[nagdu] picking breed, gender, and influences from others
Tracy Carcione
carcione at access.net
Sun Jul 12 16:43:26 UTC 2015
Hi Raven.
So we're basically in agreement, except for your characterization of labs and goldens.
I'd say
Golden: sensitive, soft, wants to have things in his mouth to carry around, the more, the better. And tends to skin allergies.
Lab: Solid, cheerful, adaptable, easy-going, an easy keeper both physically and mentally.
So you'll stick to goldens, and I'll probably stick to labs.
Each to his own taste.
Tracy
-----Original Message-----
From: nagdu [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Raven Tolliver via nagdu
Sent: Sunday, July 12, 2015 3:48 AM
To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
Cc: Raven Tolliver
Subject: Re: [nagdu] picking breed, gender, and influences from others
Tracy,
I should clarify those points you've challenged.
First, I made the soul mate analogy to drive home the point that people should not just settle for a dog because it guides effectively.
I was challenging Dan's opinion that first-time handlers should focus on the guide dog and guide work aspect rather than being choosy about breed and sex. No matter what dog you're training with, you should settle for a partner whose quirks, mannerisms, and personality you love. Obviously, there will be something about each of our dogs that we could live without, but if those behaviors are an extreme disruption or hassle that we can't handle, or just don't want to deal with, then we shouldn't think we have to, whether it's dog 1 or dog 7.
Second, there is a reason guide dog programs use different breeds and cross-breed for health and temperament. Each of them has something different to offer. All breeds have their advantages and weaknesses.
What is an advantage or weakness is sometimes dependent on the individual. For instance, some people don't like that goldens are usually softer, sensitive dogs. For me and other golden lovers, that is a score.
Also, each breed has behavioral tendencies that they are known for. My generalization was not a sloppy assertion that breed can be responsible for any trait, but I meant to explain that each breed has its own behavioral tendencies.
Golden retriever: sensitive, social, eager to please, couch potato;
labrador: goofy, upbeat, nose glued to the ground, your running buddy; German shepherds: committed, protective, hates change;
boxers: balls of energy, high-strung, hard-headed.
These are just things trainers think of right away when they learn that someone has x breed of dog, or they're about to work with a dog and learn it is a certain breed. It's stereotyping. It's not true for every dog of that breed all of the time, but it's what that breed is known for because it's pretty darn common.
As for your golden/lab cross being the hardest to handle compared to your previous 5 labs, I have 2 opinions.
1. The undesirable behavior could be crocked up to a lot of different
factors: parents' temperament, puppy-raiser foundation, formal guide trainer, training methods, environmental stress, and so on. I understand your point. However, if you and your husband feel it is because he is part golden, then by all means, request purebred lab next time, or at least one that's not a 50/50 or 75/25 cross.
Fortunately for you and your spouse, the odds are in your favor because labs comprise the majority of guide dogs issued. What's the harm in having that preference? It's the partner that you have to work with day in and day out, so ultimately, it's up to you what characteristics and traits you're willing to put up with.
2. I would not jump to a conclusion based on one dog. I'm inclined to say your crossbreed's undesirable behavior is no more due to being partially golden as my golden's dog distraction is due to him being purebred golden.
My request for a golden had nothing to do with singular encounters with a dog of a different breed, nor was it based on one golden.
Through people's pets and golden guides, I knew that goldens displayed all the characteristics I wanted in a guide dog. I've also discussed at length about how I feel that the breed chose me. The first future guide dog I ever met was a female golden, and both times I went to Leader Dog for the guide dog seminar for youth, I walked with male golden retrievers.
I had met very few labs and German shepherds, so it wasn't that I had any aversion to those breeds for breed-specific traits. But as I have gained experience with training and handling other dog breeds, including a number of labs, boxers, and German shepherds, it has further solidified the choice I've made, and the choice I will make in the future.
Plenty of people base biases and preferences off one-time experiences.
Who am I to say whether you should or shouldn't? There's no harm if you choose to say no more golden in future guides because it primarily affects you, and the people living with you and the dog.
I'm not here to convince anyone that goldens are best. I just want to let people know that it's okay to be picky about breed. I was picky and got what I wanted. Others can be picky and get what they want, just know that being picky has its consequences.
Hope that makes more sense.
--
Raven
Founder of 1AM Editing & Research
www.1am-editing.com
You are valuable because of your potential, not because of what you have or what you do.
Naturally-reared guide dogs
https://groups.google.com/d/forum/nrguidedogs
On 7/11/15, Julie J. via nagdu <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> I do not believe that it is available on either BARD or BookShare.
> However
>
> it could be, since they don't need my permission to make it available.
> Currently it is only available as a Kindle book. I know there are
> problems
>
> with access for some people. I am trying to get it available from
> other sources in other formats, but it's slow going. I will let
> everyone know when that happens.
>
> Julie
> Courage to Dare: A Blind Woman's Quest to Train her Own Guide Dog is
> now available! Get the book here:
> http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00QXZSMOC
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Gerardo Corripio via nagdu
> Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2015 10:56 AM
> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
> Cc: Gerardo Corripio
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] picking breed, gender, and influences from others
>
> Side note of seeing your book in the signature: is it available on
> Bard or Bookshare?
>
> El 11/07/2015 07:52 a.m., Julie J. via nagdu escribió:
>> I can see both sides to the choosing your dog concept. I have picked
>> all
>>
>> of my dogs because I have owner trained or had them privately trained.
>> Three turned out great and one was a learning experience. I don't think
>> her breed was the problem though. She just really didn't want to be a
>> guide dog. You wouldn't have that issue with a program though, or I'd
>> hope
>>
>> not.
>>
>> I am very picky with breed, gender and temperament. With that said I
>> still have to be flexible. This last time around I had wanted a red
>> Doberman male. I ended up with a black Doberman female. I guess you
>> have
>>
>> to decide what you'll compromise on and what you won't. To me focus and
>>
>> work ethic are of paramount importance. Also my husband has mild
>> allergies and requested a short haired dog. I researched a ton and then
>>
>> some more first on breeds and then breeders.
>>
>> But one of the huge benefits to going through a program is that they
>> know
>>
>> their dogs and should be able to match you up with one that suits you.
>> This eliminates a lot of time researching breeds, evaluating dogs and
>> learning what traits best suit your lifestyle. They are supposed to
>> be making the dog choosing and matching process easier and less
>> problematic for you.
>>
>> I still say the hardest part about owner training is picking the dog
>> to start with. If you start with a solid dog, the training is still
>> work, but not a nightmare. You can start with a mess of a dog and
>> come out with
>>
>> a guide. It's just that the process will be exponentially more time
>> consuming and difficult. If the program does a good job of selecting
>> quality dogs and matches them well, the rest will fall into place
>> pretty handily.
>>
>> All that said, if a poodle is what you want and no other dog will be
>> quite
>>
>> right and you'll always wish you had the poodle, then I say ask for the
>> poodle. If you're always wishing your lab was a poodle, you'll never be
>>
>> truly happy with your lab and the partnership and work will suffer.
>>
>> Julie
>> Courage to Dare: A Blind Woman's Quest to Train her Own Guide Dog is
>> now available! Get the book here:
>> http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00QXZSMOC
>> -----Original Message----- From: Raven Tolliver via nagdu
>> Sent: Saturday, July 11, 2015 1:31 AM
>> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>> Cc: Raven Tolliver
>> Subject: Re: [nagdu] picking breed, gender, and influences from
>> others
>>
>> As someone who was and will always be picky about breed, I agree that
>> you shouldn't pick a breed because it's cute. However, if you truly
>> feel that a certain breed's general temperament is more suited to
>> you, I would make the request.
>> Three years ago, I got my first guide dog, and I asked for a golden
>> because I have always appreciated how down-to-earth, compliant, and
>> loyal they are. The goldens I met who were pets were very low-key,
>> very out-of-my-face, and minded their own business in the house. Of
>> course, I understand now that some of that is crocked up to the
>> family's training, but I think the breed's ease of trainability plays
>> a major role as well. And goldens are definitely not as stubborn as
>> other breeds used for guiding, which is a big plus in my book.
>> I didn't have to explain the case for my choice to the school I
>> attended. I simply asked for a golden, and they obviously found that
>> one of their goldens was a perfect match for my pace, personality,
>> and handling skills.
>> So if you think a certain breed is cute or cool-looking, don't
>> request that breed for that reason. Do research on the temperament,
>> energy-level, and behavioral tendencies of that breed to see if it
>> will meld with your own energy level, temperament, and personality.
>>
>> To give a good example, I adore one of the most feared and hated
>> breeds, the pitbull. I love how slick their coat is, their
>> musculature, their cute brick heads, wide muzzles, ease of
>> trainability, and willingness to please. However, I will likely not
>> have one as a pet up the road. Most of them are extremely high
>> energy, and the kind of smart that can get them in trouble. Honestly,
>> the last thing I need is a high energy dog in my house. They are
>> great to work with for a couple hours, but to live with that energy
>> 24/7, I'm not interested.
>>
>> So if you think you want a particular breed, understand that it is
>> okay to be picky within reason. Also understand that requesting a
>> certain breed could mean a long wait time. The majority of guide dogs
>> are labradors, and when you decide on a different breed and go the
>> guide dog program root, you could be waiting a while. That was not
>> the case for me, I applied in March, and got into a June class. But
>> that doesn't happen so soon for everyone.
>>
>> Ask yourself why you want one breed over another. What specific
>> behavioral and temperamental traits do you like about poodles? What
>> do poodles have to offer that other breeds don't? Do you think you
>> could work with a labrador or another breed? Why or why not?
>> Those are just the questions I think you should ask yourself if
>> you're considering requesting a specific breed.
>
> --
> Enviado desde mi lap
> Gerardo J Corripio Flores Psicólogo, Terapéuta Reiki Saludos desde
> Tampico, Tamaulipas México
>
>
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