[NAGDU] Leader and Leash Guiding

Wed Apr 20 17:00:43 UTC 2016

Hello:

No matter what school they came from, I have taught all my dogs to leash 
guide.  One day many years ago I was crossing an extremely busy street when 
the clip on the right side of my dogs handle broke off.  I quickly took a 
short hold on the leash and she kept working as if nothing had happened.  I 
find leash guiding very helpful in narrow spaces, buffet lines, etc...It is 
also very helpful if you have a dog who wants to sniff or grab for stuff on 
the floor.  You have a short hold on the leash, close to the collar and can 
quickly feel and control any unwanted behaviors.  I also found it more 
convenient when going out to relieve the dog instead of having to take the 
harness on and off just for that short trip outside.  Someone else already 
mentioned how leash guiding helps when you are visiting and don't want your 
dog to have to be in harness all day.  As I have interviewed with different 
guide dog schools over the years I have asked about leash guiding.  Many 
trainers believe that if you teach the dogs to leash guide it will cause 
them to pull too much if you want them to heel if you are walking sighted 
guide.  I have not found that to be a problem.  As far as I know GDF is the 
only school that does teach leash guiding.

Sandra
-----Original Message----- 
From: Danielle Sykora via NAGDU
Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2016 11:15 AM
To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
Cc: Danielle Sykora
Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Leader and Leash Guiding

Lisa,

Exactly. I've used leash guiding to cross a simple one way street as
well as to walk short distances on my college campus where cars are
allowed to drive most of the places where people walk, but you're
definitely not going to use leash guiding to cross a six lane highway
or something. Complex is a somewhat relative term, so it's really up
to each handler to determine when leash guiding is or isn't going to
work for you and your dog.

I find it interesting that you find GDF and GDA similar after having
dogs from both programs, because that's exactly what I thought when I
was trying to pick a school. I can't even imagine not having a dog
that leash guides at this point though.

Danielle and Thai

On 4/20/16, I via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> Lisa,
>
> First off, Iâ?Tm so glad you have a good dog, regardless of where you got 
> her.
>
> Actually the position for leash guiding is closer to the dogâ?Ts shoulder 
> than
> you would be for harness work. This is why weâ?Tve discouraged the leash
> guiding across streets or in complex areas. You just donâ?Tt have the room 
> to
> move with the dog for sudden movements.
>
> On 4/20/16, 10:18 AM, "NAGDU on behalf of Lisa Belville via NAGDU"
> <nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org on behalf of nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>
>>Yep, that's it, Danielle.
>>
>>I got my first two dogs from the GDF starting in 1996 and leash guiding 
>>was
>>
>>always taught from day one.  The dog is in just about the same position
>> when
>>leash guiding as it is in harness, but you hold the short leash just above
>>the loop made by the clip attached to the collar.
>>
>>Unless I'm mistaken, GDF no longer recommends leash guiding in traffic or
>>other really challenging areas because the information you get from the 
>>dog
>>
>>on leash is not as good as that coming through the harness.  Most body
>>movements aren't as easy to feel and since the connection between you and
>>the dog is looser, you have less reaction time.
>>
>>My third dog is from GDA, and it was really hard adjusting to not having
>>leash guiding because the GDA equipment and many of their techniques are 
>>so
>>
>>similar to the GDF's that I'd use GDF techniques instead.  At GDA we take
>>the dogs with us to dinner right from the get go and it was confusing
>> having
>>a leash that felt so similar and not being able to use the dog to guide.
>>
>>Lisa
>>
>>
>>Lisa Belville
>>missktlab1217 at frontier.com
>>
>>Never make the same mistake twice. There are so many new ones, try a
>>different one each day.
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: "Danielle Sykora via NAGDU" <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>To: "NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>><nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>Cc: "Danielle Sykora" <dsykora29 at gmail.com>
>>Sent: Wednesday, April 20, 2016 8:43 AM
>>Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Leader and Leash Guiding
>>
>>
>>> GDF dogs are pretty much taught to guide just as well on leash as they
>>> do in harness. They aren't taught to heel at all, so they walk in a
>>> guiding position from day one. Puppies are either allowed to walk with
>>> a loose leash, or taught to moderate their pull so they put enough
>>> tention on the leash to effectively guide without dragging the handler
>>> or choking themselves. When the dogs are working in harness, you walk
>>> in the traditional approximately in line with the back legs position.
>>> When leash guiding, you stand closer up toward the shoulders.
>>>
>>> I often use leash guiding when I take my dog out to relieve or to be
>>> groomed. It can be helpful in narrow spaces because walking further
>>> forward can sometimes make it easier for dogs to clear obstacles or
>>> you can hold the leash and walk behind the dog. I also tend to use
>>> leash guiding in other people's houses if I'm going to be there most
>>> of the day and don't really want to keep his harness on the whole
>>> time. Having your dog leash guide while wearing a flat collar is also
>>> one way you can run with your dog, though if you plan to run a lot a
>>> sports harness is probably the better option.
>>>
>>> Danielle and Thai
>>>
>>> On 4/20/16, Caitlyn Furness via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>> Lizzie,
>>>>
>>>> Most schools donâ?Tt teach formal leash guiding.  I think GDF might be 
>>>> the
>>>> only one who does.
>>>>
>>>> Most schools donâ?Tt insist on a truely correct heel, either, so most 
>>>> dogs
>>>>
>>>> are
>>>> really leash guiding to a point, since they are not in a true heel and
>>>> are
>>>> putting light tension on the leash.
>>>>
>>>> Hopefully some GDF grads can speak up about how this works, and when
>>>> they
>>>> use it..
>>>>
>>>> Cait
>>>>
>>>>> On Apr 19, 2016, at 10:06 PM, Lisie Foster via NAGDU 
>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Hello from me and my Golden boy!
>>>>>
>>>>> I have a question about Leader Dogs and other schools who don't teach
>>>>> leash guiding (which I believe is every school except GDF).
>>>>>
>>>>> I read recently that Leader used to train their dogs to do some 
>>>>> minimal
>>>>> leash guiding back in the late 70's or early 80's. I believe what I
>>>>> read
>>>>> said that their dogs were always taught to maintain a forward 
>>>>> position,
>>>>> even on leash.
>>>>>
>>>>> Does Leader still teach their dogs to heel that way? Is that true that
>>>>> they used to do so? And, are there any schools that used to teach dogs
>>>>> to
>>>>> leash guide but no longer do? If so, why did they stop?
>>>>>
>>>>> Thank you! I'm really interested in this topic!
>>>>>
>>>>> Lisie and Finn
>>>>>
>>>>> lisiefoster at yahoo.com
>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> NAGDU mailing list
>>>>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>>> NAGDU:
>>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/caitlyn.furness%40gmail.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> NAGDU mailing list
>>>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>>> NAGDU:
>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/dsykora29%40gmail.com
>>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> NAGDU mailing list
>>> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> NAGDU:
>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/missktlab1217%40frontier.com
>>>
>>
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>NAGDU mailing list
>>NAGDU at nfbnet.org
>>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> NAGDU:
>>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/jeninems%40icloud.com
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> NAGDU mailing list
> NAGDU at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> NAGDU:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/dsykora29%40gmail.com
>

_______________________________________________
NAGDU mailing list
NAGDU at nfbnet.org
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nagdu_nfbnet.org
To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NAGDU:
http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nagdu_nfbnet.org/sljohnson25%40comcast.net 