[NAGDU] {?} Re: Punctuation....
Cindy Ray
cindyray at gmail.com
Mon May 9 12:57:14 UTC 2016
I hate to pick about this, but could we take time to put punctuation in our
posts, for those of us who don't, and be a little careful about the typos.
When there is no punctuation and there are lots of typos, it is hard for old
people like me to get the gist of your messages. I know I can be more
careful about the typos, but the punctuation makes pauses in the speech, and
those pauses are helpful.
Cindy
-----Original Message-----
From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of terrie arnold via
NAGDU
Sent: Sunday, May 8, 2016 4:33 AM
To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Cc: terrie arnold <terrieiphone at me.com>
Subject: Re: [NAGDU] {Spam?} Re: {Spam?} RE: {Spam?} Re: Mind Blown....
Well only one guy dog school that I know of charges a fee for their service
dog stuff your first dog $150 and each dog after that it's 50 bucks so with
this you on the dog the school does not own it after that fact so all the
rest the schools give you the dog but they do have the right to come back
and pull the dock from you so Cena done from several different schools for
people to miss treating their dogs where the Skewis comment Schools have
gone and taken your dogs back from people for mistreatment either hitting
the dog not feeding the dog or just the bad way of using the dog I want to
say but yeah I've seen it heard it many times from the leader dog today to
Fidel go to GDF so but this three cross training thing I don't know
sometimes the dogs, train themselves to do other things once you have them,
As I had a friend that was diabetic and her dog would rub up against her a
par when her sugar was going low and it did all by himself he wasn't trying
to do that so many times the dog saved her from going into a diabetic, so
our dogs are wonderful nurse smart little buggers to boot
My thoughts for today
> On May 7, 2016, at 11:33 PM, Tami Jarvis via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
wrote:
>
> Wayne,
>
> Oh, I totally agree that the three task minimum should nto be a
requirement. I hadn't heard that there are people who believe it should
until I read it in the Illinois proposal. I am truly shocked. I can't even
begin to understand the thinking behind that one.
>
> Glad the Illinois bill is no longer a concern and that you're working to
see its like will not come again.
>
> Tami
>
>> On 05/07/2016 08:55 PM, Wayne And Harley via NAGDU wrote:
>>
>>
>> Tammi,My point is the three task minimum should not be a requirement for
a dog to be considered a Service Dog. I was in no way saying that Service
Dogs should all be mono tasked. I know several SD Owners whose dogs do
multiple tasks for their owners multiple disabilities, but I also know
several SD Owners whose SD does just one task.I see Guiding as being
analogous to a computer.It's a complex system made up of many components.
For a computer all the major components need to be there for the computer to
work. Guiding is the same. If all the major components ( microtasks ) aren't
there the dog isn't guiding.
>>
>>
>> Yours, Very Sincerely And Respectfully,
>>
>> Wayne M. Scace
>>
>> -------- Original message --------
>> From: Tami Jarvis via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Date: 5/7/2016 14:59 (GMT-06:00)
>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Cc: Tami Jarvis <tami at poodlemutt.com>
>> Subject: [NAGDU] {Spam?} Re: Mind Blown....
>>
>> Wayne,
>>
>> Yeah. The three-task minimum could be life and death for some service
>> dog users. Literally. I know some medical alert dogs also bring a
>> medicine bag and/or push a button on an emergency call device and/or
>> a few other things. But some simply need to alert the handler in time
>> for the handler to deal with the situation before it becomes
>> critical. This enables the handler to go to the grocery store without
>> ending up in a coma in the middle of the floor. So how is this not
>> good enough? I was talking to my friend with the PTSD service dog.
>> Out in public, where access laws are relevant, the dog alerts my
>> friend to an impending episode so my friend can do deep breathing or
>> leave the stressful area or whatever. Sometimes, the dog then adds
>> pressure to help my friend regain her balance more quickly. So that's
>> two. The dog does some additional things at home, so that puts her
>> over three. But if these licensing laws are about public access, would
the at-home tasks apply?
>> It's an entertaining thing ponder, if one is that hard up for
>> entertainment. But if the three-task minimum is in a law, then that
matters.
>>
>> Some people see guide dog work as many separate tasks; others see it
>> as you do -- one task with a lot of components. I tend towards that
>> view myself, with obstacle avoidance and curb stops being a part of
>> the task of guiding. I think of "find" as a separate task, I suppose,
>> and I see it as applying to my disability, so there we're up to two.
>> Still not legal, depending on who is deciding officially how many
>> tasks are included in guiding.
>>
>> The legislative efforts I've seen the past year or so would
>> definitely pose problems for owner-trainers. But as written, they
>> would cause some of the same problems for people with dogs from the
>> programs. They would also need to have their dogs tested before they
>> could continue using them, for instance. At least service dog users
>> who could drive could get their dog to the testing site. If your
>> guide dog is suddenly not a service dog because it does not have the
>> license, you can't just hop on the bus to go get it, can you? There's
>> no grandfather clause in these proposals to cover that. Until you
>> wrangle up a ride to go get that license, that guide dog you've been
>> using for the past five years is now officially a pet and cannot go
>> where pets are not allowed. Oh, and who pays for you to get there? By
>> the ADA, they can't charge for the license, and probably not for the
>> test. But what about the 50-mile cab ride. Or, for some folks, the
>> 300-miles there, another 300 miles back, and a stay in a hotel? Oh,
>> and don't forget meals! I'm suddenly picturing myself lugging around
>> a 3-day supply of peanut butter sandwiches, along with dog food and
everything else.
>>
>> The people behind these legislative efforts claim loudly and piously
>> that they're just looking after the rights of disabled people and
>> making sure they're protected. The inevitable results of their
>> efforts would demonstrate something quite different.
>>
>> Meanwhile, Fluffy has a shiny laminated license that looks just like
>> the official one. Her mom whipped it up on the computer, paid 5 bucks
>> to get it laminated, and they're good to go to the store! Fewer real
>> service dogs in stores means more room for Fluffy!
>>
>> Tami
>>
>>> On 05/07/2016 11:47 AM, Wayne And Harley via NAGDU wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>> Thanks Jenine,So ADI, by accepting IGDF's standards for Guide Dog
>>> training has, tacitly, admitted that their "One size fits all"
>>> approach to Service Dog training cannot cover all Service Dog
>>> modalities!!Does acceptance of IGDF's standards mean that the
>>> idiotic "three task requirement" rule ( Which is counter to the
>>> language in the ADA ) doesn't apply to Guide Dogs?Here's why I ask.
>>> My Guide Dog does one work, or task, if you will, its a huge complex
>>> type of work/task, it's called guiding. Guiding itself, while large
>>> and complex, is made up of several microtasks which if one was
>>> missing would mean he hasn't finished training to be a Guide Dog.
>>> Conversely, those micro tasks do not and cannot stand alone. That
>>> "three task requirement" would also mean that many current SD's that
>>> perform only one mitigating task directly related to their owner's
>>> disability would not be considered, by ADI and their member
>>> organisations, as SD's simply because their Owner only needs one
>>> task done
>> to mitiga
>> te their disability. Take medical alert Dogs and seizure response
>> dogs for example. The next question that occurs to my fertile mind
>> is, are the Guide Dog schools fully on board with ADI's agenda?The next
point that I wish to raise, as many Guide Dog Owners may not be aware of
this is.Wiithin the Guide Dog Owning Community, Owner Trainers are a very
small minority, as the majority of Guide Dog Owners work with programme
trained Guide Dogs. Within the Greater Service Dog Owning community this is
reversed. Service Dog Owner Trainers predominate and programme trained
Service Dog Owners are the vast minority. The other Service Dog Modalities
have a clear majority and Guide Dog Owners ( both Programme trained and
Owner Trained Guide Dog Owners ) are a miniscule minority.If ADI's
"solution" to the fake disabled person "problem" a very large number of the
disabled will become disenfranchised and be discriminated against because
not every disability has a corresponding Training progr amme, or a
programme that would train for the mix of disabilities that so many Service
Dog Owner Trainers suffer from. Nor could those that will be disenfranchised
possibly afford the cost of going to an ADI registered programme. Here the
Guide Dog Owning community has a clear advantage as most Guide Dog Schools
charge the recipients a nominal fee for their Service Dogs.I, for one, would
rather not lose my civil rights as they currently stand and be fitted for
ADI's version of the "Yellow Star Of David".
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Yours, Very Sincerely And Respectfully,
>>>
>>> Wayne M. Scace
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -------- Original message --------
>>> From: Jenine Stanley via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Date: 5/7/2016 08:29 (GMT-06:00)
>>> To: "NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users"
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Cc: Jenine Stanley <jeninems at icloud.com>
>>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Mind Blown....
>>>
>>> Wayne,
>>>
>>> Before you panic, ADI has adopted the IGDF standards as their standards
for guide dog schools.
>>>> On May 6, 2016, at 11:38 PM, Wayne And Harley via NAGDU
<nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> My mind is BLOWN, I just did a casual search that took only a few
minutes on ADI's website. Every major Guide Dog Training programme in the
U.S. is accredited by ADI. The only ones that I didn't see there were Pilot
and a young school in Mississippi called Gallant Hearts....And here I
thought they adhered to IGDF's standards and Guidelines. ....
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yours, Very Sincerely And Respectfully,
>>>>
>>>> Wayne M. Scace
>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>
>>>
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>>
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>
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