[nagdu] picking breed, gender, and influences from others

[Tami Jarvis]

Gerardo,

I think you're right about the delicate balance between working dog and 
companion. Some people will insist that treating the guide as anything 
other than a working dog will ruin it hopelessly. Others will look up 
from cuddling their dog and roll their eyes, being too busy playing 
kissy-face to say anything at all. When the harness goes on, though, 
it's still all professional. I think that being able to maintain the 
balance between work and play has a lot to do with how well the handler 
is able to communicate which is which and how the boundaries lie. The 
dog's past experience and overall temperament will also affect how much 
the boundaries can be blurred, as well.

You mentioned wanting a poodle guide, and I'm sorry I've been late 
getting back on that. Usually, I can carry on about my poodles without 
hesitation or restraint, so I guess we really have been that busy. /lol/

My first guide, now retired, is a small female standard poodle. I'm 
training her replacement, a larger male standard from related lines. I 
adore them and think they make terrific guides, except... The best I can 
sum up is to say that their temperaments are as high-maintenance as 
their curls. Then there's the energy, which requires some management. 
They also tend to be quite vocal and prone to separation anxiety.

There's usually a long waiting list for poodles from any of the programs 
that provide them. Some of those programs will provide poodles only to 
those who can demonstrate a medical need for them, and they still have 
years-long waiting lists. I've known a couple of people who received 
poodles simply because they wanted one, but they had to wait.

The program folks also say one must demonstrate the ability to handle a 
poodle, and I agree. I have as much trouble defining what that really 
means as do program folks I've asked. It has a lot to do with being able 
to be calm yet firm without being harsh, I think, and to be able to 
maintain an even temperament oneself. If the reason you're interested in 
poodle is because you've known one, you may know what I mean. If you can 
maintain the delicate balance they need, and can put up with or even 
have fun with what I call the "nonsense factor," you can love having a 
poodle guide. People who are looking for a cute, curly-coated lab can 
find themselves stuck with a lot of trial and tribulation.

You mentioned in your intro that there are times you would have to leave 
the dog outside, so the poodle's tendency to separation anxiety is 
something to consider there. My retired guide Mitzi would not have done 
well at all with being left; she was even kind of a pain if I had a good 
friend hold her while I went too far away. That didn't come up often for 
us, so we managed. I left Loki outdoors with a friend the other day, 
since he's not really ready to go into a coffee shop, and he did pretty 
well. I'm just so used to knowing I have full public access to be able 
to imagine leaving him untended outside the store. Training for that 
specific situation would probably help.

hth,

Tami





On 07/11/2015 09:32 AM, Gerardo Corripio via nagdu wrote:
>   Exactly! Yes! I see the Guide Dog not only as a working dog, but as a
> 24/7 companion to which you can talk, cuddle etc., or are Guide dogs not
> to be treated outside of harness, as regular companion dogs? I guess
> sometimes it's a very delicate balance to accomplish! and as I said in
> my intro, I don't have a guide dog, but from having had pet dogs, I know
> the experience of having a dog lick you, thus dogs understand us more
> than other humans sometimes!
>
> El 11/07/2015 10:20 a.m., Raven Tolliver via nagdu escribió:
>> Dan,
>> When we get guide dogs, we are also getting dogs. That means that a
>> person should be satisfied with that dog, its quirks, mannerisms, and
>> how the dog behaves out of harness, as well as in harness. And
>> different breeds tend toward or tend away from different behaviors. I
>> echo your sentiments that a person should be focused on learning to
>> work a dog and the various aspects of what is it to effectively work a
>> guide. At the same time, that dog is much more than a guide, if they
>> weren't, they wouldn't need medical care, playtime, and downtime. But
>> they are more than just guides, so when we're deciding on a guide dog,
>> we are deciding on living with a different set of behavioral
>> mannerisms and personality traits. A large part of that is dictated by
>> breed. I'd even argue that some behaviors displayed while guiding are
>> dictated by breed. So I can be picky about the personality and
>> mannerisms that I am going to live with 24/7 for the next any number
>> of months or years.
>> When you get a guide dog, you should approach it from the viewpoint
>> that you are getting a soul mate. This dog is to practically be your
>> other half in a very intuitive and symbiotic fashion, and you
>> shouldn't settle for a less than ideal partner. So I didn't. I have a
>> choice in breed as long as schools train other breeds, and if they
>> don't train what I want, I'll go elsewhere, owner train, or have it
>> privately trained, which is the route I plan on taking the next time
>> around anyway.
>>
>> Here it is again, this idea that we should just appreciate what the
>> schools give us, and the schools know best. As a client, consumer, and
>> customer, I should have a huge say in the product/service that is
>> being provided to me.
>> Just because the school makes a decision doesn't mean it is right or
>> final. There are many guide dog teams that have only lasted a few
>> months, or were not good matches in the very beginning. The schools
>> know their dogs very well, but no one knows you better than you. The
>> schools only know what you tell them, so if you aren't completely open
>> about what is appealing, annoying, or just a downright deal-breaker,
>> They're not going to know, and end up risking a mismatch. So if you
>> really think you can't live with a certain breed, or you are attracted
>> to a specific breed for specific reasons, you have a right to assert
>> that and the school should be open to your needs and desires. If they
>> can make it happen, they do, and if they can't, then they give you
>> what they think is the next best thing. But you should always go for
>> what you want, and if you find that it isn't available or can't work
>> out, only then should you lighten up on your standards.
>