[NAGDU] thoughts about discussions, leadership and actions

Sat Apr 10 23:42:38 UTC 2021

OK you guys. Take this off the list. Email privately! This discussion is  alienating people and serves no purpose any more. Marion made his decision which was his choice. Its efficacy is irrelevant. He chose to leave the National Federation of the Blind which is his right.

In fact, we have carried on discussions with non-NFB members in the past and should/will do so again. We even have seen on this list and others announcements not specifically from within our organization. The only restriction has been that announcements and discussions should be relevant to the topics and interests of the specific list. We do have a philosophical orientation concerning blindness and guide dogs we support on this list.

I listened to Marion's webinar this past Thursday and heard nothing that was in opposition to the philosophy of this organization. I am sure he will conduct further sessions which may well continue to be relevant for some here.

What concerns me here is that some people have not been subscribing to the rules of the list. Cindy, you sent more than five contributions to the list today.

David, you are continuing to push back after Cindy asked that this discussion ends. She is the list moderator like it or not. So, if you continue to disagree with her, please do it off list and consider volunteering to moderate in some manner yourself. I bet Cindy would love the help.

As far as people leaving, Rox, sorry you decided to do so. You will be missed. Marion, sorry you decided to do so as well although I understand your reasons since you and I discussed them. If we subscribe to the basic philosophies and precepts of this organization then we all should remember that leaving never fixes anything except for the loss of voices who can make a difference as a part of the collective voice of blind people.

The NFB is going through some issues now. Should have they been caught and addressed earlier? Possibly. However, the test of this organization's fabric is how it/we will move forward and grow individually and collectively. The issues we all face may well include how the NFB addresses guide dog issues that have been pointed out on this list. If you do not like Raul's approach then run against him when his term is up. Also, rather than stirring up animosities with prolonged discussions that are degrading and causing anger and tension call Raul directly and discuss with him how you feel we should move forward. Also, volunteer yourselves to deal with issues. For example, anyone can help write or write yourself a resolutions regarding the airline issue. Also, there must be people on this list who know the person in Florida who had her guide taken away. If you know her, have you reached out to the reverent? Have you volunteered to help Raul with this in some way?

Remember, the National Federation of the Blind is the organized movement of blind people. You are part of it. Search yourselves and use my comments and the entire set of discussions we have seen over the past few weeks to motivate your positive actions going forward.

A thought. No one should be knocking what Marion did last week. The webinar was relevant to guide dog users and  it was informative to some. What more of you should be doing is to help convince Marion that he would  do better to reunite with the  NFB to continue to conduct his program as part of the most powerful organization of blind people in the world. Also, volunteer to help, if you feel help is necessary, to get the NFB and NAGDU to take more swift and firm actions on issues you feel need action.

I have been a part of this organization for 49+ years. I chose to join and too be active. My positions have not always been the ones adopted at first or sometimes ever. I have not always changed my mind about my position even after years of discussion and thinking. Disagreement is a positive thing and disagreements are one of the best ways we learn. If anyone chooses not to take an active part in this movement then you are a passenger and really don't have the right to criticize. If you don't like the philosophy you see in the NFB, work to change it. Of course, you can leave, but what does that accomplish? Sometimes after time has passed the leadership of the NFB adopted ideas I promoted earlier. Sometimes my ideas have never been adopted, but always I know that at least I helped people think. I will not leave this organization over disagreements unless the direction of the Federation  goes totally against what this organization has promoted and taught about blindness since its inception in 1940. I do not see this happening.

You now have my thoughts. I am NOT going to enter into any debates. If anyone wishes to talk with me, you are welcome to reach out My contact information is well known, but it is below. Thanks for reading.

Best Regards,

Michael Hingson

The Michael Hingson Group, INC.
"Speaking with Vision"
Michael Hingson, President
accessiBe, Chief Vision Officer
(415) 827-4084
mike at michaelhingson.com
michaelhi at accessibe.com
To order Michael Hingson's new book, Running With Roselle, and check on Michael Hingson's speaking availability for your next event please visit: www.michaelhingson.com
To learn more about accessiBe please visit www.accessibe.com
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-----Original Message-----
From: NAGDU On Behalf Of Cindy Ray via NAGDU
Sent: Saturday, April 10, 2021 2:43 PM
To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Cc: Cindy Ray <cindyray at gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [NAGDU] My response to your messages

Dear David,
You need to stop harassing me. I will not go through E-mails to analyze  what you said, nor will I play word games with you or argue with you. We need to move on from this, and if I’ve made mistakes, or if you have, maybe we will learn from them. You and I are about the same age, so we need to be wise older adults and figure out another way through this rather than acting as if we were immature kids. 
Thank you.
Cindy

> On Apr 10, 2021, at 2:11 PM, David via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Cindy, I do believe you need to read more carefully. There are several instances where you have characterized my comments in ways that are completely different from what they were.
> 
> I did not say I won't comply because I don't agree with you. I said I won't comply, because I will not agree to be silenced about on-topic issues. What I had posted was on topic, respectful, and relevant. Trying to silence me because you disagree with me is just plain silliness and disrepectful. Your and Raul's posts have been aggressive and non-responsive with regard to the issues being discussed.
> 
> *David in Clearwater, FL*
> *david at bakerinet.com*
> On 4/9/2021 7:28 PM, Cindy Ray via NAGDU wrote:
>> saying you won’t comply because you don’t agree with me
> _______________________________________________
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> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for NAGDU:
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