[NAGDU] OFF NAGDU List ownership

Sat May 20 04:39:23 UTC 2017

For whatever it's worth, the times that I know about at a couple of schools
where a dog was removed were situations where clearly the dog was being
abused or mistreated in some way that was pretty drastic.  I was in class
one time when  dog was brought back to the school for this reason and the
trainers really took it hard, too, it's very upsetting to them when this
happens. 

Also, some people very involved with one school who are Lions' helped to
investigate a situation where a dog was taken back to the school, I guess
you could say it was repossessed and there was a long and involved
investigation before the dog was removed and the situation was pretty
awlful.

Most of the time, from what I've seen through the years, dogs aren't removed
unless the situation is very drastic, probably way worse than most of us
would even tolerate. I'm sure there are exceptions, sadly, but for the most
part, there's a long investaigation before that happens. Now I'm sure
someone will have an unfortunate experience but I certainly hope not.

Come to think of it, when I lived in Hawaii we had a really strange
situation where a dog was removed for a short period of time. The
organization that provided the dog felt that the person had regained more of
their sight than they were letting on. It was a very confusing and bizarre
situation and very difficult to sort out to say the least. The person got
their dog back when it was determined that even though she had indeed
regained some of her vision she still was visually impaired and had real
issues using the vision that she had.

Well, you've probably had enough of my rambling, but just thought I'd share.

Charlene

-----Original Message-----
From: NAGDU [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Brenda via NAGDU
Sent: Friday, May 19, 2017 9:15 PM
To: The Pawpower Pack via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Cc: Brenda <bjnite at windstream.net>
Subject: Re: [NAGDU] OFF NAGDU List ownership

Hey Rox,

No, someone told me there were situations at TSE a few years ago.
brenda

On 5/19/2017 10:09 PM, The Pawpower Pack via NAGDU wrote:
> Hey Jeff,
> I think she was referring to South Eastern as se.
> 
>   Rox and the kitchen Bitches:
> Mill'E, Laveau, Soleil
> Pawpower4me at gmail.com
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
>> On May 19, 2017, at 9:02 PM, Jeffrey Young via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
wrote:
>>
>> Hi Brenda,
>> Your message intended for Marian went to the entire list. Just letting
you know.
>> I would however, like to hear of a TSE handlers dog being repossessed, as
TSE grants unconditional ownership upon graduation. Therefore, such an
action would constitute theft under the law, and the handler would have
legal recourse,  which is not the case when a school does not grant
ownership.
>>
>> Jeff Young
>>
>>> On May 19, 2017, at 8:21 PM, Brenda via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> Hi Marion,
>>>
>>> I'm writing off list.
>>>
>>> In a perfect world all guide dog schools would give instant ownership.
Because I'm not impressed with the schools that do, and those I am
interested in do not, I am willing to make compromises. Also, I have heard
from someone who had their TSE guide removed and TSE gives full ownership so
it would appear even with full ownership there could be issues.
>>>
>>> I respect and agree with you about ownership, but practical application
wins out for me. The benefits will have to outweigh the risks as it were.
>>>
>>> I do respect your opinion so am sharing my comments and questions with
you.
>>>
>>> Southeastern has in addition to the 11-yr retirement rule, a provision
where they can reclaim the dog before 5 years if the team isn't working.  I
realize there is an expense to train a dog, but it is one more trauma for a
handler who may have a situation where they can no longer work - if they had
full ownership, this would not happen. I think they also have some other
stipulations regarding ownership. My friend who has a guide from
Southeastern said they have had incidents where they felt it necessary to
make these provisions.
>>>
>>> I am curious if you could tell me if you have ever run across a recent
situation where a handler from Guiding Eyes for the Blind had their dog
removed?   If so, can you give me a summary of what happened? I can ask GEB,
but I am interested in an outside source such as yourself.
>>>
>>> I have not made a final decision, and appreciate your input.
>>>
>>> Sincerely,
>>> Brenda
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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m
>>
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