[stylist] FW: keeping poems, for Robert, Bridgit, Lynda, and Barbara, others

Wed Jun 17 04:07:23 UTC 2015

I number and date all of mine.
Barbara

Sent from my iPhone

> On Jun 16, 2015, at 19:30, Jackie Williams via stylist <stylist at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> 
> Lynda,
> This is wonderful organizing information. I did start a folder of all poems alphabetically, but I think I like your idea better.
> Wish I had just started numbering my poems from the beginning like Emily Dickenson!
> Thanks for a good conversation. 
> 
> Jackie Lee
> 
> Time is the school in which we learn.
> Time is the fire in which we burn.
> Delmore Schwartz     
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: stylist [mailto:stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Lynda Lambert via stylist
> Sent: Monday, June 15, 2015 6:39 AM
> To: Writers' Division Mailing List
> Cc: Lynda Lambert
> Subject: Re: [stylist] FW: keeping poems, for Robert, Bridgit, Lynda, and Barbara, others
> 
> Thanks for the tip on the columns - that would be a good idea for me, too.
> One thing I just began to do that has saved me a lot of time this year is to 
> aave my files just a little different. Beforet this year, I saved things by 
> year - but then, when I wanted to find a poem (let's say) I had to go 
> through folders, year by year to find what I needed. Now I took another 
> friend's tip, and I have ONE  MASTER FOLDER for  ALL POEMS - In that folder 
> I do this:
> Poem15_theSkyVisitedMe - or - Poem99_two friends on a bench...etc.
> So by just opening one folder, I can access any poem by year and name.  I 
> can do this by creating a folder for each poem (which I mostly do since I 
> also tweak till eternity arrives) and that folder has all the different 
> versions by year.
> So, Poem 15 means I wrote the poem in 2015, and then I follow that by the 
> name or title of the poem. This has saved me so much search and aggrevation 
> time.
> I do the same with all my art.Example:  Fiber15_Dragonshealingbreastplate - 
> or - Painting15_HopiFlowerGirl.
> This is working better than everything else I have done over the past years.
> 
> Two years ago, I spent several months working on my art archives - tracing 
> back to every exhibition I have done, all awards, etc. All  is now on 
> computer, thumb drives, and in binders on the shelf - Plus a copy of these 
> records was sent off to the museums that  have my work in their permanent 
> collection. Each year, I send an update to each museum for the archives 
> there on my career and work.  I'll put together the same thing for the 
> historical society of the county where I live and work as well.
> 
> I have been doing the same for my writing history and archives. This all 
> takes a lot of detailed work, searching down all the years for the 
> documentation for the different areas - but it is necessary.  Fortunately, I 
> don't mind doing this kind of work and really do enjoy it.
> Jackie, I cannot imagine the extensive files and documents you would have. 
> Thanks for your good tips!  Lynda
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> -----Original Message----- 
> From: Bridgit Kuenning-Pollpeter via stylist
> Sent: Monday, June 15, 2015 3:08 AM
> To: 'Writers' Division Mailing List'
> Cc: Bridgit Kuenning-Pollpeter
> Subject: Re: [stylist] FW: keeping poems, for Robert, Bridgit, Lynda,and 
> Barbara, others
> 
> Jackie,
> 
> No such thing as being over organized, smile.
> 
> MS Word can create columns that are accessible to read with JAWS, you just 
> have to use a few different key strokes to switch between columns. If your 
> teacher is keeping data in columns in MS Word, it's accessible. And if it's 
> an Excel spreadsheet, that's completely accessible too, you just need to 
> know the hot keys for navigating spreadsheets, which is a little different 
> than Word.
> 
> As for a thumb drive, also known as a flash drive, no intricate method for 
> removing. You simply insert in thumb drive slot and simply pull out when 
> done. It's really no different than inserting and removing a CD or the old 
> floppy discs. Thumb drives are awesome, and I use them all the time. There 
> should be nothing difficult about inserting and removing them. Not sure what 
> this person who showed you was talking about. And unlike an external hard 
> drive, a thumb drive is portable and can be taken with you and used on any 
> computer.
> 
> Most computers nowadays, especially laptops, do not have internal CD roms, 
> so people purchase external CD ROMS. They can be purchased relatively 
> inexpensively.
> 
> External hard drives are great for periodically back up a device, but a 
> thumb drive is a much better option for backing up individual folders and 
> files, especially for writers. And it's easier to retrieve these files from 
> your thumb drive than an external hard drive, and you only need navigate 
> through what you place on the thumb drive as opposed to the entire computer 
> history on an external hard drive. But external hard drives are important to 
> have though, I just think for purposes of your writing and classes, a thumb 
> drive makes more sense.
> 
> I'm also the queen of folders within folders, grin. And I like to date 
> material I submit and to what publication, so I know when and where I sent 
> something. I keep these in a submission folder. I also tend to revise 
> frequently, so I also keep track of what version of a piece I submitted.
> 
> Bridgit
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: stylist [mailto:stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Jackie 
> Williams via stylist
> Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2015 8:08 PM
> To: 'Writers' Division Mailing List'
> Cc: Jackie Williams
> Subject: Re: [stylist] FW: keeping poems, for Robert, Bridgit, Lynda, and 
> Barbara, others
> 
> Lynda,
> It is always interesting for me to hear how other writers, and in your case, 
> also artists, keep everything in order and at their fingertips.
> I am becoming over organized, and I almost said I would enter no more 
> contests this year as it is so hard to do all of these contests again 
> without sending the same poems to the same categories.
> How I have things organized at the moment is a folder for each year. In that 
> I have a folder for each contest. Inside that, I keep all the files. Each 
> poem I enter with the number and category name as required on each 
> submission. I also keep the two files, Contest Rules, and Categories in that 
> folder.
> Once a folder is over five years old, I start transferring them into a 
> single state poetry folder.
> I also have a folder called "Poetry classes. Inside this are the categories, 
> "fall, '08,Winter, '08, Spring, '08, then the ones for '09, and up through 
> 2015.
> I tend to put everything I want to keep into these classes until I cut them 
> to go into other folders, like "The Writer Magazine, with the many 
> sub-folders such as "Poet to Poet," and "How I Write. I also have folders on 
> publishing information, technology, My four books, with their myriad 
> versions and submission info. I seem never to submit the exact version of a 
> poem or a book twice. So the versions are sort of lost.
> I do keep hard copy notebooks of everything that has been published, and 
> some of these I cannot even bring up on the computer. But in those cases, 
> when I was using a Mac, I have the newsletters, magazine, or newspaper 
> clippings of what was published.
> My most useful files on the computer are the ones for Paid Awards, and 
> Unpaid Awards. These two tell me whether I can re-submit a poem again. If it 
> is in the Paid Awards, I cannot, so I always check this before entering a 
> poem. I have to be careful about submission dates, and often await the 
> results of one contest to know if I can resubmit a poem.
> Several contests are clustered around the summer months, and I have a really 
> hard time making sure I have no duplicates submitted. Any ideas for this.?
> My teacher organizes poem by poem with columns with dates, and the minute 
> one comes back, she re-submits it immediately. She also records title 
> changes in a column. I cannot even read columns, much less make them with my 
> jaws, and not seeing anything. I only use Word.
> Because of the increasing complexity, I may instead start looking for 
> literary magazines down my alley to submit to, and Website's that might be 
> interested in my main book, instead of contests.
> I also run my publishing as a business, but after 6 years, I have yet to 
> make a profit considering the cost of entering manuscripts, poems, postage, 
> new electronic devices, print cartridges, hiring experts occasionally, and 
> taking my poetry class every session.  So far the IRS has accepted the no 
> profit, but I expect it won't continue much longer.
> 
> I am in the process of cleaning out my files. My life will not extend to 
> having time for re-reading everything I have saved through the years. It is 
> slow going, for it is like many strings of pearls that I might take out to 
> read when I like.
> Also, when I move things from file to folder, the date or origination 
> disappears. With my constant little changes in titles, I cannot always find 
> a poem.
> I have used CD's and thumb drives in the past, and one saved most of my 
> stuff when I had a crash, but my present computer will hardly let a CD enter 
> the slot, and I have not tried a thumb drive with it, since I got such 
> intricate directions on how to remove it. That is why I got the external 
> hard drive with the HD Smartware to back everything up. If it is not 
> working, I am lost.
> 
> Jackie Lee
> 
> Computers are the schools in which we learn.
> Time is the fire in which we burn.
> After Delmore Schwartz
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: stylist [mailto:stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Lynda Lambert 
> via stylist
> Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2015 3:35 PM
> To: Writers' Division Mailing List
> Cc: Lynda Lambert
> Subject: Re: [stylist] FW: keeping poems, for Robert, Bridgit, Lynda, and 
> Barbara, others
> 
> Jackie, I do not back up any email at all on anything. When I am working 
> with an editor on a project, I just flag all the messages and put them 
> together while we are working, but other than that, I don't save emails 
> unless it would really be necessary.
> 
> I back up all writings and art works, photography, etc. on CDs and Thumb 
> Drives - keep them separate, so if I have a crash again I will be ok. That 
> is what save me last year when everything was gone.
> I know you most likely have extensive files from so many years of writing 
> and probably have a very good system. I would love to hear how you keep 
> records for your work, you entries, and your archives, and how you keep 
> track of everything. I am always looking for tips to be more efficient with 
> it all.  Once things are published, I keep hard copies of all the 
> periodicals, journals,  and books, too. Usually, I have several copies of 
> each for my private archives.
> 
> I am a file-a-holic - meaning, I have physical binders, one for each project 
> I am working on. No, I cannot read any of them myself, but It is important 
> to have them in case that item would be lost - I would at least have the 
> hard copy to use in recreating it again.  Each book project has it's own 
> binder, etc. In that binder is every piece of writing for the project, all 
> of the research I have gathered for it, (I also do this for every art 
> exhibition I am working on, since I work 2-3 years in advance pulling 
> together exhibitions for various venues).  Each binder contains  hard 
> copies, in transparent sleeves to keep them pristine and archival. In 
> addition, inside that binder, I have a CD with every file on it, in folders, 
> and keep it all together.  In addition to saving all writings and art works 
> on my compute;r, I have the duplicates in the binders. When I need 
> something, or have a question, I can go to the physical binder on my shelf 
> and double check it there against what I have on the computer - you know, 
> how we sometimes forget to put a file on the computer or save things in 
> draft form - I know, I am a completely crazy woman when it comes to things 
> like archival records, but that is  my background plus I am a Virgo and what 
> else can a Virgo ever do but be obsessive about everything?  I think it is 
> impossible to be too organized.
> 
> You might ask about the email program that allows you to wee an e-mail 
> without opening it. I can just zip through all the email so quickly because 
> I don't have to open them up. I open very few emails now.
> Lynda
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jackie Williams via stylist
> Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2015 3:05 PM
> To: 'Writers' Division Mailing List'
> Cc: Jackie Williams
> Subject: Re: [stylist] FW: keeping poems, for Robert, Bridgit, Lynda,and 
> Barbara, others
> 
> Lynda,
> This is critical information for me right now, and I thank you. The Center 
> of the Deaf has a new computer in their office waiting for someone to come 
> out and transfer all of my files, etc. before installing up to date 
> software, etc. The hacked theory came from a computer expert friend in Cal.
> Who did not open an e-mail from me, thinking I could not have sent that one.
> He was right. I did not. The virus theory comes from any expert who has been 
> sent by the state to try to figure out what is wrong, and they keep 
> re-installing, or putting me back to previous software. The ones who suggest 
> a possible virus never seem to know what to tell me to do about it or who to 
> contact. Cox seems to think my program has covered that.
> I do have an external hard drive, H D Smart wear, which is supposed to be 
> backing up everything. But wouldn't it also be backing up any virus-laden 
> e-mail?
> 
> Jackie Lee
> 
> Time is the school in which we learn.
> Time is the fire in which we burn.
> Delmore Schwartz
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: stylist [mailto:stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Lynda Lambert 
> via stylist
> Sent: Sunday, June 14, 2015 5:17 AM
> To: Writers' Division Mailing List
> Cc: Lynda Lambert
> Subject: Re: [stylist] FW: keeping poems, for Robert, Bridgit, Lynda, and 
> Barbara, others
> 
> Hi Jackie,
> Just this past week another private list I am  rarely on was hacked. We 
> members got an email that had a person's name on it  that we recognized, as 
> the sender.  I didn't open it because I was suspicious. I have  an email 
> program that enables me to see what is in the message without opening it.  I 
> have learned to be super cautious because over a year ago, I did open 
> something that wiped out my entire computer system.  I had to have a new one 
> installed - a new hard drive, etc. So my tech guy put in a different kind of 
> email program to prevent this from happening again. In my case, it was 
> fortunate I had made several back ups and did not lose much other than all 
> my email addresses which I did not make back-ups of prior to the crash.
> Now, I am much more careful about anything that comes into my mailboxes - 8 
> email addresses at three different locations. If you are hacked, or you 
> click onto a site that will give your computer a virus, you will lose 
> everything and your entire computer system, as I did.  I sat here and 
> watching everything disappearing, one by one.  Lynda
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jackie Williams via stylist
> Sent: Saturday, June 13, 2015 5:54 PM
> To: 'Writers' Division Mailing List'
> Cc: Jackie Williams
> Subject: Re: [stylist] FW: keeping poems, for Robert, Bridgit, Lynda,and 
> Barbara, others
> 
> Lynda,
> You make me very happy that I do not have a Facebook account, nor do I 
> Tweet. I have often thought I should, but I hear too many stories.
> A really strange thing happened a few days ago. I got an e-mail from Margo 
> Lagatuda. I think many of you know her from a telephone gathering. Right 
> after that I e-mailed her about the subject of rhymed poetry. It was shortly 
> after that she died from a fast moving cancer. This has been 2 or 3 years 
> ago. I received an e-mail from her some months after that and was advised to 
> delete it since she was dead. I did so. So has someone hacked her e-mail 
> account again? If so, how? I am overcome with curiosity this time, but it 
> sits there unopened. What do you all advised?
> I googled myself sometime ago and found some thousands of Jacqueline 
> Williams names, most from California, and after reading so many and finding 
> many of them in legal limbo, I did not even refine my search. At the time I 
> wanted  an e-mail address, and finally came up with jackieleepoet which 
> still had not been used.
> The last person here to help me try to straighten out my Outlook folders 
> said she thought I had been hacked because things acted so strangely. I 
> asked how I would know that. She did not know. Do any of you know? Cox said 
> not to worry if there was just one or two episodes of getting strange 
> e-mails, which has happened.
> Sorry, the questions keep coming. Doesn't anyone else have similar problems?
> 
> Jackie Lee
> 
> Time is the school in which we learn.
> Time is the fire in which we burn.
> Delmore Schwartz
> 
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: stylist [mailto:stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Lynda Lambert 
> via stylist
> Sent: Friday, June 12, 2015 12:30 PM
> To: Writers' Division Mailing List
> Cc: Lynda Lambert
> Subject: Re: [stylist] FW: keeping poems, for Robert, Bridgit, Lynda, and 
> Barbara, others
> 
> Jackie, and all,
> I met a woman last week who works for a large corporation in KY - she told 
> me they hired someone to work full time at this corporation just to troll 
> the internet and read face book postings by the employees - she said they 
> have fired many people due to internet comments, photos, etc.
> If you Google Search your name, you may be surprised what comes up if you 
> are on the internet very much - comments from blogs and Face Book, etc.
> I would think that an editor or publisher would definitely do a search to 
> see whats "out there" by and from an author they consider for publication.
> It would be really disappointing to be passed by because you posted 
> something without thinking of the possibilities ahead.
> 
> My daughter is a teacher and she has had fellow teachers lose their jobs 
> just because they posted vacation photos, with liquor in their hands - my 
> daughter does not do FB at all any more because of what could happen is 
> someone wrote something on her page, or if someone would not like a comment 
> she has made...
> 
> There is no such thing as privacy on the internet - really. Things get 
> hacked all the time and you never know who would copy/paste your work or 
> send it to anyone else regardless of rules.
> 
> I don't know anything about judges or contests - but I trust people to be 
> fair if they are in that role - typically anyone selected as a judge would 
> be well qualified for it otherwise there would be no point to it.
> I have judged many things and certainly looked at each entry for what it was 
> without thought of who may have created the piece. I think any other judge 
> would be impartial as well in this kind of situation.  Here's to a good say 
> of writing.  Lynda
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jackie Williams via stylist
> Sent: Friday, June 12, 2015 12:43 PM
> To: 'Writers' Division Mailing List'
> Cc: Jackie Williams
> Subject: Re: [stylist] FW: keeping poems, for Robert, Bridgit, Lynda,and 
> Barbara, others
> 
> Lynda, Bridgit, and those mentioned above.
> 
> Thanks so much for your comprehensive responses. I did not know that Google 
> would have such detail about a person, or that Facebook was fair game.
> Several responses above indicate that this list is safe. But here is a very 
> specific instance of my question.
> A while ago I posted a flash fiction piece, something I had never written 
> before. I was overjoyed with the response, and particularly from Robert, who 
> said he was sending it to the Nebraska group because he thought they would 
> enjoy it.
> It was a definite ego-booster. But on reflection, I feel I can never submit 
> it, because I do not know if that group is a list like ours, or who there 
> might have shared it outside their group. I never got any feedback from 
> anyone outside this group.
> And so, a short short career in fiction writing. Or should I take a chance 
> and submit it elsewhere? Also, when you have put something on this list for 
> a critique or comment, can you then legitimately send it to the NFB contest?
> The judges would know who wrote it, and that is strictly against any rules I 
> know about.
> 
> 
> Jackie Lee
> 
> Time is the school in which we learn.
> Time is the fire in which we burn.
> Delmore Schwartz
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: stylist [mailto:stylist-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Lynda Lambert 
> via stylist
> Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2015 3:20 PM
> To: Writers' Division Mailing List
> Cc: Lynda Lambert
> Subject: Re: [stylist] FW: keeping poems
> 
> Jackie's point is certainly a good one - for those of us who work with 
> publishers and journals, we cannot post our work for many publications will 
> not accept anything that has been published previously anywhere at all - 
> even on your own Facebook page. That is a sobering fact, and it comes back 
> to bite  us if we do it and we would  lose credibility with the publishers 
> who work with us.  I do not enter contests much at all - only two in a year, 
> because I am in the groups, so that is not my concern.  But I do want to 
> continue to have my work appear in publications where I am paid for my  work 
> and would never consider sending the editors  anything that was published 
> anywhere else unless it is specified in the rules for Submissions that it is 
> ok to do so. My interest and expertise is in essays and poetry - so that is 
> what I choose to comment on typically in the group.  Just keeping up with my 
> own work keeps me hopping.  This all works exactly like  gallery and museum 
> art exhibitions - the higher quality exhibition venues  will not show work 
> that has appeared an any other shows unless it is part of a traveling 
> exhibition and in that case the entire show travels all over the states and 
> abroad with the show.  - the best galleries want exclusive rights.  This is 
> all fascinating, isn't it!
> 
> Another good point is that things we write and post on the internet, even in 
> groups, is often available when you do a google search on that person and 
> their work.  Particularly anything you have put on Facebook - even if you 
> delete, it is still available through google search.  I have to ask myself, 
> "Is it worth being banned from a publication because of something I posted 
> on the internet in the past?"  It's a no-brainer, isn't it! If in doubt - 
> don't do it. Lynda
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jackie Williams via stylist
> Sent: Wednesday, June 10, 2015 5:21 PM
> To: 'Writers' Division Mailing List'
> Cc: Jackie Williams
> Subject: [stylist] FW: keeping poems
> 
> Barbara, and all, a response that I wanted all to get and respond to.
> 
> Jackie Lee
> 
> Time is the school in which we learn.
> Time is the fire in which we burn.
> Delmore Schwartz
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Jackie Williams [mailto:jackieleepoet at cox.net]
> Sent: Tuesday, June 09, 2015 7:53 AM
> To: 'Barbara Hammel'
> Subject: RE: keeping poems
> 
> Barbara,
> Your point is well taken. There might be a subtle difference between my 
> critique group and this list, this being electronic, and the other hard 
> copies.
> This was addressed some time ago by Bridgit and Robert, that this list is a 
> group meant for critiquing and sharing, and a contest should not disqualify 
> a poem because it is posted here. I agree it should not, however recently a 
> poem was disqualified because the National Federation of State Poetry 
> Societies found it somewhere on the internet. Searches are pretty 
> comprehensive these days I am told.
> I have also collected some of the poems from members here, particularly when 
> they introduce a new form, like Myrna with her tumbling tercets and 
> cascading quatrains, and your  poem about seeing letters and certain things 
> in colors which describes a certain eye condition I can never remember the 
> name for. Also, things like Lynda's relating of her strategy for writing 
> that 39 line poem with the same six words repeated in six stanzas in a 
> prescribed manner, with another 3 lines at the bottom. I describe this 
> because my memory for the word for certain forms sometimes escapes me now.
> It always comes back, but not when I need it.
> It is not that I do not trust the ones on this list, but that contests are 
> pretty specific about not publishing or putting your work on anything if you 
> are submitting it to them, unless they say you may have simultaneous 
> submissions. I have approximately fifty poems in submission at this moment, 
> and I do not want to risk jeopardizing them.
> Also, on a personal level, I have shared my long manuscript with its added 
> "A Battered Woman's Glossary, A Ludicrous Lexicon of Legal terms, with seven 
> different critiquers. With their critique, " five returned the manuscript 
> plus the Glossary, and two kept the Glossary saying they wanted to show it 
> to someone, and whoever they shared it with never returned it.
> This manuscript has been submitted to10 contests in the past, and I am 
> always afraid that I will get a notice that that Glossary is someone else's.
> As poets, we are encouraged to save favorite lines, or favorite poems, and 
> even to make "erasure" poems from then, where you can erase half of that 
> persons poem, rework the rest, and claim it as your own, being sure to give 
> credit to the original poet. But already, some of these are being legally 
> challenged.
> The pace of change in copywrite laws is moving and getting much more 
> complicated by the internet. I wish it were not so. And the argument by many 
> is that there is nothing that has not been said before, so they should be 
> able to use anything that has been used before, thus evading the law.
> In the meantime, I agree that so many submissions here are worthy of saving 
> primarily as teaching tools for methodology, or form, or for examples of 
> creative use of language.
> I hope this mixed message makes sense to you.
> 
> Jackie Lee
> 
> Time is the school in which we learn.
> Time is the fire in which we burn.
> Delmore Schwartz
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Barbara Hammel [mailto:poetlori8 at icloud.com]
> Sent: Sunday, June 07, 2015 1:30 PM
> To: jackieleepoet at cox.net
> Subject: keeping poems
> 
> 
> 
> If one has no intent of ever sharing another's poem without their permission 
> is it so bad to keep them? I have your A Rainbow Came Down poem — probably 
> not your final copy — because I liked it. Will anyone ever know I have it?
> No except that it's one by you. Would I ever print it or give to anyone 
> without asking you? No.
> I have five or seven of Myrna's, too. If a book were out that had all of 
> them, I'd probably buy it for the final printed versions of them. Guess I 
> don't make a competitive or smart writer, huh. Oh, and I'd NEVER claim 
> another's work as my own.
> Barbara
> Sent from my iPhone
> 
> 
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