[stylist] critiquing your own poetry and others.

Tue Dec 6 18:06:45 UTC 2011

Barbara,
Here is an article from The Writer Magazine on critiquing your own and
others poetry.
We all have to start somewhere. Critiquing others poetry has never come easy
for me, but I read and re-read this article, and am slowly internalizing
most of what this writer says.

Critiquing Poetry (Including Your Own
by Gwyneth Box
It's always difficult to be objective about your own writing, because of the
personal associations. Despite this, if you hope to find a publisher, you
must try and write as well as you can, which includes objective assessment
and often ruthless editing.
Here are some things to consider when critiquing your own or other poets'
work:
Subject. If the poem is personal, does it rise above the purely individual
and become more widely relevant? It's easy to forget that poetry is art, not
a diary entry, nor journalism. It does not have to reflect the truth exactly
as it happened. The facts are no more than raw materials and you should
manipulate, adapt and polish until they fit your needs. This alteration
gives you a greater chance of writing something that touches other people,
rather than something that is dismissed as an adolescent angst poem.
Does the poem deal with one of the 'big' subjects like love or peace?. If
so, does it show a new perspective? Or is it stating what has already been
said many times? It's usually better to avoid the big issues, or, at least,
not to try and deal with the whole thing at once: one specific small
incident or image is usually worth a lot more than overwhelming
generalizations which tend to result in cliché-ridden verse.
Title. Not all poems have a title, but if they do, it should add something
to the piece. The first line is useful for reference or filing purposes, but
rarely works as a title. Nor should you necessarily use a direct quote from
the poem. This is particularly true of short poems where the repetition of a
phrase in title and poem may detract from its effectiveness.
Form and Structure. There are many formal poetry structures (sonnets,
sestinas, dizains, villanelles etc), but sometimes one is more appropriate
than another. A well- written sonnet, for example, is a lovely tool for
putting forward two contrasting ideas or views of one subject, and then
rounding off with a conclusion in the couplet. It is not, however, the ideal
form for narrating a story.
Of course you don't need to use a traditional form: there's nothing wrong
with free verse, if it's the best form for what you're trying to say. But do
make a conscious decision: the form and content should complement each
other.
Rhyme. Rhyming couplets and iambic quatrains are difficult to use for
serious poetry as the idea often gets subordinated to the form, resulting in
doggerel. The same is true of constant end-rhyme: it's tempting to twist the
word order, or use archaic vocabulary, to force the content to fit the form.
Remember that you can use half rhyme, which is less obtrusive than full
rhyme, and internal rhyme, too. And, of course, there are other sound
devices such as assonance and alliteration, which can (and perhaps should)
be used.
Meter. Very few people nowadays believe that verse must have a perfectly
regular meter; however, it is still an important aspect of poetry. Even free
verse makes use of rhythm to convey or strengthen meaning. One way to find
out if your poem works metrically is to read it out loud. If you find that
you have to put unnatural stress on an article or preposition, or you have
to scurry to cram too many syllables in too short a space, go back and
re-work it. Don't ever be satisfied with 'I can make it sound right'; ask
yourself honestly if someone else could.
One more thing -- don't think that slipping in an extra article, pronoun,
'and' or 'but' to make it scan is always the best solution: consider whether
that syllable is really necessary. Don't pad; rewrite.
Layout and line breaks. Line breaks and verse structure don't automatically
make something a poem. The breaks work together with punctuation to show the
reader how the poem is to be read. Again, reading out loud is important to
find the natural pauses, and the places where you need to guide the reader.
A common beginners' error is to end-stop all lines instead of using
enjambment -- where the grammatical sense continues beyond the line end onto
the next line -- which can make a big difference to the flow. In rhyming
poetry enjambment can make the rhyme less obtrusive.
Poetry has been described as writing where the author has more control than
the typesetter over the finished presentation. Even so, it's important to
think carefully before you start using complex designs. You may think that
your work looks better centered, or with every second line indented, but
what does this actually add to the poem? A weak poem will not be improved by
fancy layout.
Of course it can be fun to fit a piece about a mouse into the animal shape
or to give it a long tail, as Lewis Carroll did, but is it more than a
gimmick? Remember that poetry is, to a great extent, a verbal art form: do
you really want your poem to rely on visual presentation?
Sound. I've already suggested reading out loud, but it's so important that I
have no hesitation in repeating myself. The sound of poetry is fundamental,
and unless you read each draft out loud again and again you cannot begin to
make the best choices. By which I mean choices of vocabulary, punctuation,
line breaks: they are all so tightly interwoven that they can hardly be
considered separately.
Incidentally, reading out loud also helps with proof reading, which is
fundamental: it's extremely irritating to see an otherwise effective poem
ruined by typographic errors. If the poets care so little for their own work
that they aren't prepared to use a dictionary or spell checker, why should I
be interested in it?
•	Finally, a few more points that you need to be on the Clichés:
'Emerald green hills' and 'wintry winds' have been described so often that
they should be avoided, as should 'poetical' words like 'heart', 'soul',
'moonlight' and 'love'. They may be fine in parody, but it's very hard to
write something new and serious using such worn vocabulary.
•	Internally consistent images: metaphors and similes are a poet's
tools, but they need to have some kind of internal logic. Consider 'the
train disappeared into the tunnel like a mouse into its hole'. It's true
that the tunnel entrance might be like a mouse hole, but can the train be
like a mouse? It isn't shaped like a mouse, nor does it move like one. Try
and be as objective as possible about your comparisons and images. Will they
work for other people?
•	Appropriate vocabulary: you may consider that moggy, pussy, cat and
feline are synonyms, but I don't think you could necessarily use them all in
a serious poem.
•	Superfluous adjectives and adverbs: often the image comes across
more effectively if the reader has to work a bit: don't use a list of
adjectives where one judiciously chosen one will work as well. Each
adjective tends to weaken the noun; each adverb weakens the verb.
•	Showing or telling: if you say 'I was happy' I have to take your
word for it. If, instead, tell me the symptoms of your happiness -- how you
saw the world around you, how your body felt etc -- I can deduce your
happiness for myself and empathize with it.
Don't forget that all these factors must work together. Form, content,
vocabulary, layout... all of them are part of a poem, and if used well, the
whole will be greater than the sum of the parts.
Copyright © 2001 Gwyneth Box
Born in Britain but a long-term resident of Spain, Gwyneth Box has been
writing both poetry and prose for many years. She began to seek publication
in the late 1990s, since when her work has appeared in magazines and
anthologies, and she has received various awards for her poetry. Her
background includes information technology and teaching, and she now edits
the Patchword.com writers' resource website.
MORE RESOURCES FROM THE EDITOR:

-----Original Message-----
From: stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of Barbara Hammel
Sent: Monday, December 05, 2011 2:12 PM
To: Writer's Division Mailing List
Subject: Re: [stylist] A new list for book discussions

I, for one, am terrified that someone will say my poetry is really crap and 
should just junk it all because who'd read that stupid, old-fashioned 
rhyming stuff any way--if I did get brave enough to try publishing.
I usually write poems and what comes out is the final draft, meaning I never

edit my stuff.  No, I don't think I'm that good that every one is a polished

poem that has nothing wrong with it.  I just don't know how to edit.  My 
composition teachers in college and high school had this same problem with 
me because in my head is this thought that says "I write what I mean so how 
can I change it if that's what I meant to say."  I know this is wrong, and 
I'd love to be able to change it so maybe my work could be better than it 
is.
I also think if someone ccritiques it and I change something, it's not truly

my work any more but needs that person's credit, too.  Wrong?  I'm sure it 
is.
Most folks here aren't poets any way, and how do you critique such a 
personal thing as a poem.
Maybe I should try my hand at writing a novel but my characters there are 
too two-dimentional.

Okay, that's from my heart about why I seldom want to post writing.  Next?
Barbara

Let every nation know whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall pay 
any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend, oppose 
any foe, in order to assure the survival and the success of liberty.--John 
F. Kennedy
-----Original Message----- 
From: Bridgit Pollpeter
Sent: Monday, December 05, 2011 2:11 PM
To: stylist at nfbnet.org
Subject: [stylist] A new list for book discussions

Nor does Microsoft Word info and tips, writing and word definitions,
philosophical discussions and debates, debates in general, book
recommendations, how the weather is, how the kids are, who's sick, who's
going to convention... In the few years I've been a part of Stylist, the
majority of posts have revolved around the topics I mention and more. I,
personally, have no problem with this, but from time to time, I see post
ranting about alleged off-topic threads, and people stating what is and
is not appropriate for Stylist, and I have to wonder why this is. If
Stylist was a serious writers online community, we all would be
consistently posting writing pieces we're working on, and as a
community, we would provide constructive criticism and other feedback,
which would be internalized by each author and considered in their
revision. This only happens occasionally, and when someone does post
actual material they're working on, it's rare to have more than 2 or 3
people provide comments. So, how exactly are book discussion or book
reviews not good ideas for Stylist? And to be blunt, most of those
against such a forum on Stylist rarely post their writing. If this
listserve is suppose to be for sharing and critiquing writing, why does
this rarely happen, and if someone is so against anything else posted
here, why do they not share writing of their own? Just my two cents.

Sincerely,
Bridgit Kuenning-Pollpeter
Read my blog at:
http://blogs.livewellnebraska.com/author/bpollpeter/

"History is not what happened; history is what was written down."
The Expected One- Kathleen McGowan

Message: 12
Date: Sun, 4 Dec 2011 20:22:03 -0600
From: "Barbara Hammel" <poetlori8 at msn.com>
To: "Writer's Division Mailing List" <stylist at nfbnet.org>
Subject: Re: [stylist] A new list just for book discussions
Message-ID: <SNT139-ds1402ECBBC9D4AA0713D2F3EBB50 at phx.gbl>
Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
reply-type=original

Justin has a point.  That's why I suggested doing it on the writer's
chat
list.  Talking about books we've read isn't talking about how to write
or
how to get published or where to find sources for research. Talking
about books we've read is just that.  Reading aids us in being
better writers but it's not about our writing.
Just my two dollars worth--you know, inflation and all that rot. Barbara

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