[Blindmath] Math Computer Program

Mon Mar 3 19:37:26 UTC 2014

Michael,

My wish for 8-key input on the built-in keyboard is to minimize hand 
movement and the consequent break in concentration and work flow. I 
would rather the braille keyboard on a braille display than a tiny 
little qwerty keyboard because I hate typing on tiny qwerty keyboards 
and I find it easier to think in braille when I'm reading it.

If I were moving my hands back and forth anyway, I think I would use 
8-key input infrequently, since the feel of the qwerty keys under my 
fingers puts my brain in that typing mode. A lot would depend on task, 
really. Since I'm projecting what I want to do in future, I don't have 
as firm as grasp on how it will all work for me in reality as those who 
are actually using the tools in work and study.

I'm learning more and more about how people work with the available 
tools and why, as well as what various individuals want in future 
improvements. It occurs to me that when I was first moving towards 
becoming a braille user, I had a vague notion that there was some 
universal solution that was just kinda floating around out there and 
that once I found it and learned to use it, all would be gravy. Was I 
naive, or what? /lol/

Tami

On 03/02/2014 11:42 PM, Michael Whapples wrote:
> Hello,
> I think one desired use for Braille input is to be able to use the
> Braille keyboards on Braille displays so that one does not move the
> hands much between reading and writing.
>
> In the case of my Brailliant BI40, I believe normally the screen reader
> handles changing the key dot patterns into various normal key events
> (eg. it will convert dots 134 to a key event for the m key). This might
> include key combinations (I think there is one, may be space+dots2345,
> which performs alt+tab). Whether the mapping is the same for all screen
> readers and as the user can change the input Braille table in many
> screen readers, I feel this might make a technical difficulty in LEAN
> accessing Braille keyboards on Braille displays.
>
> Could I ask those interested in Braille input: Would you be so
> interested in Braille input for LEAN if it were to work with either
> separate Braille keyboards or by using 8 keys on a qwerty keyboards (IE.
> asdf jkl;)? Is having the Braille keyboard on your Braille display
> critical/highly desired for Braille input?
>
> Michael Whapples
> On 03/03/2014 01:52, John Gardner wrote:
>> One more problem with braille input is that fewer and fewer keyboards are
>> capable of multiple key entry.  LEAN Braille is most efficient in its
>> 8-dot
>> form, so an 8-dot braille input keyboard would be really useful.  Are
>> there
>> standard keyboards that will support 8 key input?  Alternatively, is
>> there
>> any easy inexpensive braille keyboard on the market?
>>
>> I'd appreciate ideas from all of you.  I am not a strong braille
>> reader, so
>> this is not something I know a lot about.
>>
>> John
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Blindmath [mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>> Michael
>> Whapples
>> Sent: Sunday, March 02, 2014 3:38 PM
>> To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics
>> Subject: Re: [Blindmath] Math Computer Program
>>
>> Having done some work on LEAN math for John, I agree with what John has
>> mentioned. Adding LEAN Braille input is probably a much smaller job than
>> adding many of the standard maths Braille codes.
>>
>> The LEAN Braille code was design for easy mapping between LEAN
>> constructs and the dot patterns, so not needing complicated translation
>> routines. Many of the standard Braille codes were optimised for things
>> like compactness and human readers/writers, but as a consequence do need
>> more complicated translation routines.
>>
>> OK, quite a simplification, but that is the basic reasons.
>>
>> Michael Whapples
>> On 02/03/2014 19:21, John Gardner wrote:
>>> Hi Tami, yes it is easy to put in braille input for LEAN Braille,
>>> which is
>>> more or less a braille equivalent of the LEAN notation.  If there are
>> people
>>> who will use it, I could do that easily.
>>>
>>> Composing in Nemeth or other official braille language is infinitely
>>> more
>>> difficult, partly because all math braille languages have ambiguities
>> (which
>>> could be accounted for in various ways - in fact easily for Nemeth), but
>>> more particularly, all are context-dependent, and that is a real killer.
>>> Truthfully I don't know how to incorporate Nemeth equation composition,
>> and
>>> other braille math languages are even more difficult.  It is
>>> something I'm
>>> trying to understand better and might someday be able to do.  But not
>>> imminently unfortunately.
>>>
>>> Be well all.
>>> John
>>>
>>>
>>> John
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Blindmath [mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Tami
>>> Jarvis
>>> Sent: Saturday, March 01, 2014 2:45 PM
>>> To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics
>>> Subject: Re: [Blindmath] Math Computer Program
>>>
>>> John,
>>>
>>> Great work, and congratulations on your progress!
>>>
>>> You say presently one can't compose the equation using braille. Is
>>> this a
>>> feature that will be added in the future? I'm asking more out of
>>> curiosity
>>> than anything. By the time I do get back to taking math classes, LEAN
>>> Math
>>> will be one of the exciting new programs I plan to explore! Even if I
>>> have
>>> to use nasty old MS Word. /grin/
>>>
>>> I like the idea of being able to type in braille while I'm working in
>>> braille, especially on complex tasks. It's not as big a deal for me to
>>> switch back and forth as it was at first, but I still like to think in
>> dots
>>> when I'm using dots, if that makes sense.
>>>
>>> Keep up the good work!
>>>
>>> Tami
>>>
>>> On 03/01/2014 08:56 AM, John Gardner wrote:
>>>> Hi, I will soon be releasing the final beta version of LEAN Math.  If
>>>> you'd like to join the beta list, you are welcome to do so.  Just send
>>>> me an e-mail requesting it.
>>>>
>>>> LEAN Math will soon become a commercial product from ViewPlus, but it
>>>> will basically be free.  ViewPlus will sell it to companies and
>>>> agencies along with a support and training package, but blind
>>>> individuals can get it free without support.  I hope that this list
>>>> will become a LEAN support center for blind people.  I'll be doing
>>>> what I can personally to answer questions and provide guidance.
>>>>
>>>> LEAN Math is an editor and interface to applications that accept
>>>> MathML.
>>>> The first edition is as an interface to MathType in MS Word.  So if
>>>> you have MS Office and MathType, for you it is free.  And you will
>>>> have a nice way to read and write standard scientific documents in MS
>>> Word.
>>>> I have designed LEAN Math to work as efficiently as possible with
>>>> audio feedback, and it works with any screen reader.  It also shows
>>>> several kinds of braille (including Nemeth), though presently you
>>>> cannot compose the equation by typing braille.  There are also lots of
>>>> functions supporting equation manipulation permitting one to solve
>>>> algebraic equations almost as easily as sighted people can do with a
>>> pencil.
>>>> LEAN Math comes with two apps that install short cuts on your desktop.
>>>> One is the LEAN Editor.  You must have a Word file open.  If the
>>>> cursor is on a MathType equation when LEAN_Edit is opened, it opens in
>>> that editor.
>>>> Otherwise the editor opens with a blank equation.  It takes an hour or
>>>> so to read through the documentation that is within the editor to
>>>> learn how to read and write equations, then you just do it.  When
>>>> you've finished composing an equation, press CTRL+s to save it, and
>>>> presto you have a MathType equation with alt text, something readable
>>>> by sighted or blind people.
>>>>
>>>> The other app is LEAN_In, an app that will insert alt text in MathType
>>>> equations that can be read by any screen reader.  Alt text can be
>>>> words or braille.
>>>>
>>>> John Gardner
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: Blindmath [mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of
>>>> Elise Berkley
>>>> Sent: Saturday, March 01, 2014 4:01 AM
>>>> To: BlindMath
>>>> Subject: [Blindmath] Math Computer Program
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hello, everyone.  I am a new subscriber and I love this list already.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I am a new math student in college (even though I am 49 years old).  I
>>>> have been totally blind for 19 years so I still have visuals of
>>>> numbers, etc.  I have Jaws on my laptop and we all know it does not
>>>> work that well with numbers.  I am looking for a software that will
>>>> work to speak math better to me because I am a math major and have a
>>>> long way to go.  I can't afford anything too expensive.  Thanks for
>>>> your help and, again, I have learned new things from all of you
>>>> already.  Elise Berkley
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Elise Berkley
>>>>
>>>> "The joy of the Lord is my strength."
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
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>>>>
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>>
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>
>
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