[nfb-talk] philosophy taken to another level then?

Margo and Arrow margo.downey at verizon.net
Sun Jul 18 07:25:56 CDT 2010


Mike, lol!  My first guide dog, Deedee, did that and oh, that was so very 
hilarious.

Margo andArrow
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Mike Freeman" <k7uij at panix.com>
To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, July 17, 2010 11:09 PM
Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] philosophy taken to another level then?


> I've seen a guide dog bark at her image in a mirror!
>
> Mike
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Jim" <jp100 at earthlink.net>
> To: "'NFB Talk Mailing List'" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, July 17, 2010 3:54 PM
> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] philosophy taken to another level then?
>
>
>>I don't know Mike.  That's pretty funny.
>> Of course, I still don't think it beat the time my two friends and I were
>> walking together at an Austin mall.  One of my friends, the one with "the
>> most vision" told us to slow down or stop so as not to run into the other
>> blind people coming toward us.  I asked what other blind people because I
>> didn't hear any canes or anything.  As hard as he tried avoiding them, we
>> couldn't.  We walked a bit, and all of a sudden, he ran into something. 
>> He
>> realized what had happened.  He was looking at some sort of mirror or at
>> least at our reflections and thought there were three other blind folks
>> coming our way.
>> He couldn't help but bust a gut and ended up on the floor laughing
>> hysterically.  I'm sure passers-by wondered what the heck was happening
>> there.  I'm sure the blind folks were noticed after he began laughing
>> without control.
>> JP
>>
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>> Behalf Of Mike Freeman
>> Sent: Saturday, July 17, 2010 3:30 PM
>> To: NFB Talk Mailing List
>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] philosophy taken to another level then?
>>
>> Yeah; it took her a minute to figure out why I was laughing and then she 
>> sat
>>
>> down on the curb and howled with mirth.
>>
>> Mike
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Margo and Arrow" <margo.downey at verizon.net>
>> To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Saturday, July 17, 2010 2:09 PM
>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] philosophy taken to another level then?
>>
>>
>>> Mike, bet the lady chuckled, too.
>>>
>>> Margo and Arrow
>>>
>>>
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: "Mike Freeman" <k7uij at panix.com>
>>> To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Saturday, July 17, 2010 2:47 PM
>>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] philosophy taken to another level then?
>>>
>>>
>>>>I once knew a lady who was unfamiliar with my neighborhood and who said
>>>>hello to every lamp post for a block because she wasn't used to them 
>>>>being
>>
>>>>so close to the sidewalk! In truth, it *was* funny!
>>>>
>>>> Mike
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> From: "Mike Bullis" <mabullis at hotmail.com>
>>>> To: "'NFB Talk Mailing List'" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Saturday, July 17, 2010 8:21 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] philosophy taken to another level then?
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Not knowing what it was, I hit a bush with my cane the other day as I
>>>>> was
>>>>> walking quickly by and said excuse me.  I thought it was funny.
>>>>> Although I
>>>>> know that many disagree with me about this, I simply find lots of 
>>>>> things
>>>>> funny that are politically incorrect or self deprecating.  Humor,
>>>>> perhaps
>>>>> sadly, but truly, is very much about the put down.
>>>>> Mike
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>>> On
>>>>> Behalf Of Mike Freeman
>>>>> Sent: Friday, July 16, 2010 11:44 PM
>>>>> To: NFB Talk Mailing List
>>>>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] philosophy taken to another level then?
>>>>>
>>>>> Ray:
>>>>>
>>>>> In any discussion such as this, it's damnably dangerous to generalize
>>>>> because almost universally, there are exceptions to any rule. But with
>>>>> respect to humor regarding aspects of blindness, I think we must ask
>>>>> ourselves *why* we (or our sighted coleagues) find any particular
>>>>> blindness-related incident funny. Let me give you an example.
>>>>>
>>>>> Many years ago, I remember a commercial for a particular optical 
>>>>> company
>>>>> touting the need to wear good glasses (this was before lasic) by using 
>>>>> a
>>>>> skit whereby a mom's kids on a camping trip with her stole her glasses
>>>>> and
>>>>> laughed themselves silly when she got up in the morning over how
>>>>> ridiculous
>>>>> she looked stumbling about and doing awkward things because she 
>>>>> couldn't
>>>>> see.
>>>>>
>>>>> That commercial burned my posterior because it was pure cruelty for 
>>>>> the
>>>>> kids
>>>>>
>>>>> to laugh about something the mom couldn't help because she wasn't
>>>>> trained as
>>>>>
>>>>> a blind person and had I been her, I'd have tanned their hides. This
>>>>> sort of
>>>>>
>>>>> thing is the reason I find almost all slapstick comedy unappealing. 
>>>>> It's
>>>>> basically cruelty in another guise. And if (as in Mr. Magoo) it gives
>>>>> the
>>>>> impression that all vision-impaired persons are like that, it sets us
>>>>> back
>>>>> immeasurably.
>>>>>
>>>>> But something like forgetting to turn a coffee cup over when getting 
>>>>> it
>>>>> out
>>>>> of the cupboard and absent-mindedly pouring coffee all over the 
>>>>> counter
>>>>> as a
>>>>>
>>>>> result -- that's just plain funny because I knew better and had my 
>>>>> head
>>>>> in
>>>>> the clouds rather than paying attention to what I was doing as I 
>>>>> should
>>>>> have.
>>>>>
>>>>> You see what I'm driving at? Do we laugh over our blindness because 
>>>>> it's
>>>>> funny or because we are laughing at what we take to be our misfortune.
>>>>>
>>>>> What we in NFB bridle at our two assumptions: (a) that others 
>>>>> (including
>>>>> ourselves) assume that we need help when we may not and (b) that we 
>>>>> may
>>>>> falsely assume that we can't do something so elect not to try. Every 
>>>>> one
>>
>>>>> of
>>>>> us (including those of us who are sighted) use help when we need it
>>>>> and/or
>>>>> when it's convenient for us and others. Where this gets us into 
>>>>> trouble
>>>>> is
>>>>> when we ask for help so often that people don't think we can do 
>>>>> without
>>>>> it.
>>>>>
>>>>> But basically, it all comes down to how we view ourselves mediated by
>>>>> our
>>>>> view of blindness.
>>>>>
>>>>> Mike
>>>>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>> From: "Ray Foret Jr" <rforetjr at comcast.net>
>>>>> To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Sent: Friday, July 16, 2010 9:33 AM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] philosophy taken to another level then?
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Ah, well, you see John, here's the thing.  As I see it, I don't think
>>>>>> that
>>>>>
>>>>>> the NFB philosophy is looking to diminish blindness itself; rather, 
>>>>>> as
>>>>>> I
>>>>>> understand it, the NFB is trying to make blindness itself a mere
>>>>>> nucence
>>>>>> according to the perceptions of both the sighted and blind alike.  We
>>>>>> tend
>>>>>
>>>>>> to see ourselves as others see us.  That includes the blind as well.
>>>>>> It's
>>>>>
>>>>>> a fact of human nature that when you've got a cause to fight, and the
>>>>>> need
>>>>>
>>>>>> for help from others seems to fly in the face of any forward movement
>>>>>> in
>>>>>> that cause, there tends to be at least a little personal or
>>>>>> professional
>>>>>> embarrassment at the idea of needing help; especially when that need
>>>>>> for
>>>>>> help and the taking of it, (how ever badly needed) would even appear 
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> set back the cause for which one is fighting.  I note the most recent
>>>>>> issue of "The Braille Monitor" for July 2010.  The "Ask Mrs. Whsoit
>>>>>> column
>>>>>
>>>>>> is particularly worth paying attention to.  Why?  Because in that
>>>>>> column,
>>>>>> one of the letter writers indicate
>>>>>> d that they got the impression that the independent blind in the NFB
>>>>>> always would brag about how they could always find their way through
>>>>>> airports and never needed help; and therefore, that one was not a 
>>>>>> true
>>>>>> federationist if one either needed or accepted help regardless of how
>>>>>> much
>>>>>
>>>>>> that help was actually needed.  Barbara Pierce, in her answer,
>>>>>> indicated
>>>>>> that she wondered whether she and the letter writer were reading the
>>>>>> same
>>>>>> issues of "The Braille Monitor".  Here, I think the letter writer 
>>>>>> could
>>>>>> have made a stronger case by actually sighting issue and articles. 
>>>>>> If
>>>>>> the
>>>>>
>>>>>> truth of the matter be known, I too was once under the same 
>>>>>> impression
>>>>>> as
>>>>>> the letter writer.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Now, I'll give you another.  The subject of laughter.  Once, on this
>>>>>> list,
>>>>>
>>>>>> I made an attempt to explore this issue in depth but it didn't go 
>>>>>> very
>>>>>> far.  I sighted what I believed at the time to be inconsistencies in
>>>>>> what
>>>>>> some leaders in the federation were saying and human reality.  It's
>>>>>> human
>>>>>> to laugh at things which are truly funny; even things blindness
>>>>>> related.
>>>>>> Some among the federation leadership, (barbara Pierce for example) 
>>>>>> said
>>>>>> things which I took to be the attitude that it was not acceptable for 
>>>>>> a
>>>>>> blind person to laugh at anything blindness related; even if it was
>>>>>> genuinely funny.  But this philosophy, if you live and breathe it
>>>>>> literally, tends to deny human reality.  What say y'all?
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm just trying to poke at a few points here to see what we can go
>>>>>> with.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>>> The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> E-Mail:
>>>>>> rforetjr at comcast dot net
>>>>>> Skype Name:
>>>>>> barefootedray
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Jul 16, 2010, at 10:51 AM, John G. Heim wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ah! Actually, you bring up an exciting possibility that never 
>>>>>>> occured
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>> me.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> No, I can't honestly say that I've been arguing that the NFB
>>>>>>> philosophy
>>>>>>> should be modified. The trouble is that I've always believed that an
>>>>>>> advocacy group cannot be effective when its own philosophy is that 
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> problem it is organized around is fairly minor. Why bother working 
>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>> change when blindness is a mere nuiscance anyway?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> You're probably saying, "That's not waht the NFB philosophy means."
>>>>>>> And I
>>>>>
>>>>>>> think it should be clear that I know that especially after my
>>>>>>> dissertation about how similar  the NFB philosophy is to Lombardi's.
>>>>>>> The
>>>>>>> problem, as I see it, is that it is impossible to avoid having the
>>>>>>> philosophy to morph into something that blames the victim.  It
>>>>>>> inevitably
>>>>>
>>>>>>> will lead to a situation where its a sin to ask for an accomodation,
>>>>>>> any
>>>>>>> accomodation.  The only solution I see is to get rid of the 
>>>>>>> philosophy
>>>>>>> all together.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Well, that's the only solution I saw until now. Actually, I'm really
>>>>>>> excited about the idea you bring up. Can the philosophy be tweaked 
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>> address the problems I have seen? I'll admit I'm very skeptical. But
>>>>>>> it
>>>>>>> sure is worth some thought and/or discussion.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Actually, I'd consider it a major victory if someone, anyone, would
>>>>>>> acknowledge the problem itself. How can the NFB be effective as an
>>>>>>> advocacy group when its own philosophy is that with proper training,
>>>>>>> blindness can be reduced to a mere nuiscance? If I were President of
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> NFB (scary thought, I know), I could go on for days about how those 
>>>>>>> 2
>>>>>>> ideas are not really contradictory. But as a practical matter, I 
>>>>>>> just
>>>>>>> do
>>>>>>> not think they can work together. And you've got to admit that on 
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> surface, they seem quite at odds.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Ray Foret Jr"
>>>>>>> <rforetjr at comcast.net>
>>>>>>> To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> Sent: Friday, July 16, 2010 9:34 AM
>>>>>>> Subject: [nfb-talk] philosophy taken to another level then?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Okay John,  So, let me see if I understand you correctly.  What 
>>>>>>>> some
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> us have viewed as your attacks on the NFB philosophy are actually 
>>>>>>>> not
>>>>>>>> attacks at all; rather, they are attempts on your part to help the
>>>>>>>> NFB
>>>>>>>> fulfill and perhaps even improve on its  philosophy?  I want you to
>>>>>>>> understand that I do not intend my question as an attack upon you;
>>>>>>>> but,
>>>>>>>> instead, I truly want to see if this is where you are going.
>>>>>>>> Because,
>>>>>>>> if so, I think we may have the beginnings of a rather forward
>>>>>>>> thinking
>>>>>>>> discussion about a substantive way of moving forward that if we
>>>>>>>> advance
>>>>>>>> it to the leadership of the NFB in exactly the right way, we might
>>>>>>>> perhaps gain ground not otherwise obtainable.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>>>>> The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> E-Mail:
>>>>>>>> rforetjr at comcast dot net
>>>>>>>> Skype Name:
>>>>>>>> barefootedray
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Jul 16, 2010, at 9:02 AM, John G. Heim wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I'm impressed with the number of swimmers on this list. Its a good
>>>>>>>>> sign, IMO. It says something about the NFB philosophy.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I may have given the impression that I disapprove of the NFB
>>>>>>>>> philosophy
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> but nothing could be further from the truth. Its very close to my
>>>>>>>>> personal philosophy of life which is borrowed from Vince Lombardi.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> A lot of people think Vince Lombardi was the mean old coach who
>>>>>>>>> would
>>>>>>>>> do anything to win. No, that was not what he was like at all. His
>>>>>>>>> players loved him and still gather to meet each year to honor him.
>>>>>>>>> What
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> he believed was that life's greatest moments come when you meet a
>>>>>>>>> challenge and over come it. That's what life is about. That is 
>>>>>>>>> what
>>>>>>>>> it
>>>>>>>>> is to be human.  You've got to have the will to win, to be the 
>>>>>>>>> best
>>>>>>>>> you
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> can be. Strive for perfection, knowing you'll never obtain it but 
>>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>>> the way there, you'll find three things. First, you'll do more 
>>>>>>>>> than
>>>>>>>>> you
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ever thought you could. Second, you'll find the struggle itself 
>>>>>>>>> can
>>>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>>>> fun. And third, , when you do succeed, it will be the greatest
>>>>>>>>> feeling
>>>>>>>>> you've ever had. So when I went blind, I decided I was going to be
>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> best damn blind guy I could be. I learned braille, tried to learn 
>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>> play the violin, got a guide dog, and got back into running and
>>>>>>>>> swimming.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> The beauty of Lombardi's philosophy is that whenever you run into
>>>>>>>>> adversity, you don't say, "Oh, woe is me. Life is so hard." 
>>>>>>>>> Instead
>>>>>>>>> the response is , "Well, what are you going to do about it?" You
>>>>>>>>> don't
>>>>>>>>> seek out adversity but when it comes, embrace it. Take it on.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Not to create controversy again but like the NFB philosophy, the
>>>>>>>>> problem with Vince Lombardi's philosophy is that it is easily
>>>>>>>>> morphed
>>>>>>>>> into a mentality of showing contempt for losers. You can't live
>>>>>>>>> Lombardi's philosophy and be satisfied -- well ever really since
>>>>>>>>> perfection is impossible to obtain. You can always get better. But
>>>>>>>>> not
>>>>>>>>> everybody has the same strengths and not everyone can win.  And no
>>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>> has any right to tell anyone else how to live their lives.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> anyway, I think you can see the simularity between Lombardi's
>>>>>>>>> philosophy of life and the NFB philosophy. I would say, though, 
>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>> Lombardi's philosophy is a step beyond that of the NFB in that it
>>>>>>>>> gives
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> you a sort of method for carrying it out. The idea of never 
>>>>>>>>> settling
>>>>>>>>> for anything short of success is implied in the NFB philosophy but
>>>>>>>>> not
>>>>>>>>> spelled out. I think Lombardi's take on the NFB philosophy would
>>>>>>>>> have
>>>>>>>>> been that the most important thing in life for a blind person is
>>>>>>>>> striving to reduce blindness to a mere nuisance.  You may never 
>>>>>>>>> get
>>>>>>>>> there but the most important thing is to never be satisfied until 
>>>>>>>>> it
>>>>>>>>> is.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Steve Johnson"
>>>>>>>>> <stevencjohnson at centurytel.net>
>>>>>>>>> To: "'NFB Talk Mailing List'" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, July 15, 2010 7:10 PM
>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] swimming (was: Bard(
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Hi John,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I think it is just cool that you are swimming.  I think the best 
>>>>>>>>>> I
>>>>>>>>>> would at
>>>>>>>>>> my skill level is circles!  Good for you in wanting to be a
>>>>>>>>>> tri-athelete!
>>>>>>>>>> Steve
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>> From: nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On
>>>>>>>>>> Behalf Of John G. Heim
>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, July 15, 2010 11:25 AM
>>>>>>>>>> To: NFB Talk Mailing List
>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] swimming (was: Bard(
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> If you swim laps and if you have a way to stay on your side of 
>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>> lane, I'd
>>>>>>>>>> like to hear about it.  I believe most lap pools have the 
>>>>>>>>>> swimmers
>>>>>>>>>> keep
>>>>>>>>>> right like on a road. You swim up the right side of the lane and 
>>>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>>>> the way
>>>>>>>>>> back you come down the other side. The best I've been able to do 
>>>>>>>>>> is
>>
>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> swim
>>>>>>>>>> with my right arm flailing out so that i can touch the lane 
>>>>>>>>>> divider
>>
>>>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> every
>>>>>>>>>> stroke.  That doesn't really work very well.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> It isn't really very helpful to tell me my skills need to 
>>>>>>>>>> improve.
>>>>>>>>>> After
>>>>>>>>>> all, I already asked for tips on how to improve.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> To: "NFB Talk Mailing List" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, July 15, 2010 9:14 AM
>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] swimming (was: Bard(
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> A lane for yourself alone?  Why?  Is it your swimming skills 
>>>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>>> vastly need improvement; or, perhaps your blindness skills?
>>>>>>>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>>>>>>>> The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> E-Mail:
>>>>>>>>>>> rforetjr at comcast dot net
>>>>>>>>>>> Skype Name:
>>>>>>>>>>> barefootedray
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Jul 15, 2010, at 9:04 AM, John G. Heim wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> So you're a swimmer, huh?  Do you ever have to share a lane? If
>>>>>>>>>>>> so,
>>>>>>>>>>>> how do you do it? I have never managed to do that successfully.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Here
>>>>>>>>>>>> at the pool at the University of Wisconsin, I call ahead and 
>>>>>>>>>>>> they
>>>>>>>>>>>> set
>>>>>>>>>>>> a lane aside for me so I can have it to myself. Its only a 
>>>>>>>>>>>> minor
>>>>>>>>>>>> sacrifice because there are usually several lanes with only one
>>>>>>>>>>>> person in them. So when they reserve a lane for me, it only 
>>>>>>>>>>>> means
>>>>>>>>>>>> one
>>>>>>>>>>>> other person has to share a lane.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Have you ever done any open water swimming? I would like to 
>>>>>>>>>>>> enter
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>> triathlon but I don't like swimming tethered to someone else. I
>>>>>>>>>>>> just
>>>>>>>>>>>> can't get comfortable doing that. It effects my breathing and I
>>>>>>>>>>>> just
>>>>>>>>>>>> can't swim normally.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Wm. Ritchhart"
>>>>>>>>>>>> <william.ritchhart at sbcglobal.net>
>>>>>>>>>>>> To: "'NFB Talk Mailing List'" <nfb-talk at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, July 13, 2010 5:04 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Bard
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I really like the new digital talking book player.  I do wish 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> it
>>>>>>>>>>>>> was
>>>>>>>>>>>>> still smaller and lighter.  With all my swimming gear, lunch,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> back-up cane and everything else I have in my gym bag; it is
>>>>>>>>>>>>> still
>>>>>>>>>>>>> too heavy.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Behalf Of Steve Johnson
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 8:22 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: 'NFB Talk Mailing List'
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [nfb-talk] Bard
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> John, I have not tried one myself yet, so this is good to 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> know.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks, Steve
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:nfb-talk-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Behalf Of John G. Heim
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Monday, July 12, 2010 3:26 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: NFB Talk Mailing List
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [nfb-talk] Bard
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Man, I just got one of those new digital book players from the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> National Library Service.  You might wonder why a computer 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> nerd
>>>>>>>>>>>>> like
>>>>>>>>>>>>> myself took so long to ask for one of those things. Well, I
>>>>>>>>>>>>> guess
>>>>>>>>>>>>> mostly the reason is that I have 2 tape players that I bought
>>>>>>>>>>>>> myself
>>>>>>>>>>>>> plus the one from NLS. So now I have to use the player from 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>> NLS
>>>>>>>>>>>>> all of the time.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> But holy cow, is this thing nice. I downloaded a book and put 
>>>>>>>>>>>>> it
>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>>>>>>> a USB thumb drive and was listening to a book amybe 3 minutes
>>>>>>>>>>>>> after
>>>>>>>>>>>>> getting started. And navigation within the book is very nice.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Your tax dollars at work.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>> nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>>>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>> nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>>>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>> nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>>>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>> nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>> nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>>>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>> nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nfb-talk mailing list
>>>>> nfb-talk at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfb-talk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> nfb-talk mailing list
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>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> nfb-talk mailing list
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>>>
>>>
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