[NAGDU] Rideshare denials

Al Sten-Clanton albert.e.sten_clanton at verizon.net
Sat May 25 00:22:35 UTC 2024 

Somebody who knows more than I do can correct me if I'm wrong, but I 
suggest that anybody who has the choice of taking a taxi instead of 
these Ride Share dweebs should give it a shot.  When a cab took off on 
me because of my guide dog quite some years ago, the company said the 
driver would lose his license for thirty days with no appeal.  A few 
years before that, a taxi driver denied me service and was fired 
immediately, and I think this happened a time or two in addition but 
can't remember.  I'm not a fan of truncated due process, and maybe 
there's a better way to do the job of getting these drivers to 
straighten up and fly right, but at least the tax drivers were and maybe 
still are potentially more accountable than this "innovative" ride share 
approach allows for.  I had my doubts when chirping chatterboxes 
proclaimed with great gusto about the great new competion for the cab 
companies that these ride share outfits were supposed to be, but I seem 
to have underestimated the problems they would create for us.  I'm lucky 
to live where there are still cabs, and am sorry that what I suggest is 
likely no good for people who do not, but at the moment it seems 
sensible for those who can to use cabs whenever that will work.  Maybe 
it will cost more, or appear to cost more, but denials of service and 
the trouble getting some redress for them also cost something.  No, I 
can't afford cabs offten, but I don't think I can afford ride shares 
often either, and the trouble getting justice when these ride share 
people screw us can be costly in its own ways.


Al


On 5/24/24 16:50, Leslie Hamric via NAGDU wrote:
> Yeah, that happened to me in October. I got denied twice and then the third driver took me. I've also had drivers ask me why don't you use Uber pet? So that's why I've been using Lyft lately because they don't have that confusion with Uber pet. But still, something has to be done about this. What is it going to take? We had a resolution last year at convention. I think there will need to be more than only a resolution. Again I don't know what that is but this is got to stop.
> Leslie Hamric
> Cello and Braille Music Teacher
>
>> On May 24, 2024, at 3:29 PM, Buddy Brannan via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>
>> Yep. I just saw a post from a friend on Facebook, who was denied *three times* in a row. After the third time, he got a message from Uber suggesting that if he wanted to take his furry friend along, he should use Uber Pet. But…service dogs are allowed on regular rides. Uh … OK. Fourth time he got a ride.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Buddy Brannan, KB5ELV, WRVB670 - Erie, PA
>> Email: buddy at brannan.name
>> Mobile: (814) 431-0962
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> On May 24, 2024, at 2:48 PM, Debbie Malone via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> Just an FYI. The service dog denials are getting worse. I had the same
>>> scenario happen just a week later.  I was also denied directly when I
>>> wanted to go with my significant other to his appointment. They said I
>>> couldn't go because I had a service dog. It is really bad when the transit
>>> authority is perpetuating the problem and actually denying access because
>>> of the service dog. Just saying...
>>>
>>> *Sent with Right Inbox <https://www.rightinbox.com/?utm_source=signature>*
>>>
>>>
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>>>
>>>> On Sun, May 5, 2024 at 8:50 AM Diane Graves via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I hear you Debbie. It is an outrage to have to decide whether to take a
>>>> dog to your time sensitive appointment or leave them home, because you
>>>> don't know what the rideshare drivers are going to try to pull. It is even
>>>> worse, to make this ongoing problem a consideration when deciding whether
>>>> to train with a successor dog or not.
>>>>
>>>> Although the rideshare companies would claim otherwise, I simply don't
>>>> believe that they have a strong zero tolerance policy for violations of the
>>>> law when it comes to guide dogs/service animals. They would say that they
>>>> are doing all they can, but I do not believe it.
>>>>
>>>> For example, I was recently enrolled at a university which had a very
>>>> strict progressive policy against cheating and plagiarism. If you were
>>>> caught once, you would receive an F on the assignment; twice, you failed
>>>> the entire course; three times and you were expelled from the university. I
>>>> don't think the rideshare companies have such a policy in place.
>>>>
>>>> When attempting to make travel arrangements with a family member or
>>>> friend, I try to be considerate. If they don't want a dog in their vehicle,
>>>> I can either honor that or choose not to ride with them. However, When a
>>>> driver makes the decision to provide a public service and drive their
>>>> personal vehicle for a rideshare company, they forfeit their right to make
>>>> the call, and they should be required to comply with the law. We shouldn't
>>>> be forced to deal with this.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Robin (Diane) Graves
>>>> rdgraves2007 at gmail.com
>>>> 317-238-9262
>>>>
>>>> “TGIF: TODAY GOD IS FIRST.’—OS Hillman
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: NAGDU <nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Debbie Malone via
>>>> NAGDU
>>>> Sent: Sunday, May 5, 2024 7:31 AM
>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users <
>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Cc: Debbie Malone <dmalone510 at gmail.com>
>>>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Rideshare denials
>>>>
>>>> I do the same thing. I report to Uber, NFB, and our RTA (MBTA/the
>>>> RIDE)since many of my rides are contracted through them. I am going out to
>>>> the DOJ complaints in the next day or so. Any advice?
>>>>
>>>> I am so outraged that even those contracted rides are denied. The other
>>>> day the paratransit service didn't have enough vans to take me on my
>>>> scheduled trip. The tried to get me an Uber but were refused by every
>>>> driver. They were telling the drivers that I had a service dog and allowed
>>>> each driver to deny the ride. They had to delay a regular van driver's
>>>> lunch to take me to my appointment. I am so outraged that I am looking into
>>>> a protest at the state house and/or media coverage. I am too through.
>>>>
>>>> *Sent with Right Inbox <https://www.rightinbox.com/?utm_source=signature>*
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sat, May 4, 2024 at 4:14 PM Suzette May via NAGDU <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> What Lyft told me is that if you message the driver that you have a
>>>>> guide dog or the driver is close enough to see that you have a guide
>>>>> dog and the ride is canceled at any point after that, it is considered
>>>>> a service dog denial. So I report those.  I also screenshot my text
>>>>> message when it says the driver has seen the message, along with the
>>>>> driver information screen as soon as possible. I also report it on the
>>>>> NFB form and the DOJ form every time.  If I can, I start videoing when
>>>> the driver is one minute away.
>>>>> I'm averaging about 1 in 3 guide dog denials.  I've had several that
>>>>> were blatant, to my face denials. That was before I started videoing.
>>>>>
>>>>> *Suzette May*
>>>>> *PS139.13 at gmail.com <PS139.13 at gmail.com>*
>>>>> *512-564-0152*
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Thu, May 2, 2024 at 12:34 PM Raul Gallegos - NAGDU via NAGDU <
>>>>> nagdu at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hello Vanessa. While there is no direct evidence that you have been
>>>>>> denied, I personally would still report it as such, especially if
>>>>>> you
>>>>> have
>>>>>> voluntarily sent the driver a text that identifies you as a blind
>>>>>> person traveling with a guide dog.
>>>>>> I hope this helps.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> Raul Gallegos, President
>>>>>> National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>>>>> (346) 439-7444 • rgallegos at nagdu.org www.nfb.org • www.nagdu.org
>>>>>> Subscribe to the NAGDU public calendar Facebook Group • Email list •
>>>>>> Mastodon “You can live the life you want. Blindness is not what
>>>>>> holds you back.”
>>>>>>
>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>> From: NAGDU <nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Vanessa Lowery
>>>>>> via NAGDU
>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, May 2, 2024 12:22 PM
>>>>>> To: NAGDU Mailing List, the National Association of Guide Dog Users
>>>>>> < nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>> Cc: Vanessa Lowery <val4dogs at gmail.com>
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [NAGDU] Rideshare denials
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I have a question. To give an example, let's say that I have
>>>>>> selected
>>>>> Uber
>>>>>> and have messaged the driver stating that I will be traveling with a
>>>>>> service dog and will be placing a towel on the floor of the vehicle
>>>>> before
>>>>>> the dog enters. You continue to wait as the countdown for the
>>>>>> drivers arrival continues. The driver gets two or three minutes out,
>>>>>> and then the next thing you know, You've been switched to another
>>>>>> ride. But before
>>>>> that
>>>>>> happens, you've gotten a text response back from the driver that
>>>>>> just
>>>>> says,
>>>>>> "OK.". You assume that the OK means that the driver has no issues
>>>>>> with
>>>>> the
>>>>>> presence of the service dog. But then, you are suddenly switched to
>>>>> another
>>>>>> driver. Is that considered a denial? And if not, at a minimum,
>>>>>> should we
>>>>> go
>>>>>> to the tracking link that the NFB has and report that. And if so,
>>>>>> what is it categorized to be? I have had that happen a few times
>>>> lately.
>>>>>> Vanessa and the zoo
>>>>>> Sent from my iPhone
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On May 2, 2024, at 7:21 AM, Debbie Malone via NAGDU
>>>>>>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> Hi all,
>>>>>>> Is NFB still collecting data regarding Uber andLyft service animal
>>>>>> denials?
>>>>>>> If so where do we report the incidents? Thanks.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> *Debbie Malone*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *National Federation of the Blind of Massachusetts*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Affiliate Second Vice President*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *At-Large Chapter President*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *National Federation of the Blind, National Writers Division Vice
>>>>>>> President* *InclusionEducation.com
>>>>>>> <https://inclusioneducation.com/>*
>>>>>>> Amazon Author Page <https://www.amazon.com/~/e/B07RVCRR5R>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Sent with Right Inbox
>>>>>>> <https://www.rightinbox.com/?utm_source=signature>*
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>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> *Debbie Malone*
>>>>
>>>> *National Federation of the Blind of Massachusetts*
>>>>
>>>> *Affiliate Second Vice President*
>>>>
>>>> *At-Large Chapter President​*
>>>>
>>>> *National Federation of the Blind, National Writers Division Vice
>>>> President* *InclusionEducation.com <https://inclusioneducation.com/>*
>>>> Amazon Author Page <https://www.amazon.com/~/e/B07RVCRR5R>
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>>>
>>> --
>>> *Debbie Malone*
>>>
>>> *National Federation of the Blind of Massachusetts*
>>>
>>> *Affiliate Second Vice President*
>>>
>>> *At-Large Chapter President​*
>>>
>>> *National Federation of the Blind, National Writers Division Vice President*
>>> *InclusionEducation.com <https://inclusioneducation.com/>*
>>> Amazon Author Page <https://www.amazon.com/~/e/B07RVCRR5R>
>>> _______________________________________________
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