[nfbcs] FW: your advice would be appreciatedFW: [List] Handling

[Steve Jacobson]

Gary,

There is much that has been written with which I already agree, so I want to try to cover some new ground.

First, I think it needs to be established whether the college is covered by any laws regarding accessibility.  I do not know what 
is in place in Canada, whether it is based upon the provision of federal funding as is the case here, and whether the college is 
covered.  If the college is covered by some kind of accessibility requirements, the student needs to be able to take the class and 
efforts need to be made to allow him to do that.  In the short term, it is possible that accessibility might need to be achieved 
through the use of a reader, though.  In courses like this, changing the content of the course to make it accessible might 
actually change the focus of the course beyond what is reasonable.  I don't know that for sure, but it is certainly legitimate to 
make students aware of the need for good visual appearance, and I think it is valid for us to understand the concepts even if we 
can't physically evaluate it for ourselves.  However, it seems questionable to me as valid if a student is not allowed to learn 
because a specific teaching technique or specific software is used.  

If there is no legal requirement, I am still uneasy with arranging for an alternate class.  It potentially will raise red flags if 
the student needs to use someone at the college for a reference, The knowledge gained in this class might well be required in 
subsequent classes.  It could even raise questions as to whether the student really deserves the major in the minds of some.

I think the point needs to be made to the instructor and perhaps even to the student that most of the intent of learning is 
achieving understanding.  We don't major in English to become more skillful on the keyboard, even though that might happen.  If 
the student was going to be a nurse or doctor, perhaps his eyedrop technique would be important, but what is important here is 
gaining an understanding of what is being achieved.  What is sometimes forgotten is that the student may never do much of what is 
taught in this class, but he may be in a position where he has to evaluate the best approach to be used by others he may 
supervise, or he may be creating a project plan.  I have learned software with a reader from time to time that I have never used, 
strictly so I could understand when its use was appropriate when I was leading a project.  Some of this reminds me of a physics 
professor I once had who asked me how he could be expected to teach me about the physical properties of light when I couldn't see 
it.  I pointed out that he taught students about gas even though they could generally not see it, and we arrived at an 
understanding because he simply had not thought about light in the same way.  We became the best of friends by the way and I 
didn't do half bad on the unit on light.

We live in complicated times in many ways, and this is just one more example.  It seems to me that the instructor is looking at 
this situation in a somewhat narrow view, but I believe we also need to be open to the fact that we may in some cases need to work 
with a reader or possibly a teaching assistant to gain an understanding of what is being taught rather than thinking that all 
information can be made readily accessible.

Best regards,

Steve Jacobson

On Tue, 25 Jun 2013 07:43:06 -0500, Gary Wunder wrote:

>Folks, can you help me in helping a student who wants to know if it is
>realistic for him to take a class in computer design?

>Thank you.

>Gary

>-----Original Message-----
>From: Mary ellen [mailto:gabias at telus.net]
>Sent: Monday, June 24, 2013 2:25 PM
>To: Wunder, Gary
>Subject: your advice would be appreciatedFW: [List] Handling

>Hi Gary,

>I just received the following correspondence from and about a student who is
>part of CFB.  I don't know enough about the specific issues to answer him.
>This strikes me as one more example of us playing catch up with software
>that isn't accessible in any meaningful way.  Is he right to drop the
>course, or is the teacher being a grump?  Are there alternative ways to
>demonstrate proficiency with the concepts but using different software as
>Eric suggests?  The teacher says "My main concern is that this is a design
>course, and as such it is a highly visual course. Some of the concerns I
>have are documented in my earlier e-mail - in addition to that, there is a
>module on creating Flash Video in the course and I am pretty sure that this
>will be problematic, and I am not sure how Karl-Erik will be able to perform
>tasks such as using an eyedropper tool to sample colours from an image when
>developing a colour scheme for a website.."  Is that correct, or is it an
>example of a sighted person believing lots of things are too visual for us
>to grasp.  Would working with a reader help?  So many blind people don't
>even consider that option these days.

>Sorry to hit you with these questions so close to convention.  I'd say leave
>it until afterw Orlando, but then you have the Convention Roundup to write.


>I thought you did a masterful job with the sad Oklahoma story.  Mike's a
>very bright guy who cares a lot!  It's a shame that he self-destructed.  The
>entire June issue was good, as is true with the Monitor generally.

>Mary Ellen


>-----Original Message-----
>From: karl-erik at Sonvisen.com [mailto:karl-erik at Sonvisen.com]
>Sent: Monday, June 24, 2013 11:16 AM
>To: list at cfb.ca
>Subject: [List] Handling


>As of May,  I'm enrolled this fall for a full course load, and while sorting
>out textbooks, a teacher whom I've had before, emails the school's
>disability resource center concerning their course's accessibility. To
>summarize, this was one of the last lines in the email:

>Quote
>: "I don't want to be faced with the highly time-consuming task of
>recreating course materials and exams for a single use."
>Unquote

>This is perhaps the most insulting thing I've ever heard, to me as a
>disabled person, to all students, and to the school itself.

>The crux of the matter is that the course is a web design and maintenance
>course using specific and very expensive software to achieve results that
>I've known how to do since middle school using notepad. However, because of
>the specific programs used, I'm not able to challenge the course without the
>unfair disadvantage of not knowing those programs, even though I know how to
>achieve the desired results perhaps/probably better than the other students.

>I understand this is a highly visual course, however, I'm not the one who
>decided to make it mandatory for their bachelor program, and I'm not the one
>who put it together using ninaccessible software. regardless, I will likely
>end up seeking an alternative course simply to avoid this teacher.

>Anyways, I'd like to know if anyone has any other suggestions on handling
>this? I've attached the teacher's previous emails for your perusal.

>Thanks in advance,
>Karl-Erik

>Most recent email:

>No I have no objection to you copying my e-mail and sending it to Karl-Erik.

>He took another course from me earlier (BUS 141), but this was a much less
>visual course and this still seemed to present some problems for him.
>Also, we had to rewrite all of our exams in BUS 140 as the screen reader was
>unable to work with the Flash based simulations in MyITLab, which was very
>time consuming for us as they were only used the one-time.

>My main concern is that this is a design course, and as such it is a highly
>visual course. Some of the concerns I have are documented in my earlier
>e-mail - in addition to that, there is a module on creating Flash Video in
>the course and I am pretty sure that this will be problematic, and I am not
>sure how Karl-Erik will be able to perform tasks such as using an eyedropper
>tool to sample colours from an image when developing a colour scheme for a
>website..

>In addition to my concerns about the highly visual nature of a design
>course, there is also the issue of the Adobe Creative Suite software. We
>have a limited set of licenses which are all in use in our dedicated lab as
>the licenses are very expensive. The issue will be with exams for which we
>cannot supply a license for DRC, or for Karl-Eric's personal use. We use
>Adobe CS6 - I am not sure if this is available anymore as Adobe has replaced
>it with a cloud based version (CS7) for which you have to pay a monthly fee.
>We are staying with CS6 as we already have the licenses for it, but I am
>unsure as to Adobe's policy about selling CS 6 - I know that you cannot buy
>earlier versions of software from Microsoft for example. We also use a very
>old version of ExamView for course quizzes and for part of the final exam
>and I don't know if the screen reader software is capable of reading the
>question and answer choices from this tool.

>While I fully support the work that DRC does to help students, and fully
>support DRC students in my courses, I am very anxious about having a blind
>student in a design course that relies so heavily on the visual aspects of
>design, and I don't want to be faced with the highly time-consuming task of
>recreating course materials and exams for a single use.

>It is for these reasons that I am wondering if another course would be a
>more suitable choice for someone with Karl-Eric's specific disability.
>End most recent email.

>Start first email, (sent to a DRC Counsellor):

>I wanted to check in with you before I answer Karl regarding the textbook
>and software as I am wondering if a website design course is an appropriate
>course for a blind student to take. The issue is that much of this course is
>visual - we use graphic design software (Photoshop) to process photographs
>(cropping, colour contrast, contrast and brightness, levels, and sharpening
>for example), and we use Fireworks to develop website banners, buttons, and
>filler graphics. These are all highly visual tasks. In addition, we use CSS
>for page layout (Dreamweaver), and students must be able to see if they have
>"column-drops" and other broken layout issues. I am not sure that screen
>reader software is capable of supporting these tasks in the web design
>environment.

>End first email.



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