San
Quentin, when I went with my cousin to visit her husband, one time a woman
came up to me and asked if her husband could pet my dog. She told me he
hadn't seen a dog in fifteen years. He was in prison for life. I didn't ask
why. I allowed him to pet my dog, and he cried and cried and thanked me over
and over. It meant a lot to him to be able to pet a dog. The times I went
with my singing group, nobody asked to pet my dog, but many inmates
commented on her and how much they loved seeing her.

Sherry

-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Julie J. via
nagdu
Sent: Monday, August 10, 2015 4:43 PM
To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Cc: Julie J. <julielj at neb.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [nagdu] Going to Prison.

I don't know about entering a prison with a guide.  In my last job, I used
to have a couple of inmates from the women's prison come and talk to the
class participants.    The only issue was that it was very emotional for
some of the inmates.  They may not have seen a dog for many years.  One lady

had to give up her dogs when she was sentenced.  She didn't know if they
found homes or what happened to them.  Seeing my dog reminded her of all
that pain.  She was in tears for most of the 1.5 hours they were there.

I'm not saying to leave your guide behind, but just to  be aware that the
presence of a dog could be an emotional issue.   It could be a positive
thing or not, no way to know beforehand.  Of course none of this has
anything what-so-ever to do with your legal rights in this situation.

Julie
Courage to Dare: A Blind Woman's Quest to Train her Own Guide Dog is now
available! Get the book here:
http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00QXZSMOC
-----Original Message-----
From: Cindy Ray via nagdu
Sent: Monday, August 10, 2015 5:25 PM
To: 'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'
Cc: Cindy Ray
Subject: [nagdu] Going to Prison.

I am going to go to the women's pennitentury to help with a worship service.
I am wondering about the dog, whether he will be welcome there. I did take a
dog with me to the Shawnee County Jail in Topeka, Kansas, but since the
minister isn't sure I can bring the dog, she is asking someone. I need to be
prepared.

Thanks.

Cindy Lou Ray

cindyray at gmail.com <mailto:cindyray at gmail.com>

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