[Blindmath] Results of Using the Perkins

Thu Feb 9 20:24:45 UTC 2012

Hi,
Hmmm, its quite tricky to explain it, but I'll try my best:
If you do type Nemeth in any braille form (computer braille, to 
qracted, etc.), when read by a computer (or any notetaker), it'll 
not make sense under some symbols.  So, for example, if you type 
a number proceeded by a number sign, the computer will read it as 
"number sign" followed by a bunch of numbers instead of reading 
the number itself.  So, say if I type:
#7x
when read by a computer, it'll be read as "number sign, 7, x." To 
get the computer to read the expression above "as is," you'd 
type:
7x
This one will be read as "7 x." Similarly, if you do equals sign, 
it'll be dot k when read by a computer.
Now the above scenario assumes that the computer (or a netetaker) 
would read the file "as is" without applying any additional 
conditions i.e.  just reading a text file that has some Nemeth 
symbols and treating these Nemeth code as just ASCII text.  Now 
if we put the file through a program that does understand math 
symbols either via markers placed within
the text or treating the file as a special document, then we'll 
see proper math symbols - and this is the principle behind LaTeX.  
And this is the fundamental difference between computer braille 
and Nemeth: whereas computer braille assigns one ASCII (or 
Unicode) character per one braille cell pattern (hence limited 
number of characters, which does include some that appears in 
some form under Nemeth), Nemeth emplys two or more cells to 
handle more than one possibilities (like numbers versus 
punctuations) and to cover a wider set of characters (which 
doesn't appear under ASCII set), hence some difficulty with 
parsing of Nemeth by regular text word processors unless special 
readers are used.  Thus, in conclusion, its the matter of 
difference in understanding and parsing one or more braille 
patterns by humans versus silicon.
For Jose: the bug you speak of does not really happen anymore on 
the Apex, although I do know it caused whatever its in the 
clipboard to become capitalized on the mPower.

 ----- Original Message -----
From: Jose Tamayo <jtblas at hotmail.com
To: "'Blind Math list for those interested in 
mathematics'"<blindmath at nfbnet.org
Date sent: Thu, 9 Feb 2012 14:42:18 -0500
Subject: Re: [Blindmath] Results of Using the Perkins

Perhaps!

Forgive my ignorance and lackof knowledge in this area but I will 
attempt to
explore some possibilities.

IF I type all my math in Computer Braille, knowing that I am 
typing Nemeth
Code, does the software printing the Nemeth code care that it is 
Nemeth code
at all.  Does the software simply print in Computer Braille 
whatever has
been entered.

The recommendation, exception noted below, when using a 
BrailleNote is to
set the BrailleNote to computer braille.  Of course, the 
BrailleNote will
not have the Nemeth code spoken but when you use your finger to 
read the
Braille, you are reading what you expected to write; regardless 
of what the
BrailleNote  says.

With the BrailleNote MPower BT32, which is the one I have, there 
is a bug
with copying and pasting Computer braille and thus copying and 
pasting is a
problem for users of the BrailleNote and computer braille for 
entering math.
I was using Computer Braille because it was the only way to get 
Nemetext to
read the file for LaTeX conversion.

When using the Braille Display with JAWS, it really does not 
matter what
JAWS reads (understatement).  I guess my point is that if you  
stick to
Computer Braille, you should be ok unless I don't understand the 
solution.

Please help me understand this issue.

Regards,
Jose Tamayo

-----Original Message-----
From: blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org 
[mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
Behalf Of Alex Hall
Sent: Thursday, February 09, 2012 2:05 PM
To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics
Subject: Re: [Blindmath] Results of Using the Perkins

The problem with entering nemeth on a notetaker like that is that 
it is not
actually nemeth.  Of course, if you are the only one looking at 
the file,
then it does not matter at all.  However, it will not translate 
into print,
so you could not turn in such a file as homework or a test since 
it would
look like random text and characters.

On 2/9/12, Susan Jolly <easjolly at ix.netcom.com> wrote:
 This is an attempt to respond to Jose's excellent and clear 
post.

 He wrote correctly "that as long as
 you type in the Nemeth codes using your 6 dot knowledge of 
Nemeth
 Braille, it will display on the BrailleNote."

 Actually this is true not just of Nemeth but of any braille 
code.  If
 you type in contracted braille using your 6 dot knowledge the
 contracted braille will display on the BrailleNote as well.

 What you are typing or writing is actually just the braille 
cells.
 What they mean depends on what you think they mean.  If you type
 dots-123456 it could mean "for" or the Nemeth omission symbol or 
an
 ASCII equals mark depending on whether you are thinking in 
contracted
braille or Nemeth math or ASCII.

 Some people feel more comfortable entering braille by using the
 braille keyboard on a Perkins or on a notetaker.  But if you are
 familiar with your notetaker's computer braille table, you can 
also
 enter any desired braille cell via QWERTY, either using a 
regular
 keyboard or a QWERTY keyboard on a notetaker.

 Using an electronic keyboard is certainly easier on your hands 
but, as
 been pointed out previously, one advantage of the Perkins is 
that it
 is easier to see several lines or math steps at a time.  Of 
course, if
 money is no object, one could use a standalone 80-cell braille 
display
 which allows you to get several simple math steps on one line.

 Sighted people can enter simulated braille from a regular 
keyboard by
 typing in computer braille and then using a compatible font to 
change
 the appearance from text to braille.  Of course this only works 
if the
 font matches up with whatever computer braille table you are 
using.
 Duxbury's free SimBraille font is designed to match up with 
North
 American ASCII Braille.

 SusanJ

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--
Have a great day,
Alex (msg sent from GMail website)
mehgcap at gmail.com; http://www.facebook.com/mehgcap

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