[Quietcars] Quieter trains a risk to walkers, USA Today, 04/05/10

Thu Jul 22 00:13:10 UTC 2010

I will say this then I'll shut up.
You do make a very good point.
I can't stand motorcycles, they are loud.
I don't mine loud pickups, because I'm a redneck and think there cool.
I also love trains, there for they don't bother me, but I have a friend who 
is about 4 miles from a train and it wakes him up, because he don't like 
them.
My friend here can't understand how pickups don't bother me, but the bikes 
do, I can't explain it.
Its the same when people play there music loud in there car, I don't mind 
when it is something I like, but when its something I don't like, then I 
think in my head.
Why don't they turn that crap down.
I think that's what you are saying
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "michael townsend" <mrtownsend at optonline.net>
To: "'Discussion of new quiet cars and pedestrian safety'" 
<quietcars at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2010 6:46 PM
Subject: Re: [Quietcars] Quieter trains a risk to walkers, USA 
Today,04/05/10


> Replying more to Dewey's and your point, many people wish to not be
> disturbed, with quieter pipes on motorcycles supposedly ruining their 
> quiet
> little town images, and cruise nights with older cars and loud exhausts
> causing issues on Friday and Saturday nights.
>
> But, to the point of this quiet being disturbed and disquieting residents 
> of
> sleepy communities, if a bell or horn were not sounded and a resident's
> child were stuck or a loved one was hit because a signal was shut down,
> probably, a law suit would be filed by those who placed the very 
> legislation
> in for discussion at a town council meeting, and therein lies the problem.
>
> When I read that a town in Colorado was ordered to supposedly shut down 
> the
> audible traffic signals by, I believe it was the NFB, because of some
> mobility issue, I was greatly disturbed.  And, I'm thinking out loud here,
> that there was an incident where someone from that town was either killed 
> or
> injured because of this or in some way related to this, then you see where
> this could end up.
>
> Please take this discussion of explanation off list, as I would like to be
> correct on what the facts are regarding this situation in Colorado. 
> Thanks.
> But, that clearly illustrates my point.  Whether the audible signal is 
> used
> as a mobility aid or not, some folks find them annoying and their sounds
> obtrusive in others lives.  And, my thoughts are, if they aid one person 
> in
> making a safe crossing, they're worth the money that they cost in being
> erected.  If they are an artificial aid to crossing matters not to me.  In
> certain circumstances, they mean being able to safely cross and not.  And,
> having lived in a city in Florida where I had to cross ten to twelve lanes
> on a major highway, the safety factor was a good enough reason for me to
> have one, noise or not.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: quietcars-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:quietcars-bounces at nfbnet.org] 
> On
> Behalf Of michael townsend
> Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2010 7:31 PM
> To: 'Discussion of new quiet cars and pedestrian safety'
> Subject: Re: [Quietcars] Quieter trains a risk to walkers, USA Today,
> 04/05/10
>
> How is this troublesome?  Is it because some of the blame for quiet car
> responsibility is pushed to the pedestrian, or that the higher stats of
> teenaged accidents or deaths, whether they be caused by wearing music
> devices or suicide, may blemish some of the great work that the ACB and 
> NFB
> have been doing regarding such legislation?  I think not, Deb, as our work
> should have nothing to do with this train reporting, except that it points
> out that people don't tend to pay as much attention as they ought to or 
> that
> they aren't as familiar with pedestrian rules of the road as they pertain 
> to
> the quieter vehicles, be they bus, train, car or truck.
>
> I think that this is exactly the kind of piece we need to alert those who
> travel in towns and cities where subways are readily available, and that
> quieter buses and trucks in towns with green intentions abound, and in
> places which are becoming more and more familiar in which hybrids are part
> of the landscape.
>
> I think that, coupled with this quieter environment, we are jostled about 
> by
> persons who aren't paying attention to their daily travels as well, 
> because
> they're too busy texting, talking on the phones, using GPS devices, etc., 
> or
> just chatting away.  It would be incumbent upon us to not fall into those
> bad habits so that we can't be accused of the same.  Working a guide, 
> while
> on the cellular phone, and listening to a GPS device may be doable, but at 
> a
> great risk.  And, I would imagine that utilizing a cane under these
> circumstances might be even more involved.
>
> We had a comment about "hillbillies" liking their trucks and cars loud, 
> last
> week during the convention season.  Now, it's time that we awaken 
> ourselves
> with articles such as this to remind ourselves that we need to get back to
> tracking the business at hand now that the convention season is pretty 
> well
> put to bed, at least on a national level; and that we have to work
> tirelessly to import our ideas to the state and local levels of our
> particular blindness organizations, be they guide dog schools, mobility
> training counselors, or state agencies from which we receive help.  , in
> order to make this quieter car or, more importantly, quieter vehicle issue 
> a
> part of the everyday discussion.
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: quietcars-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:quietcars-bounces at nfbnet.org] 
> On
> Behalf Of Deborah Kent Stein
> Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2010 3:46 PM
> To: Discussion of new quiet cars and pedestrian safety
> Subject: Re: [Quietcars] Quieter trains a risk to walkers, USA Today,
> 04/05/10
>
>
>
> Very troubling.  Do we want to link this to our site?  It takes our 
> concerns
> in a new direction, but it's certainly related to the work we've been 
> doing.
>
> Debbie
>
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Nightingale, Noel" <Noel.Nightingale at ed.gov>
> To: <quietcars at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Wednesday, July 21, 2010 10:30 AM
> Subject: [Quietcars] Quieter trains a risk to walkers, USA Today, 04/05/10
>
>
>>
>> Quieter trains a risk to walkers
>>
>> By Larry Copeland
>>
>> Pedestrian deaths remain steady even as fatalities from train-vehicle
>> crashes decline
>>
>> Anna Marie Stickel, 14, missed the school bus that morning. So she
>> took a shortcut along some railroad tracks that made her trek to
>> school about 10 minutes; going the long, safe way around would have
>> taken 30-40 minutes, her
>>
>> mother says.
>>
>> Listening to her iPod as she and a friend walked along the tracks in
>> January, Anna Marie of Middle River, Md., was hit and killed by an
>> Amtrak train.
>>
>> Anna Marie's friend, who was not listening to music, heard the train
>> just in
>>
>> time to jump to safety, says Anna Marie's mother, Tara Stickel, 38.
>> They are
>>
>> deadly quiet," she says of today's trains and tracks. My baby girl had
>> no idea. I know for a fact she hadn't been told how dangerous they
>> are. And I am just as much to blame for that. I never saw those tracks as
> a threat.
>>
>> Rail-safety advocates and federal authorities are trying to determine
>> how to
>>
>> reduce fatalities involving trains and pedestrians, which far outstrip
>> deaths in train-vehicle collisions.
>>
>> Over the past 10 years, the number of deaths involving trains and
>> motor vehicles has dropped 42% to 248. In the same period, deaths
>> involving pedestrians have fallen  6% to 434, the Federal Railroad
>> Administration says. That's (incidents with pedestrians) the No. 1
>> cause of death in the railroad industry," FRA spokesman Rob Kulat says.
>>
>> Rail-safety advocates are especially concerned about teenagers killed
>> accidentally by trains in hangout spots on or near the tracks. We are
>> working so hard to try to figure out a way to turn this around," says
>> Marmie
>>
>> Edwards of Operation Lifesaver, an international rail-safety advocacy
>> group.
>>
>> It may be that in some parts of the country, the railroad tracks are a
>> little bit secluded," Edwards says. So (teens) think it's a place
>> where they
>>
>> can go to just hang out without other people knowing what they're doing.
>> Sometimes, when you tell this age group this is not where you should
>> go, that's where they're going to want to go
>>
>> A quiet danger
>>
>> Trains are a lot quieter than they used to be.
>>
>> Rails are built in longer, continuous sections of track, so the
>> familiar "clackety-clack" of wheels on the track is gone in many
>> places. The trains themselves are quieter. Communities across the USA
>> have enacted "quiet zones," where operators are barred from sounding
>> their horns during certain times of day.
>>
>> That quiet is one reason the number of pedestrians killed by trains
>> has remained steady. Another reason: Many people wear headphones or
>> talk on cellphones while ambling along railroad tracks.
>>
>> When you have train tracks this near high schools or middle schools
>> and students use it as a shortcut, you really need to educate children
>> on what's
>>
>> going on," says Rep. C.A. Dutch Ruppersberger, D-Md., who helped set
>> up train-safety assemblies at Anna Marie's high school.
>>
>> People take shortcuts across the tracks. Hunters walk along them.
>> People ride all-terrain vehicles on them and sit on them to fish.
>>
>> Many people simply fail to understand how dangerous trains are, says
>> Richard
>>
>> Ratcliffe, executive director of Maryland Operation Lifesaver, which
>> puts on
>>
>> safety lessons for students and others.
>>
>> We tell them the train overhangs on each side by at least 3 feet, and
>> they can overhang by as much as 12," Ratcliffe says. We tell them they
>> don't build trains like they did, and they're a lot quieter. We
>> explain why walking or walking the dog or hanging out on tracks is so
>> dangerous and why it's against the law.
>>
>> Looking at suicides
>>
>> It's unclear how many of the deaths are intentional. Kulat says the
>> FRA does
>>
>> not track suicides but estimates that 20% to 50% of train-pedestrian
>> deaths involve people taking their own lives. Railroads reporting a
>> death soon will
>>
>> have to indicate whether it was a suicide.
>>
>> Of 33,000 annual suicides in the USA, 1%-2% occur on railroads.
>> Suicide by rail is "highly lethal, and it's accessible," says Matthew
>> Wintersteen, clinical psychologist at Philadelphia's Thomas Jefferson
>> University and a member of the Pennsylvania Youth Suicide Prevention
>> Initiative. If we can restrict access to lethal means, we can reduce
>> the number of suicides. The problem, of course, is ... can we restrict
>> public access to the train tracks?
>>
>> Among recent intentional teen deaths:
>>
>> *Two girls in Delaware killed themselves in February by stepping in
>> front of
>>
>> a high-speed Amtrak train. The girls had made a suicide pact,
>> according to police.
>>
>> *A high school freshman in Pleasanton, Calif., stepped in front of a
>> Union Pacific train near her school in February.
>>
>> Kulat says a freight train going 60 mph takes about a mile to stop
>> after the
>>
>> emergency brake is applied. You can't stop. You can't turn, obviously.
>> You just have to watch it happen. ... There's the trauma that train
>> engineers go
>>
>> through (after hitting someone). They go through post-traumatic stress
>> counseling. The one thing they talk about is that they see the
>> people's eyes
>>
>> right before they hit them. A lot of those engineers don't return to 
>> work.
>>
>>
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