[blindlaw] petition

Wed Jan 13 20:44:55 UTC 2010

OK, thanks for clarifying that.

-----Original Message-----
From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of ckrugman at sbcglobal.net
Sent: Wednesday, January 13, 2010 2:40 PM
To: NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] petition

I was referring to those people who have had many opportunities to learn 
what they needed to do and chose not to avail themselves of the options 
available to them. As we know there are some people who will use their 
disabilities in ways that are opportunistic. I know that having been born 
blind it is sometimes easy to forget the impact of adjustment that someone 
goes through when they have lost vision.
Chuck
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "WB" <mruniverse08 at gmail.com>
To: "'NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List'" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, January 13, 2010 1:14 AM
Subject: Re: [blindlaw] petition

> Are we talking about persons with brand new blindness?  I hope not. 
> People
> can't start out knowing everything to do...there is a process.  After
> awhile, you shouldn't need that but at the beginning there is quite a bit 
> of
> psychological retraining.  So, I hope we aren't talking about the 
> beginning
> stages...
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of ckrugman at sbcglobal.net
> Sent: Wednesday, January 13, 2010 1:01 AM
> To: NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] petition
>
> dthat's a valid point as many consumers expect their hands to be held 
> every
> step of the way and beyond.
> Chuck
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "Steve P. Deeley" <stevep.deeley at insightbb.com>
> To: "NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Tuesday, January 12, 2010 4:29 PM
> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] petition
>
>
>>I would need to see some empirical data on the effectiveness of NFB 
>>centers
>
>>compared to those run by the states or non-NFB centers.  Some of the
>>hard-luck consumers that states must work with would never be able to make
>>it in a NFB run center.
>> Steve
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: <ckrugman at sbcglobal.net>
>> To: "NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Tuesday, January 12, 2010 5:18 PM
>> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] petition
>>
>>
>>> The argument could also be made that by using NFB rehab centers the
>>> quality
>>> of the program and the long-term benefit both to the consumer and the
>>> state
>>> is more cost effective. I wonder how cost effecdtive some of the non-NFB
>>> programs are in comparison. States tned to waste a lot of money by
>>> maintaining the status quo.
>>> Chuck
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: "WB" <mruniverse08 at gmail.com>
>>> To: "'NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List'" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Tuesday, January 12, 2010 8:35 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] petition
>>>
>>>
>>>> What aspect are you speaking of...NFB paying for people to go or for 
>>>> the
>>>> state to pay for people to go?  Here in Texas, the state agency is
>>>> always
>>>> trying to get people to go.  At least they were for me.
>>>>
>>>> And I would argue that there is always room in the budget if states
>>>> would
>>>> crack down on the way state workers are spending the money.  It's been
>>>> my
>>>> experience that the answer is usually no.  So I'm not sure why there is
>>>> no
>>>> money for anything.  Just my thoughts from what I've experienced.
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>> On
>>>> Behalf Of Steve P. Deeley
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, January 12, 2010 9:40 AM
>>>> To: NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List
>>>> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] petition
>>>>
>>>> With the budgets at this time, we can't afford it.
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> From: "WB" <mruniverse08 at gmail.com>
>>>> To: "'NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List'" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, January 12, 2010 4:03 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] petition
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> How about we not have only NFB facilities.  I am a member of the local
>>>>> NFB
>>>>> chapter but I don't believe their whole philosophy about blindness.
>>>>> There
>>>>> are some great points and there are some very strange ones.
>>>>>
>>>>> I agree that the NFB should pay but the fact is that they're not. 
>>>>> They
>>>>> are
>>>>> tied in with many of the state agencies across the country.
>>>>>
>>>>> So, if a person needs to get the state to pay for that institution,
>>>>> then
>>>>> they should go for it.  Rather than state agencies wasting money on
>>>>> frivolous things, they need to reorient their budget.
>>>>>
>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>> From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>>> On
>>>>> Behalf Of Steve P. Deeley
>>>>> Sent: Monday, January 11, 2010 8:33 PM
>>>>> To: NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List
>>>>> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] petition
>>>>>
>>>>> You want blind individuals from those states having a blindness 
>>>>> center,
>>>>> funded by tax payer dollars, to be able to attend NFB centers at those
>>>>> same
>>>>> tax payers expense.  That is just not right or fiscally possible..  If
>>>>> the
>>>>> NFB wants these clients from states with blindness centers in place to
>>>>> attend NFB centers, they should establish scholarships or pay the way
>>>>> with
>>>>> NFB funding.  The budgets' of states are stretched to the limit.
>>>>> States
>>>>> with blindness centers should not pay for clients to attend NFB
>>>>> centers.
>>>>> There is a limited amount of resources in their budgets.  That is like
>>>>> saying a state agency should have to fund a education for a consumer 
>>>>> to
>>>>> attend Harvard if the student could qualify.  Again, there limitedf
>>>>> resources to work with in these cases.  If a consumer wants to attend 
>>>>> a
>>>>> private college, they need to pay the difference or get scholarships 
>>>>> to
>>>>> makeup the difference from what a state agency is able to pay.
>>>>> Usually,
>>>>> state agencies will pay for blind consumers to attend in-state
>>>>> institutions.
>>>>>
>>>>> You want an expensive college or an out of state college, you must 
>>>>> make
>>>>> up
>>>>> the difference.  The same should go for the consumer attending a NFB
>>>>> center
>>>>> if his or her state has a blindness center.
>>>>>
>>>>> Steve
>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>>> From: "James Pepper" <b75205 at gmail.com>
>>>>> To: "NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Sent: Monday, January 11, 2010 12:58 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] petition
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Go down to your local member of Congress office and complain to them
>>>>>> in
>>>>>> person.  Thats how you do things.  Everything else is really not 
>>>>>> going
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> do
>>>>>> much.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> You have to talk to the staff tell them what is going on.  Tell them
>>>>>> why
>>>>>> it
>>>>>> doesn't work explain it to them because they have no idea why things
>>>>>> do
>>>>>> not
>>>>>> work, they are not in your shoes.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> James
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, Jan 10, 2010 at 2:14 PM, <ckrugman at sbcglobal.net> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> There have been allegations that in some states the state agency 
>>>>>>> does
>>>>>>> not
>>>>>>> want to pay for residents to go to out of state rehab centers such 
>>>>>>> as
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> NFB centers and rehab clients have had to request hearings and other
>>>>>>> things
>>>>>>> to be have the fees paid.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Chuck Krugman, M.S.W., Paralegal
>>>>>>> 1237 P Street
>>>>>>> Fresno ca 93721
>>>>>>> 559-266-9237
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Marc Dubin" <mdubin at pobox.com>
>>>>>>> To: "NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List" <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2010 3:26 AM
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] petition
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>   The petition reads: "Blind consumers working with federal state
>>>>>>> agencies
>>>>>>>> for the blind and Visually Impaired should be allowed to attend
>>>>>>>> National
>>>>>>>> Federation of the blind training centers and they should be fully
>>>>>>>> paid
>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>> by said agencies in the U.S.A. Please rewrite...."
>>>>>>>> Would someone please explain to me what the problem is that is 
>>>>>>>> being
>>>>>>>> experienced?
>>>>>>>> How are they being denied the right to attend NFB Training Centers?
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Thanks.
>>>>>>>> marc
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Marc Dubin, Esq.
>>>>>>>> Director of Advocacy, Center for Independent Living of South 
>>>>>>>> Florida
>>>>>>>> mdubin at pobox.com
>>>>>>>> Mobile: 305-896-3000
>>>>>>>> Fax: 877-731-3030
>>>>>>>> www.victimswithdisabilities.org
>>>>>>>> Chair, Florida Bar Disability Law Committee
>>>>>>>> http://disabilitylawcommittee.blogspot.com/
>>>>>>>> Former Senior Trial Attorney, U.S. Department of Justice 1993-2005
>>>>>>>> www.ada.gov
>>>>>>>> Former Special Counsel, Office on Violence Against Women, USDOJ
>>>>>>>> www.ovw.usdoj.gov/overview.htm
>>>>>>>> Founder & Executive Director, CAVNET    www.cavnet.org
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>> From: blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>> [mailto:blindlaw-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>>>>>> On
>>>>>>>> Behalf Of ckrugman at sbcglobal.net
>>>>>>>> Sent: Sunday, January 10, 2010 3:08 AM
>>>>>>>> To: NFBnet Blind Law Mailing List
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [blindlaw] petition
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Unfortunately, petitions put forth on Internet sites like this have
>>>>>>>> little
>>>>>>>> if any real effect with Congress. It is much more effective to use 
>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>> system
>>>>>>>> of actual letters that can electronically be submitted to members 
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> Congress and/or state legislators. Working with many groups as a
>>>>>>>> consultant
>>>>>>>> on legislative issues I have raised this issue previously. While
>>>>>>>> consumers
>>>>>>>> definitely need a choice and self empowerment to attend facilities
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> their
>>>>>>>> choice for rehabilitation the Rehab Act of 1973 or any other
>>>>>>>> legislation
>>>>>>>> will not get rewritten using this format.
>>>>>>>> Chuck Krugman, M.S.W., Paralegal
>>>>>>>> 1237 P Street
>>>>>>>> Fresno ca 93721
>>>>>>>> 559-266-9237
>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message ----- From: "Mr. Alexander Scott Kaiser"
>>>>>>>> <MisterAlexanderScottKaiser10301990 at gmx.com>
>>>>>>>> To: <blindlaw at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Sent: Saturday, January 09, 2010 12:43 AM
>>>>>>>> Subject: [blindlaw] petition
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> please read and sign
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>
http://www.petition2congress.com/2/2768/rewriting-us-rehabilitation-act-1973
>>>>> /
>>>>>>>>>     Quick
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> blindlaw mailing list
>>>>>>>>> blindlaw at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindlaw_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>>>>>>> for
>>>>>>>>> blindlaw:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/ckrugman%40sbcglob
>>>>> al.net
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>
>>>>
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/mdubin%40pobox.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>
>>>>
>
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>>>>> al.net
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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>
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>
>>>>
>
http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindlaw_nfbnet.org/stevep.deeley%40in
>>>>> sightbb.com
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>
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>>>>>
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>
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>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>>
>>>>
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>>
>>
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>>
>>
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