[Blindtlk] To Cane or Not To Cane?

Mon Feb 28 18:56:07 UTC 2011

Yes! This exactly!  Gary said it better than I ever could and I completely 
agree with everything he said.

Julie

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Gary Wunder" <GWunder at earthlink.net>
To: "'Blind Talk Mailing List'" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, February 28, 2011 9:46 AM
Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] To Cane or Not To Cane?

> Hello Jessica. In your note you ask whether you have to sacrifice your
> independence for your boyfriend. I think the answer to that is clearly no.
> If it feels to you like you're sacrificing that independence to satisfy
> someone else, keep using your cane and refuse to hold on to the arm you 
> love
> but do not need. If you come to feel differently about it and can 
> integrate
> what other people are telling you about holding your boyfriend's arm and
> using your cane at the same time, by all means give that a whirl.
>
> I have to admit that your message raises some red flags for me. As a state
> president in the Federation, I have to tell you that I find some women in
> poor relationships that seem to be based on "you, being a blind woman, 
> give
> me a wonderful opportunity to feel like a real man! If you are dependent 
> on
> me for going where you need to go, I have a great deal of say over your
> life." In the extreme, I hear these people calling one another mommy and
> daddy, and the dependence that you talk about is very very real for them.
> Some blind people eventually reject this dependence and cost themselves a
> spouse. Some fall into the trap, become dependent, their spouse tires of 
> the
> continual need to lead them around and comes to find it more of a burden
> than a thrill, moves on, and the blind person has to figure out 
> independence
> all over again. Don't go there. Make sure you understand what your
> boyfriend's real motivation is. It may be that he is a straight up good 
> guy
> who wants you to be independent, and I presume this is so, but if he is
> looking for somebody he can quite literally lead around, beware, for more
> than your blindness independence is at stake.
>
> One other caution if you will indulge me. You say that you will get a 
> house
> where public transportation is available. Many people say this. Some of 
> them
> actually do it. What too often happens, however, is that they start 
> looking
> at house prices or find something they just fall in love with, and
> boom--they sacrifice independent mobility with the assurance that their
> spouse won't mind taking them where they need to go. Maybe it is that they
> say they are buying a starter house  and will soon move, or maybe it is 
> that
> their husband already owns a house and they will live there until it 
> becomes
> economically more practical to move where they can get around by 
> themselves.
> Don't get in this situation. Hold out for being able to travel. Hold out 
> for
> being able to get to places you need to go economically. Don't become a
> prisoner in your own house, and don't put your boyfriend and soon-to-be
> husband in the bind of having to take you everywhere. It happens far too
> frequently and it has real consequences.
>
> I was once married to a sighted woman and subscribed to the idea that when 
> I
> was with someone with vision there was no need for me to bring along a 
> cane.
> One day while we were walking she told me that she thought I was quite
> inconsiderate. I wondered what it was I had done that had provoked her
> anger. She said something like: "you know, we go out on these walks and 
> you
> expect me to watch out for you, which doesn't bother me very much, but it
> occurred to me the other day that if I had a heart attack or sprained my
> ankle or did something that would keep me from going to get help, you've
> placed yourself in a position where you won't be able to help me. For
> somebody who talks a lot about being independent and showing consideration
> for others, I don't think you're showing much consideration or
> independence." That made me angry, but it was one of those angry feelings
> that you have when you know that probably the person who has just made you
> angry has made some good points. I never again went without a cane. I 
> think
> going without a cane would feel as awkward to me as going without pants.
> Some people will patronizingly refer to it as "your badge of 
> independence,"
> and I'm not sure I feel that way about it, but I do feel that it's part of
> my responsibility as a fully functional human being to take responsibility
> for myself, and, to be able to help others if I need to do it.
>
> Having said all of this, I have to say that I often use sighted guide when
> I'm traveling with someone, although sighted guide really is the wrong 
> term
> because I do it whether the person is blind or sighted. I also continue to
> use my cane. If I'm walking through a crowd, I don't want our conversation
> to be interrupted by people cutting between us. It is sometimes difficult 
> to
> stay with another person, and holding their arm or having them hold yours 
> is
> a great way to make sure you are both going the same direction and not
> having to worry about whether your speed is coordinated and other such
> things. When I hold onto someone's arm, it is not that they are going to
> tell me where to go in most cases and it never is that I want them to
> protect me against something that my cane is capable of detecting. It is
> just that this is a very convenient way to stay with the person with whom
> I'm conversing, and it doesn't mean giving up 1 ounce of my independence.
>
> I hope some of this is helpful.
>
> Gary
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of Jessica Kostiw
> Sent: Sunday, February 27, 2011 3:41 PM
> To: 'Blind Talk Mailing List'; 'Pamela Allen'
> Subject: [Blindtlk] To Cane or Not To Cane?
>
> Hello List,
> This is Jessica Kostiw.  I have been on this list for quite a while,
> but do not post very often.  I am hoping to get some good advice on an 
> issue
> that I am sure we have all faced.
>
> I am a Louisiana Center for the Blind graduate, and well appreciate the
> important of the travel skills I acquired there.
> If you are like me though, the significant majority of your time is spent
> with other sighted people.  My longtime boyfriend Jon is sighted.  He has
> actually purchased a cane from the NFB and wants to go under sleep shades 
> to
> see what it is like.  The thing is on the one hand he is very supportive,
> but more and more when we are together in a store or something would very
> much rather that I just take his hand.  He says it's quicker and makes 
> more
> sense, but I want to be able to be independent.  I don't see why he can't
> just walk by me and give me directions or something.  When we do that
> though, he says he feels like he is just calling a dog.  He may as well 
> ring
> a cowbell.  He can't keep up chatter all the time and becomes harder for 
> me
> to follow.  People give dirty looks like "why isn't that guy helping that
> blind lady?"  Part of me understands what he is saying, I have heard the
> same arguments from my mom.  My sister is so impatient and always just
> insists that I take her elbow.  I live in Virginia.  There is no public
> transportation where I live, and I am concerned that always being around
> sighted people with this attitude will eventually cause me to lose my
> skills.  This Email is focusing on the situation with Jon only because I 
> am
> concerned about our future.  We are definitely working towards marriage 
> and
> children and all that and I don't want to feel like I am completely
> dependent on my husband and can't equally contribute when we take any 
> future
> children out in public.  We have already agreed that we will live in an 
> area
> with good public transportation so I won't feel dependent and can do 
> things
> on my own, but again what about when we are together?   Do I have to
> sacrifice my independence to make it easier on him?
>
> Any incite would be greatly appreciated!!
> Jessica
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of Chris Judd
> Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2011 2:31 AM
> To: Blind Talk Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] [PM] Facebook with jaws
>
> I tried accessing the facebook lite site, and it worked.
> http://lite.facebook.com
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Bonnie Lucas" <lucas.bonnie at gmail.com>
> To: "'Blind Talk Mailing List'" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Thursday, February 10, 2011 12:47 AM
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] [PM] Facebook with jaws
>
>
> Not sure what has happened but we discovered the same thing today as well.
> Perhaps it is something that will be fixed soon. My daughter and I tried
> everything to get it to let us click on things but it would not. Not sure
> what's up!
> Bonnie
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of humberto
> Sent: Wednesday, February 09, 2011 7:35 PM
> To: gui-talk at nfbnet.org; nfbcs at nfbnet.org
> Cc: blindTlk at nfbnet.org
> Subject: [Blindtlk] [PM] Facebook with jaws
>
> ---- Original Message ------
> From: Michelle Abadia <michelle.abadia at verizon.net
> Subject: [PM] Facebook with jaws
> Date sent: Wed, 09 Feb 2011 06:40:45 -0500
>
> Hi.
>
> I apologize for the unrelated topic.
> I've been using Facebook successfully on my windows 7 laptop,
> using (www.m.facebook.com), which I think our litt moderator
> suggested because (www.facebook.com) wasn't very accessible with
> jaws.
> This morning, I come to find that now, m.facebook.com isn't
> accessible either! Everything is preceeded by "same page link",
> and when I click on something or try to write a message, the
> system won't let me. This happened overnight, because I was able
> to work on Facebook just 24 hours ago.
>
> Could someone please give me some assistance with this off list
> at
> Michelle.abadia at verizon.net
> ?
>
> Thanks so much in advance.
>
> Michelle Abadia
> ________________________________________
> The Frequently Asked Question page is at:
> http://www.pacmategear.com/FAQ/
> Please feel free to add your suggestions for an FAQ!
>
> Don't forget to check out:
> http://www.pacmategear.com !
>
> _______
>
> PMList mailing list
> PMList at pacmategear.com
> http://pacmategear.com/mailman/listinfo/pmlist_pacmategear.com
>
> To unsubscribe, send a blank email to:
> PMList-unsubscribe at pacmategear.com
> and don't forget to reply to the confirmation email!
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindtlk mailing list
> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindtlk:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/lucas.bonnie%40gma
> il.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindtlk mailing list
> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindtlk:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/chrischas0805%40ch
> arter.net
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindtlk mailing list
> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindtlk:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/jessicac.kostiw%40
> gmail.com
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindtlk mailing list
> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindtlk:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/gwunder%40earthlin
> k.net
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindtlk mailing list
> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for 
> blindtlk:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/julielj%40neb.rr.com
> 