[stylist] Creative nonfiction is not made-up material

Mon Mar 5 17:12:23 UTC 2012

It was James Frey, the book _A Million Little Pieces_
Frey has had a very successful writing career. He was actively engaged in 
writing successful screen plays before Oprah made him Uber-famous. And, of 
course has published best selling books since that time. Like it or not, he 
wrote a "good" book and keeps right on writing good books. It all made for 
good TV viewing and as we know it is memorable. Here we are, 8 years after 
the face, and talking about this author today.

Lynda
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Jacqueline Williams" <jackieleepoet at cox.net>
To: "'Writer's Division Mailing List'" <stylist at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, March 05, 2012 11:52 AM
Subject: Re: [stylist] Creative nonfiction is not made-up material

> Lynda,
> This is a wonderful metaphor.
> I am so stimulated by two excellent writers with differing points of view.
> I am trying to think of the name of the man who wrote a best-selling 
> memoir
> that was selected by Oprah Winfrey as her book selection. When she found 
> it
> was based on lies, she shamed him publicly. As far as I know, he is still
> writing and making money at it. I do not know if there were legal
> ramifications to his writing, only that Oprah was furious.
> Jackie
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of Lynda Lambert
> Sent: Monday, March 05, 2012 9:34 AM
> To: Writer's Division Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [stylist] Creative nonfiction is not made-up material
>
> I have to say I am fascinated by the strong, and very strange, reaction 
> that
>
> a little three diget word has  aroused. Who knew that to meniton a "lie"
> would bring on such passion. It makes me smile to think of it!   I am
> accustomed to dealing with discussions and distractions in the college and
> university classrooms where I have taught for many years. It goes with the
> territory. But, it is fun when even I am surprised.
>
> Artists and writers lie and steal. I plead guilty to both and I certainly
> hope that the hundreds of students in my classrooms over the years learned
> to do it, too. Professors and our ideas have a way or reproducing and
> multiplying.
>
> We take something from one place, and we take it to a different place. We
> are like a turck driver - we pick up a load, travel with it, and deliver 
> it
> to another place. It is never the same when it reaches the final
> destination. A transition occurs in transit.
>
> Our load is "ideas" and "inspiration" and "a hunch" or an "obsession."
>
> It is  from this  stuff that our creative work emerges.
> And, sometimes even we are hoodwinked by our own sacred cows.
>
> Lynda (spelled  L  Y  N  D  A  )
>
>
>
>
>
>
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Eve Sanchez" <3rdeyeonly at gmail.com>
> To: "Writer's Division Mailing List" <stylist at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Monday, March 05, 2012 1:24 AM
> Subject: Re: [stylist] Creative nonfiction is not made-up material
>
>
>> As Dr. Gregory House says Everybody lies." A politician does not want to
>> be
>> called a lier, but if the shoe fits. Much of creative nonfiction is not
>> about someone's personal experiences, but rather something that happened
>> in
>> past history. It, in most cases, is impossible to know what those long
>> dead
>> characters said, or ate, or wore on a certain day. Yet if these things
>> were
>> not presumed to the best of the authors ability through research of what
>> is
>> known about time period and/or incident concerned, the books would be
>> awfully boring. I for one am thankful for the creativeness of the authors
>> of creative nonfiction to weave such lies.  A word that is not so harsh 
>> as
>> lye,but just as cleansing. Diolch, Eve
>>
>> On Sun, Mar 4, 2012 at 12:37 PM, Bridgit Pollpeter
>> <bpollpeter at hotmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> Linda,
>>>
>>> We may have to agree to disagree . I have a degree in creative writing,
>>> my emphasis in creative nonfiction, IE, the personal essay and memoir
>>> writing. I may have very little knowledge and experience on most
>>> subjects, but this is one area I'm well-versed in.
>>>
>>> Memoir writing does not contain "lies." When writing any creative
>>> nonfiction piece, one may use dialogue, which is yes, remembered to ones
>>> best ability, but it's not a "lie." When in conversation with a friend,
>>> you may talk about a conversation with another person. You won't be able
>>> to relay that conversation verbatim, but you summarize. It's still the
>>> truth. Look at it like this: when you summarize a book, you are not
>>> reliving it moment by moment or line by line, but you are still
>>> summarizing the truth. If I use dialogue in a piece of CNF, it will most
>>> likely not be verbatim, but it' ssummarized, still true though.
>>>
>>> Creative nonfiction also can use conjecture, but it is clear that a
>>> writer is using conjecture. If I write what I believe your thoughts are
>>> and do not state it's just my opinion, then I'm making something up with
>>> the intention of it being understood it's in deed real. However, if I
>>> state I'm conjecturing with language, then it's clear I'm only guessing.
>>> Again, this is not a "lie," but me adding layers to a piece with
>>> conjecture; plucking up puzzle pieces.
>>>
>>> Using descriptive language only allows CNF writers to create a scene, to
>>> provide sensory details. Again, you do this to the best of your memory,
>>> but it's in no way a lie or fictitious. As long as the thoughts,
>>> feelings and events are real, there's nothing fictitious about CNF even
>>> if details such as location, setting and dialogue are written to the
>>> writers best memory of them but not exact. If a painter paints a forest
>>> they once visited but don't paint some trees exactly where they stand in
>>> real-life, does this render the painting completely made-up and imagined
>>> in the mind of the artist? I'd say no; and the same goes for CNF
>>> writers.
>>>
>>> You can also look at CNF this way: If you and I go to the same event at
>>> the same time, we will most likely take away different memories. Does
>>> this mean, just because I had a slightly different experience of the
>>> event than you, or vice versus, that one of us is lying about our
>>> experience? Of course not. In creative nonfiction, it's about the
>>> experience, and how that experience can be relatable to others and
>>> transcend into a universal.
>>>
>>> So, I respectfully say that it's wrong to categorize CNF as
>>> fictionalized accounts of real-life, or to say that "lies" are told in
>>> CNF. The use of dialogue, descriptive language, metaphor and imagery,
>>> conjecture, different POV's, etc., this does not render a piece of CNF
>>> as fiction, and a CNF writer is not incorporating lies into their story.
>>> We are using creative, literary techniques and devices to not only tell
>>> about our real-life events, but to find a morsel of universal
>>> understanding; to use our life and experiences creating a metaphor that
>>> many can relate to, or creating a finely honed image others can take
>>> something from.
>>>
>>> Feelings and thoughts are very abstract things. To create this
>>> abstraction with words often takes very creative means; it doesn't turn
>>> the material into fiction. Annie Dillard's Eclipse is one of the most
>>> famous personal essays studied in writing and literature programs. She
>>> takes a very real moment from a specific time in her life but delves
>>> into a spiritual plane. Because she uses her inner thoughts a lot, it
>>> doesn't mean she's making things up; this would be saying thoughts and
>>> feelings are not real.
>>>
>>> Or when I tell you about a specific moment from my childhood, am I lying
>>> about it if I don't remember exactly what happened, or quote verbatim
>>> what people said? No. So why would it be considered made-up if I write
>>> it?
>>>
>>> Sorry, but like I said, I've studied CNF for years now, and sat at the
>>> feet of some great CNF writers, and trust me, none of us like to be told
>>> we are lying or making material up. Using creative means does not mean
>>> we are not also providing facts, and there is a form of CNF called
>>> literary journalism. Joan Didion has a lot of great literary journalism.
>>> LJ also relies on creative techniques to "report facts."
>>>
>>> Sincerely,
>>> Bridgit Kuenning-Pollpeter
>>> Read my blog at:
>>> http://blogs.livewellnebraska.com/author/bpollpeter/
>>>
>>> "History is not what happened; history is what was written down."
>>> The Expected One- Kathleen McGowan
>>>
>>> Message: 18
>>> Date: Sat, 3 Mar 2012 18:07:29 -0500
>>> From: "Lynda Lambert" <llambert at zoominternet.net>
>>> To: "Writer's Division Mailing List" <stylist at nfbnet.org>
>>> Subject: Re: [stylist] Memoirs and autobiographies
>>> Message-ID: <1DC0442900B54042B78AAF4F501F3A25 at Lambert>
>>> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
>>>        reply-type=original
>>>
>>> I guess it sounds immoral to say that it is a lie? Not at all. Lies are
>>> delightful, and that is why we write; and why we love literature.
>>>
>>> The memoir is greatly enhanced accounts of a  truth  - it is a glorius
>>> lie
>>> that we tell when writing our story. Our glorious lie is the story we
>>> have
>>> woven together from the fragments of our memory, imagination, and our
>>> research into details that we do not remember at all. The true facts
>>> mingle
>>> with these other aspects to for the woven tapestry of the story we are
>>> telling.
>>> Otherwise, we would just be a newspaper writer and give the "facts,
>>> m'aam,
>>> just the facts."
>>>
>>> Lynda
>>>
>>>
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