[nfbmi-talk] Fw: [acb-l] employment strategies and disclosure
joe harcz Comcast
joeharcz at comcast.net
Wed Apr 6 04:59:03 UTC 2011
Dear All,
This is a self proclaimed bigot. Her services such as they might be
should be boycotted.
----- Original Message -----
From: "J.Rayl" <thedogmom63 at frontier.com>
To: "Mitch Pomerantz" <mitch.pomerantz at earthlink.net>
Cc: "Acb List" <acb-l at acb.org>
Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2011 10:37 PM
Subject: Re: [acb-l] employment strategies and disclosure
> Well, I can guarantee you that, even though I am blind, were I
> interviewing
> for a position in my office, I'd be downright ticked off, and that is
> putting it mildly, if some blind person wasted my freaking time by
> applying
> for a job, then waltzing into my office without telling me she / he was
> also
> blind. And, I'll be danged if they'd get the pleasure of wasting much of
> it. First, I'd wonder just what else she / he was hiding.
> Second, most people just don't think its so cool to be surprised or
> embarrassed or downright humiliated--and that's exactly what it is.
> Yes, as a potential employer, I have the responsibility not to be
> discriminatory, and I'm not. Other people with disabilities have the
> responsibility to be halfway respectful and reasonable as well.
> And, I'll give you a perfect example. My office is not wheelchair
> accessible. So someone called whose husband uses a wheelchair. She didn't
> bother to ask if it was wheelchair accessible, and the appointment was for
> her, not him. So, she jumps out of her van and proceeds to bust in,
> running
> off at the mouth about filing a complaint against me. I asked whether she
> wanted information about Human Rights or my license Board, and for what
> reason. She informed me her husband wanted to come with her and my office
> was not WCA.
> I said, "Well, before you really file that complaint, you might want to
> reconsider. Had you asked, I would have told you that no, it is not;
> however, I make accommodations to people who need this in another place
> that
> is." Well, the wind blew straight out of her little sails.
> So it really doesn't pay to be quite so arogant sometimes.
>
>
> Jessie Rayl
> EM: thedogmom63 at frontier.com
> PH:304.671.9780
> www.facebook.com/eaglewings10
>
> "But they that wait upon the LORD shall renew their strength; they shall
> mount up with wings as eagles. They shall run, and not be weary"--Isaiah
> 40.31
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Mitch Pomerantz" <mitch.pomerantz at earthlink.net>
> To: "'Jessi Rayl'" <thedogmom63 at frontier.com>; "'peter altschul'"
> <paltschul at centurytel.net>
> Cc: <acb-l at acb.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2011 7:22 PM
> Subject: RE: [acb-l] employment strategies and disclosure
>
>
> Jessie:
>
> I essentially agree with you and as my friend Peter has indicated, he and
> I
> have rather differing views on this issue.
>
> As someone who has conducted my share of interviews over the years, I can
> tell you firsthand that interviewers absolutely do not like surprises.
> That
> is why I mention my blindness prior to going in for the interview. That
> initial 30 seconds or one or two minutes (Andy is being generous, I think)
> where interviewers are making their initial assessment shouldn't be taken
> up
> with the interviewers' shock over having a blind candidate with a cane or
> guide dog in the office. And, as Andy has pointed out, pre-interview
> computer tests are quite prevalent; that's one way to obtain a writing
> sample that you know hasn't been doctored ahead of time.
>
> Because I've been involved in blindness and disability activities for as
> long as I have, my resume is chock full of mentions of ACB, CCB, and my
> time
> with the California Governor's Committee on Employment of Disabled
> Persons.
> Right now, if I were applying for another job, I'd list the fact that I've
> been appointed by the former Governor to serve on the California
> Commission
> on Disability Access.
>
> My bottom line in all of this is that 1. my time is too valuable to waste
> on
> an employer who can't be told upfront that I am blind; and 2. not telling
> that employer is more likely than not to result in the would-be employer
> attempting to get over his or her surprise at having to deal with one of
> us.
> Truly, I've never heard of someone getting a job where he or she overcame
> the interviewers' initial surprise. It's probably happened; but then
> again,
> if the blind candidate got the job, he or she may well have gotten it if
> they'd been upfront from the get-go.
>
>
> Mitch
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: acb-l-bounces at acb.org [mailto:acb-l-bounces at acb.org] On Behalf Of
> Jessi Rayl
> Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2011 3:28 PM
> To: 'peter altschul'
> Cc: acb-l at acb.org
> Subject: Re: [acb-l] employment strategies and disclosure
>
> Hi. Well, I do a couple things here. First, I make my coverletter /
> resume
> about my work, my education and my abilities. It probably will not state,
> specifically, that I am totally blind, however I am associated with
> blindness-related things and will not leave these off nor will I go to any
> great lengths to hide that, or other, obvious give-aways to disability.
> Also, when obtaining that interview, I will, once I get it, let them know
> of
> this fact. There are several reasons: 1. I never, ever have anyone take
> me
> to an interview. If they do, they park well down the block and drop me
> off
> and I find my own way, which means I've got to get some pretty specific
> directions, but I get their on my own--even if it means the office staff
> have to tell me (no they do not come out to get me) how to get there.
> 2. Some interviews are now done via lunch meetings and the last thing I
> want to have happen is the same thing that happened to my blind friend who
> was adamant about not telling of her blindness. She waltzed in with her
> blindness, her dog and was suddenly confronted with a group of folks ready
> to get in cars to go to lunch. Well, she had no car, no driver and no way
> to get there. Guess what she didn't get?
> They rescheduled an interview, in an office, and she didn't get the job.
> So me? I would inquire about how and where the interviews are conducted,
> e.g., are they group, etc. The more info I, and they, have ahead of time,
> the better prepared we all are. And then, if I suspected I was not
> selected, I'd take action at that point. And I have, did, and got a job
> as
> a result of it too.
>
> Jessie
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: acb-l-bounces at acb.org [mailto:acb-l-bounces at acb.org] On Behalf Of
> peter altschul
> Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2011 5:37 PM
> To: acb-l at acb.org
> Subject: Re: [acb-l] employment strategies and disclosure
>
> Hi:
>
> As I'm sure others have told you, disclosing is a very personal choice.
> For
> me, I usually find it most effective not to disclose until I actually show
> up for the interview. It's important to stress that my work has generally
> been in the for-profit and noprofit sectors only marhinally related to
> disability. I would disclose earlier for federal government jobs because
> of
> Schedule A considerations; also, for jobs in the disability sector. I
> wrote
> an article explaining my rationale for this; if anyone is interested, let
> me
> know and I will try to find it.
>
> BTW, I know our esteemed President disagrees with me on this.
>
> And one more thing: this issue may be less relevant because in many cases,
> an employer will Google your name and will be pretty sure that you have a
> disability based on the information there.
>
> Best, Peter
>
>
>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>From: "Baracco, Andrew W" <Andrew.Baracco at va.gov
>>To: <acb-l at acb.org
>>Date sent: Tue, 5 Apr 2011 14:11:18 -0700
>>Subject: Re: [acb-l] employment strategies and disclosure
>
>>Job Fairs are very popular today. Dealing with job fairs is part
> of my job. I am either on the other side of the table, representing the
> VA
> as an employer, or I am there accompanying some of my clients. There are
> so
> many people there that having someone go with you
>
>>Would not be noticed, but your guide should stay in the
> background, and you should approach the table alone. You can have your
> guide assist you in filling out an app, if that is being done on the spot.
> As for disclosing blindness, usually it would not be a good idea to
> mention
> it on a resume unless perhaps you are applying to work at a blindness or
> disability services organization, like an independent living center, but
> it
> should be couched in functional terms, like the fact that you taught
> Braille, or something like that. I used to believe that you should never
> disclose it at all, but my thinking has changed a bit over the years. I
> think that a good time to disclose might be when you are contacted about
> arranging an interview.
> Sometimes as part of the interview process, there may be a test, or some
> kind of functional activity, such as a role play, or perhaps doing
> something
> with the computer, etc. When scheduling the interview, you might want to
> ask if there will be such an activity, and ask if you can bring someone to
> assist, or if they can provide someone to assist. Remember that many
> people
> have never interacted with a blind person before, and you don’t want to
> spend your interview time helping them to deal with the shock.
> One reason that my thinking has changed on this issue is because in 2005
> we
> started a supported employment program for persons with severe mental
> illness. Many have issues that make it difficult for them to pursue
> employment without assistance and support. Many are good workers once
> they
> get acclimated to the job, but they cannot tolerate the stress that
> accompanies job seeking, and beginning a new job in a new place, with new
> people, etc. The employment specialist often must help to sell the
> employer
> on giving the person a try. To my surprise, we have found that employers
> are willing to take a chance when they know what the issues are, and, in
> this case, that they have a resource to consult if there are problems. If
> the employer knows that you are blind up front, there is the chance that
> they will balk, but if they don’t, you will have the opportunity to make
> the interview work in your favor rather than spending 15 minutes helping
> the
> interviewer to settle down. Remember that interviewers make judgments
> within the first minute or two, so you want to have the opportunity to use
> that time to sell yourself as an employee, not a disabled employee. I am
> often asked where there are jobs for disabled persons. I tell them that
> there are no jobs for disabled workers, just jobs for good workers.
>
>
>
>>Andy
>
>
>
>>From: acb-l-bounces at acb.org [mailto:acb-l-bounces at acb.org] On
> Behalf Of bookwormahb at earthlink.net
>>Sent: Tuesday, April 05, 2011 1:00 PM
>>To: Acb List
>>Subject: [acb-l] employment strategies and disclosure
>
>
>
>>Hi all,
>
>
>
>>I was wondering about your employment strategies over the years.
>
>>What worked for you? Networking? If so where? Did you join
> certain clubs or interest groups?
>
>>Did you go to job fairs with someone?
>
>>If so, how did you stand out in the crowd from other job seekers?
>
>>I’m intraverted so selling myself and speaking to the
> recruiters is hard.
>
>>I state my education and what I’m looking for and my
> background; but not sure if I stand out from others.
>
>>I go with someone sighted to these because they are very very
> crowded and I need to know where certain tables are.
>
>>Also, when in the employment search do you disclose your blind?
>
>>I do not do this initially on my cover letter or resume; except
> if its for the government.
>
>
>
>>Thanks.
>
>
>
>>Ashley
>
>>ûï¿
>
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