[BlindMath] Issue Accessing Formulae in Word File

Tue Dec 21 11:01:20 UTC 2021

Hi Bert,

Most of my exposure to Word and mathematics relates to importing Word,
containing math, into the Duxbury Braille software.

Many moons ago, Word contained a scaled down version of MathType when it was
developed by Design Science in the USA.  What is in Word now is anyone's
guess, but you can be sure Microsoft have code of their own in there.

That said, Design Science has been taken over by WIRIS from Spain.

At the end of the day, we have taken the easy way out, and given an
education price of £35.00 (UK Pounds), it is a very small price to pay.  And
especially since it can add equations into WordPress.

George

-----Original Message-----
From: BlindMath <blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Bert Van
Landeghem via BlindMath
Sent: 21 December 2021 04:36
To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics
<blindmath at nfbnet.org>
Cc: Bert Van Landeghem <b.vanlandeghem at sheffield.ac.uk>
Subject: Re: [BlindMath] Issue Accessing Formulae in Word File

Dear George,

Earlier I mentioned that your Mathtype equation was readable. but did you
have to convert this manually? Normally word to TeX converters should be
able to handle equations from the native equations editor in Word. Do you
have an idea what was  particular about the equation I sent you, and why it
might proof so difficult?

Many thanks,
Bert

On Fri, 17 Dec 2021 at 16:15, George Bell via BlindMath <
blindmath at nfbnet.org> wrote:

> Hi Bert,
>
> Just as an experiment, I have replicated the equation using MathType.
>
> Any change?
>
> George
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: BlindMath <blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Bert Van 
> Landeghem via BlindMath
> Sent: 17 December 2021 09:41
> To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics < 
> blindmath at nfbnet.org>
> Cc: Bert Van Landeghem <b.vanlandeghem at sheffield.ac.uk>
> Subject: Re: [BlindMath] Issue Accessing Formulae in Word File
>
> Dear all,
>
> I have now been in touch with the author, who says he has used the 
> native equation editor in Microsoft Word. I am attaching a very short 
> extract to this message (less than half a sentence). It contains a 
> letter \theta which is recognised by pandoc and JAWS, and then another 
> symbol/equation that is not recognised. Any ideas?
>
> Many thanks,
> Bert
>
> On Fri, 17 Dec 2021 at 04:23, Steve Jacobson via BlindMath < 
> blindmath at nfbnet.org> wrote:
>
> > It seems like we may be getting bogged down a bit here.  My 
> > understanding is that it is not known how the formulas were 
> > originally written.  Perhaps we need more information about the 
> > document.  He is using PanDoc.  Does anybody know if PanDoc will 
> > convert formulas in Word to LaTex?  If so, it is probably dependent 
> > upon how the formulas were entered.  It is, of course, possible that 
> > the formulas he is trying to read are actually images that were 
> > captured from another
> program.
> >
> > Since last spring, one can enter equations in Nemeth Code with JAWS 
> > and they are stored in Word's Equation Editor.  I had heard that the 
> > Equation editor can store formulas in a number of formats now, but I 
> > don't know any of the details.  Perhaps others here know.
> >
> > Best regards,
> >
> > Steve Jacobson
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: BlindMath <blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org> On Behalf Of Neil 
> > Soiffer via BlindMath
> > Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2021 5:21 PM
> > To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics < 
> > blindmath at nfbnet.org>
> > Cc: Neil Soiffer <soiffer at alum.mit.edu>
> > Subject: Re: [BlindMath] Issue Accessing Formulae in Word File
> >
> > If the equations are created with MathType, then they are stored in 
> > the docx file as an object that has its own format. MathType is the 
> > program that reads that format, although the format is documented < 
> > https://na01.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fdocs.
> > wiris.com%2Fen%2Fmathtype%2Foffice_tools%2Fmathtype-sdk%2Fmtef4&
> > da
> > ta=04%7C01%7C%7C4e952474db8e4f78950d08d9c0eadfb4%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb
> > 43 
> > 5aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637752937300533934%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8e
> > yJ
> > WIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C30
> > 00 
> > &sdata=M4nAIW1NaUa%2B76neQi5gDixkoFnB7aLAu%2Fcj5SSvmtU%3D&re
> > se
> > rved=0>
> > and
> > one could potentially write something that reads that and converts 
> > it to MathML. That then could be added to pandoc or NVDA or whatever 
> > and thereby eliminate the need for MathType. AFAIK, no one besides 
> > Design Science (now
> > WIRIS) ever implemented a reader for that format. Obviously, it is a 
> > non-trivial amount of work.
> >
> > Neil Soiffer
> >
> >
> > On Thu, Dec 16, 2021 at 12:29 PM Bert Van Landeghem via BlindMath < 
> > blindmath at nfbnet.org> wrote:
> >
> > > Dear Robert,
> > >
> > > Many thanks for your feedback. I will consider Mathtype, but are 
> > > you sure this is the problem I am experiencing? With pandoc one 
> > > should be able to convert docx files to LaTeX.
> > >
> > > Regards,
> > > Bert
> > >
> > > On Thu, 16 Dec 2021 at 17:17, rjaquiss via BlindMath <
> > blindmath at nfbnet.org
> > > >
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > > > Hello Bert:
> > > >
> > > > You will need MathType software to work with Word documents.
> > > > MathType allows a user to convert equasions in Word to Latex.
> > > > MathType is a plugin for Word.
> > > > Hope this helps.
> > > >
> > > > Regards,
> > > >
> > > > Robert
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: BlindMath [mailto:blindmath-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf 
> > > > Of
> > Bert
> > > > Van
> > > > Landeghem via BlindMath
> > > > Sent: Thursday, December 16, 2021 7:43 AM
> > > > To: Blind Math list for those interested in mathematics
> > > > Cc: Bert Van Landeghem
> > > > Subject: [BlindMath] Issue Accessing Formulae in Word File
> > > >
> > > > Dear all,
> > > >
> > > > I received a .docx file and have converted it to LaTeX with Pandoc.
> > > >
> > > > Unfortunately it seems that the formulae are not converted the 
> > > > way I
> > was
> > > > hoping they would be. Scientific notation seems to be translated 
> > > > with images.
> > > > "\includegraphics{media/image16.emf}." is example code. No image 
> > > > files
> > > seem
> > > > however to have been generated. Does anybody know what the 
> > > > problem
> > might
> > > > be, and whether or not there is a possibility to make these 
> > > > equations
> > and
> > > > symbols accessible?
> > > >
> > > > Kind regards,
> > > > Bert
> > > > _______________________________________________
> > > > BlindMath mailing list
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> > %7 
> > C1%7C0%7C637752937300533934%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAw
> > MD
> > AiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=Bt
> > x7
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> > e9 
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> > bG 
> > Zsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn
> > 0% 
> > 3D%7C3000&sdata=CB6G2bnff9gs5lX6eI4yhbbx7JTiiJd3qSPjmddB0oo%3D&a
> > mp
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> > FpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVC
> > I6 
> > Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=Pws987TB9bN0DSHanlC0sKmnTc8NJowDyLMEtLe%2B5i
> > 0%
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> > b8
> > e4f78950d08d9c0eadfb4%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C6
> > 37
> > 752937300533934%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoi
> > V2 
> > luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=0warSRUOr8UaZ8
> > lT
> > trjgYrpcY1ov7RBZVrPjEcHNYXg%3D&reserved=0
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> > MD
> > AiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=Bt
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> > heffield.ac.uk&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4e952474db8e4f78950d08d9c0eadfb
> > 4% 
> > 7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637752937300533934%7CUn
> > kn 
> > own%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haW
> > wi 
> > LCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=7C1PnvrVHtknxT7hA5swcsGI0hu5OSUoxWuC
> > PI
> > HcQJc%3D&reserved=0
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> > b8
> > e4f78950d08d9c0eadfb4%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C6
> > 37
> > 752937300533934%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoi
> > V2 
> > luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=0warSRUOr8UaZ8
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> > trjgYrpcY1ov7RBZVrPjEcHNYXg%3D&reserved=0
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> > MD
> > AiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=Bt
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> > .edu&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4e952474db8e4f78950d08d9c0eadfb4%7C84df9e
> > 7f 
> > e9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637752937300533934%7CUnknown%7CTW
> > Fp 
> > bGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6
> > Mn 
> > 0%3D%7C3000&sdata=rLtByEMSNMe%2Fb7zjXtmJjC%2FkJoB8mbz52NPYX6kdgx
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> > indscience.org%2Fblindmath-gems-home&data=04%7C01%7C%7C4e952474d
> > b8
> > e4f78950d08d9c0eadfb4%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C6
> > 37
> > 752937300533934%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoi
> > V2 
> > luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=0warSRUOr8UaZ8
> > lT
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> > MD
> > AiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=Bt
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> > 84 
> > df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C637752937300533934%7CUnknow
> > n% 
> > 7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLC
> > JX 
> > VCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=lbuVD%2FeXAcv2EMCM9aEUiWqmypOsuzgjCLuvks
> > hH
> > WGI%3D&reserved=0
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> > b8
> > e4f78950d08d9c0eadfb4%7C84df9e7fe9f640afb435aaaaaaaaaaaa%7C1%7C0%7C6
> > 37
> > 752937300533934%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoi
> > V2 
> > luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C3000&sdata=0warSRUOr8UaZ8
> > lT
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