[Blindtlk] blindtlk Digest, Vol 59, Issue 14
Patrick Gormley
kk3f at msn.com
Thu May 12 17:36:16 UTC 2011
your mentor is absolutely correct. Trailing techniques were used when canes
were a lot shorter and I can speak authoritatively that those techniques
aren't nearly as effective as using a longer straight cane. I've been a
cane user for 40 years plus and I've learned those techniques and don't use
them any more.
--------------------------------------------------
From: <blindtlk-request at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2011 1:00 PM
To: <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
Subject: blindtlk Digest, Vol 59, Issue 14
> Send blindtlk mailing list submissions to
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> Today's Topics:
>
> 1. cane travel question: trailing or no trailing? (Chris Nusbaum)
> 2. Re: cane travel question: trailing or no trailing? (Ray Foret Jr)
> 3. Re: note taker development (Ron Poire)
> 4. Re: cane travel question: trailing or no trailing? (Kelby Carlson)
> 5. Re: cane travel question: trailing or no trailing? (Darian Smith)
> 6. Re: cane travel question: trailing or no trailing? (Kelby Carlson)
> 7. Anyone know a place I can get the Vineyard Statement of Faith
> in Braille? (T. J.)
> 8. Re: note taker development (Steve P. Deeley)
> 9. Re: note taker development (David Andrews)
> 10. [nabs-l] Fwd: [HIMS-News] Enter for a chance to win a
> freeSenseView LIGHT. (Chris Nusbaum)
> 11. Re: cane travel question: trailing or no trailing? (Graves, Diane)
> 12. Re: cane travel question: trailing or no trailing? (Kelby Carlson)
> 13. Re: cane travel question: trailing or no trailing? (David Evans)
> 14. Re: cane travel question: trailing or no trailing? (Graves, Diane)
> 15. trailing with your hand or with your cane (Robert J Smith)
> 16. Re: cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
> (Gloria Whipple)
> 17. Re: cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
> (Roberthansen1970 at gmail.com)
> 18. Re: Blindness Misperceptions from kids (Jessica Kostiw)
>
>
> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Message: 1
> Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 15:57:23 -0400
> From: Chris Nusbaum <dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com>
> To: blindtlk at nfbnet.org
> Cc: Fred Schroeder <fschroeder at sks.com>, Aloma Bouma
> <abouma at verizon.net>
> Subject: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
> Message-ID: <4dcaea2a.2d5c340a.4499.0916 at mx.google.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Hi, all.
>
> I have a cane travel question for you. For a long time, I was
> using a folding cane with a pencil tip along with the trailing
> technique, especially in familiar areas i.e. home, school, etc.
> After attending the LAW Program, where they took my folding cane
> on the first day and gave me a straight (aka rigid) cane with a
> metal tip that I was required to use during the four days I was
> there, I started to like the straight cane a lot better and came
> back home with one. I don't think I'll switch back to a folding
> cane unless I have to, by the way. While I was at the program,
> one of the blind mentors was helping me learn how to use this new
> cane, and in the process told me that he would suggest not
> trailing in hallways (whether they be in familiar or unfamiliar
> areas) and trusting the cane alone. He then said that I need to
> work on a faster, more confident pace than I have already. One
> of his reasons for that need of a confident pace, by the way, is
> to "get the girls," LOL. So I tried not trailing in the hallways
> of the Jernigan Institute building, and it did take some getting
> used to. After the program, I thought about what he'd said.
> Although I can understand what he's talking about with the
> confident pace, I think I get twice the information when I
> combine trailing with cane technique. So what do you all think?
> Should I sacrifice the information I get from trailing and just
> try to get more information from the cane, or keep trailing and
> have a little slower pace? Or are there any work-arounds you use
> that keep the confident pace and still trail? Any help would be
> appreciated! Thanks!
>
> Chris Nusbaum
>
> "A loss of sight, never a loss of vision!" (Camp Abilities motto)
>
> --- Sent from my Braille-Note
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 2
> Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 15:03:40 -0500
> From: Ray Foret Jr <rforetjr at att.net>
> To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
> Message-ID: <A144950D-2B09-4DE2-8802-9E84B6C8EF99 at att.net>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> Frankly, you are not sacrificing any information you get from trailing.
> Why? That's because you are mistaken in the belief that you get any
> useful data at all from that technique. Better to develope a faster pace
> and trust your cane; and thus, trust yourself better also. Trailing will
> slow you down and frankly, you'l look strange and lacking in confidence
> compared to the other blind dues around you who are getting the girls
> because they are confident. How's that for insentive?
>
>
> Sincerely,
> The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
>
> Now a very proud and happy Mac user!!!
>
> Skype name:
> barefootedray
>
> Facebook:
> facebook.com/ray.foretjr.1
>
>
>
> On May 11, 2011, at 2:57 PM, Chris Nusbaum wrote:
>
>> Hi, all.
>>
>> I have a cane travel question for you. For a long time, I was using a
>> folding cane with a pencil tip along with the trailing technique,
>> especially in familiar areas i.e. home, school, etc. After attending
>> the LAW Program, where they took my folding cane on the first day and
>> gave me a straight (aka rigid) cane with a metal tip that I was required
>> to use during the four days I was there, I started to like the straight
>> cane a lot better and came back home with one. I don't think I'll switch
>> back to a folding cane unless I have to, by the way. While I was at the
>> program, one of the blind mentors was helping me learn how to use this
>> new cane, and in the process told me that he would suggest not trailing
>> in hallways (whether they be in familiar or unfamiliar areas) and
>> trusting the cane alone. He then said that I need to work on a faster,
>> more confident pace than I have already. One of his reasons for that
>> need of a confident pace, by the way, is to "get the girls," LOL. So I
>> tried not trailing in the hallways of the Jernigan Institute building,
>> and it did take some getting used to. After the program, I thought about
>> what he'd said. Although I can understand what he's talking about with
>> the confident pace, I think I get twice the information when I combine
>> trailing with cane technique. So what do you all think? Should I
>> sacrifice the information I get from trailing and just try to get more
>> information from the cane, or keep trailing and have a little slower
>> pace? Or are there any work-arounds you use that keep the confident pace
>> and still trail? Any help would be appreciated! Thanks!
>>
>> Chris Nusbaum
>>
>> "A loss of sight, never a loss of vision!" (Camp Abilities motto)
>>
>> --- Sent from my Braille-Note
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> blindtlk mailing list
>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> blindtlk:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/rforetjr%40att.net
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 3
> Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 15:26:13 -0500
> From: "Ron Poire" <rpoire at comcast.net>
> To: "Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] note taker development
> Message-ID: <37D255C56E164F748C6998F9BA14FF25 at cla.umn.edu>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
> That sounds like a very interesting idea.
> How will it be funded?
>
> Ron
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Alexander Kaiser" <AlexanderSKaiser90 at gmx.com>
> To: <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>; <nfb-cs at nfbnet.org>; <nfb-science at nfbnet.org>;
> <info at aph.org>; <info at levelstar.com>; <blindgeekzone at yahoogroups.com>;
> <blindgadgets at yahoogroups.com>; <ca.info at humanware.com>;
> <us.info at humanware.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 10:42 PM
> Subject: [Blindtlk] note taker development
>
>
>> Help wanted:
>> Hi my name is Alexander Kaiser. I need help with developing a 100%
>> completely pocket sized handheld braille notetaker with pre-recorded
>> human speech output running under a windows version called windows zoom
>> hyperstorm a new version of windows mobile specifically designed for the
>> blind and Visually Impaired And on a version of linux called Linux ZZt a
>> linux version specifically built for the Blind and Visually Impaired. Can
>> we call it the techno thunder note gold?Can I have help developing this
>> notetaker with the following features: a pocket sized 80 cell braille
>> display with mini thumbkeys, a built in 8 terrabyte internal memory
>> microchip , a mini 10 key perkins style braille keyboard including an
>> enter key six braille keys, a spacebar, and a backspace key, with
>> additional features including access to XM satellite radio with a
>> mandatory Xm radio subscription with the best of sirius subscription
>> required, a sports feed network, a word processor, a game center, access
>> to aim 7.5, internet access , access to email, ameture radio connection
>> via program encoding using morse code, access to citizen band radio
>> transmitions via an audio hosting program, access to klango, access to
>> NOAA weather radio stations, access to asterisk telephone chatline
>> development software,, access to netscape instant messenger, access to
>> ICQ
>> messenger, access to qwitter the adaptive version of twitter, access to
>> facebook, access to MYSpace instant messenger, access to skype, a phone
>> dialer, a media player for music and speech files, a memo recorder, a
>> full
>> dictionary in english, Belgin, Portuegese, latin, hindi, yitish, Danish,
>> German, Russian, Spanish and Dutch, an FM radio, a Theasaurus, a book
>> reader, a newspaper reader, a built in micro chip wireless ethernet
>> card
>> for network stability, a built in wireless microchip internet modem for
>> secure web browsing, an mp3 music file album organizer, a CD writing
>> drive, a CD player, Unlimited access license for ID vault, hotspot
>> shieled,an advanced securety system for file protection, a built in
>> function where the braille keyboard can be used as a keyboard for the
>> computer, a function where the braille keyboard works as a keyboard for
>> bluetooth ready cell phones, a wireless syncronization setting for the
>> braille keyboard can function as a keyboard for non-blutooth capable cell
>> phone devices, a mini bluetooth printer connector, a mini bluetooth
>> Braille embosser connector, a mini serial port for file transforing and
>> data Syncronization, a built in stereo Microphone, an advanced scientific
>> calculator, an address book, and a database manager? I can be contacted
>> by
>> email and by phone . My phone number is 9 7 3 5 2 5 8 0 9 6. My email
>> Address is AlexanderSKaiser90 at gmx.com. My skype for an additional form of
>> contact is alexander.the.great1990. Thank you for your time and
>> consideration.
>> Sincerely,
>> Alexander Kaiser
>> _______________________________________________
>> blindtlk mailing list
>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> blindtlk:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/rpoire%40comcast.net
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 4
> Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 15:31:37 -0500 (CDT)
> From: Kelby Carlson <kelbycarlson at usfamily.net>
> To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
> Message-ID:
> <mailman.78.1305219623.15051.blindtlk_nfbnet.org at nfbnet.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> I'm going to have to agree on this one. I occasionally trail if
> I'm looking for a specific door, but even then it's not always
> necessary. Whether you use a folding or rigid cane, if your
> technique is correct you should have no trouble. (Trust me, it's
> taken me awhile to develop as much confidence as I as far as
> speed of travel goes. I know how you feel.)
>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>From: Ray Foret Jr <rforetjr at att.net
>>To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>Date sent: Wed, 11 May 2011 15:04:47 -0500 (CDT)
>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no
> trailing?
>
>>Frankly, you are not sacrificing any information you get from
> trailing. Why? That's because you are mistaken in the belief
> that you get any useful data at all from that technique. Better
> to develope a faster pace and trust your cane; and thus, trust
> yourself better also. Trailing will slow you down and frankly,
> you'l look strange and lacking in confidence compared to the
> other blind dues around you who are getting the girls because
> they are confident. How's that for insentive?
>
>
>>Sincerely,
>>The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
>
>>Now a very proud and happy Mac user!!!
>
>>Skype name:
>>barefootedray
>
>>Facebook:
>>facebook.com/ray.foretjr.1
>
>
>
>>On May 11, 2011, at 2:57 PM, Chris Nusbaum wrote:
>
>>> Hi, all.
>
>>> I have a cane travel question for you. For a long time, I was
> using a folding cane with a pencil tip along with the trailing
> technique, especially in familiar areas i.e. home, school, etc.
> After attending the LAW Program, where they took my folding cane
> on the first day and gave me a straight (aka rigid) cane with a
> metal tip that I was required to use during the four days I was
> there, I started to like the straight cane a lot better and came
> back home with one. I don't think I'll switch back to a folding
> cane unless I have to, by the way. While I was at the program,
> one of the blind mentors was helping me learn how to use this new
> cane, and in the process told me that he would suggest not
> trailing in hallways (whether they be in familiar or unfamiliar
> areas) and trusting the cane alone. He then said that I need to
> work on a faster, more confident pace than I have already. One
> of his reasons for that need of a confident pace, by the way, is
> to "get the girls," LOL. So I tried not trailing in the hallways
> of the Jernigan Institute building, and it did take some getting
> used to. After the program, I thought about what he'd said.
> Although I can understand what he's talking about with the
> confident pace, I think I get twice the information when I
> combine trailing with cane technique. So what do you all think?
> Should I sacrifice the information I get from trailing and just
> try to get more information from the cane, or keep trailing and
> have a little slower pace? Or are there any work-arounds you use
> that keep the confident pace and still trail? Any help would be
> appreciated! Thanks!
>
>>> Chris Nusbaum
>
>>> "A loss of sight, never a loss of vision!" (Camp Abilities
> motto)
>
>>> --- Sent from my Braille-Note
>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> blindtlk mailing list
>>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
> info for blindtlk:
>>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/rforetj
> r%40att.net
>
>>_______________________________________________
>>blindtlk mailing list
>>blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for blindtlk:
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/kelbyca
> rlson%40usfamily.net
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 5
> Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 13:59:12 -0700
> From: Darian Smith <dsmithnfb at gmail.com>
> To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
> Message-ID: <BANLkTik+vNGc077124EmoZGWfXqLWO0nNw at mail.gmail.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252
>
> I use a combination of two-point touch and constent contact. I
> think that situationally, they both work fine. I would suggest
> getting a handle on contact technique, then challange yourself with
> touch. Shorelining, or trailing is good at times, when you are
> looking for a pathway that is set along a grass line, but I don't use
> it for looking for a door, unless the door it's self is blended
> aginst the wall you are caning past.
> also, while I do like white NFb canes, I also like the Iowa canes,
> they are a little top-heavy, but I like the rolling-tip like feature
> they have, and I think they work very good for jogging/running, if
> you wish to go that route too.
> hth
> Darian
>
>
> On 5/11/11, Kelby Carlson <kelbycarlson at usfamily.net> wrote:
>> I'm going to have to agree on this one. I occasionally trail if
>> I'm looking for a specific door, but even then it's not always
>> necessary. Whether you use a folding or rigid cane, if your
>> technique is correct you should have no trouble. (Trust me, it's
>> taken me awhile to develop as much confidence as I as far as
>> speed of travel goes. I know how you feel.)
>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>From: Ray Foret Jr <rforetjr at att.net
>>>To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>Date sent: Wed, 11 May 2011 15:04:47 -0500 (CDT)
>>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no
>> trailing?
>>
>>>Frankly, you are not sacrificing any information you get from
>> trailing. Why? That's because you are mistaken in the belief
>> that you get any useful data at all from that technique. Better
>> to develope a faster pace and trust your cane; and thus, trust
>> yourself better also. Trailing will slow you down and frankly,
>> you'l look strange and lacking in confidence compared to the
>> other blind dues around you who are getting the girls because
>> they are confident. How's that for insentive?
>>
>>
>>>Sincerely,
>>>The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
>>
>>>Now a very proud and happy Mac user!!!
>>
>>>Skype name:
>>>barefootedray
>>
>>>Facebook:
>>>facebook.com/ray.foretjr.1
>>
>>
>>
>>>On May 11, 2011, at 2:57 PM, Chris Nusbaum wrote:
>>
>>>> Hi, all.
>>
>>>> I have a cane travel question for you. For a long time, I was
>> using a folding cane with a pencil tip along with the trailing
>> technique, especially in familiar areas i.e. home, school, etc.
>> After attending the LAW Program, where they took my folding cane
>> on the first day and gave me a straight (aka rigid) cane with a
>> metal tip that I was required to use during the four days I was
>> there, I started to like the straight cane a lot better and came
>> back home with one. I don't think I'll switch back to a folding
>> cane unless I have to, by the way. While I was at the program,
>> one of the blind mentors was helping me learn how to use this new
>> cane, and in the process told me that he would suggest not
>> trailing in hallways (whether they be in familiar or unfamiliar
>> areas) and trusting the cane alone. He then said that I need to
>> work on a faster, more confident pace than I have already. One
>> of his reasons for that need of a confident pace, by the way, is
>> to "get the girls," LOL. So I tried not trailing in the hallways
>> of the Jernigan Institute building, and it did take some getting
>> used to. After the program, I thought about what he'd said.
>> Although I can understand what he's talking about with the
>> confident pace, I think I get twice the information when I
>> combine trailing with cane technique. So what do you all think?
>> Should I sacrifice the information I get from trailing and just
>> try to get more information from the cane, or keep trailing and
>> have a little slower pace? Or are there any work-arounds you use
>> that keep the confident pace and still trail? Any help would be
>> appreciated! Thanks!
>>
>>>> Chris Nusbaum
>>
>>>> "A loss of sight, never a loss of vision!" (Camp Abilities
>> motto)
>>
>>>> --- Sent from my Braille-Note
>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> blindtlk mailing list
>>>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>> info for blindtlk:
>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/rforetj
>> r%40att.net
>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>blindtlk mailing list
>>>blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for blindtlk:
>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/kelbyca
>> rlson%40usfamily.net
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> blindtlk mailing list
>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> blindtlk:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/dsmithnfb%40gmail.com
>>
>
>
> --
> Darian Smith
> Skype: The_Blind_Truth
> Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com
> Follow me on twitter: http://twitter.com/goldengateace
>
> "The purpose of life is a life of purpose.
>
> ? Robert Byrne
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 6
> Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 16:46:59 -0500 (CDT)
> From: Kelby Carlson <kelbycarlson at usfamily.net>
> To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
> Message-ID:
> <mailman.79.1305219623.15051.blindtlk_nfbnet.org at nfbnet.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> I didn't realize people jogged with canes. Forgive me for asking
> what may be a silly question, but how is it done?
>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>From: Darian Smith <dsmithnfb at gmail.com
>>To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>Date sent: Wed, 11 May 2011 16:01:13 -0500 (CDT)
>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no
> trailing?
>
>>I use a combination of two-point touch and constent
> contact. I
>>think that situationally, they both work fine. I would suggest
>>getting a handle on contact technique, then challange yourself
> with
>>touch. Shorelining, or trailing is good at times, when you are
>>looking for a pathway that is set along a grass line, but I
> don't use
>>it for looking for a door, unless the door it's self is blended
>>aginst the wall you are caning past.
>> also, while I do like white NFb canes, I also like the Iowa
> canes,
>>they are a little top-heavy, but I like the rolling-tip like
> feature
>>they have, and I think they work very good for jogging/running,
> if
>>you wish to go that route too.
>> hth
>> Darian
>
>
>>On 5/11/11, Kelby Carlson <kelbycarlson at usfamily.net> wrote:
>>> I'm going to have to agree on this one. I occasionally trail if
>>> I'm looking for a specific door, but even then it's not always
>>> necessary. Whether you use a folding or rigid cane, if your
>>> technique is correct you should have no trouble. (Trust me,
> it's
>>> taken me awhile to develop as much confidence as I as far as
>>> speed of travel goes. I know how you feel.)
>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>From: Ray Foret Jr <rforetjr at att.net
>>>>To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>Date sent: Wed, 11 May 2011 15:04:47 -0500 (CDT)
>>>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no
>>> trailing?
>
>>>>Frankly, you are not sacrificing any information you get from
>>> trailing. Why? That's because you are mistaken in the belief
>>> that you get any useful data at all from that technique. Better
>>> to develope a faster pace and trust your cane; and thus, trust
>>> yourself better also. Trailing will slow you down and frankly,
>>> you'l look strange and lacking in confidence compared to the
>>> other blind dues around you who are getting the girls because
>>> they are confident. How's that for insentive?
>
>
>>>>Sincerely,
>>>>The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
>
>>>>Now a very proud and happy Mac user!!!
>
>>>>Skype name:
>>>>barefootedray
>
>>>>Facebook:
>>>>facebook.com/ray.foretjr.1
>
>
>
>>>>On May 11, 2011, at 2:57 PM, Chris Nusbaum wrote:
>
>>>>> Hi, all.
>
>>>>> I have a cane travel question for you. For a long time, I was
>>> using a folding cane with a pencil tip along with the trailing
>>> technique, especially in familiar areas i.e. home, school, etc.
>>> After attending the LAW Program, where they took my folding cane
>>> on the first day and gave me a straight (aka rigid) cane with a
>>> metal tip that I was required to use during the four days I was
>>> there, I started to like the straight cane a lot better and came
>>> back home with one. I don't think I'll switch back to a folding
>>> cane unless I have to, by the way. While I was at the program,
>>> one of the blind mentors was helping me learn how to use this
> new
>>> cane, and in the process told me that he would suggest not
>>> trailing in hallways (whether they be in familiar or unfamiliar
>>> areas) and trusting the cane alone. He then said that I need to
>>> work on a faster, more confident pace than I have already. One
>>> of his reasons for that need of a confident pace, by the way, is
>>> to "get the girls," LOL. So I tried not trailing in the
> hallways
>>> of the Jernigan Institute building, and it did take some getting
>>> used to. After the program, I thought about what he'd said.
>>> Although I can understand what he's talking about with the
>>> confident pace, I think I get twice the information when I
>>> combine trailing with cane technique. So what do you all think?
>>> Should I sacrifice the information I get from trailing and just
>>> try to get more information from the cane, or keep trailing and
>>> have a little slower pace? Or are there any work-arounds you use
>>> that keep the confident pace and still trail? Any help would be
>>> appreciated! Thanks!
>
>>>>> Chris Nusbaum
>
>>>>> "A loss of sight, never a loss of vision!" (Camp Abilities
>>> motto)
>
>>>>> --- Sent from my Braille-Note
>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> blindtlk mailing list
>>>>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>> info for blindtlk:
>
>>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/rforetj
>>> r%40att.net
>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>blindtlk mailing list
>>>>blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>> for blindtlk:
>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/kelbyca
>>> rlson%40usfamily.net
>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> blindtlk mailing list
>>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
> info for
>>> blindtlk:
>>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/dsmithn
> fb%40gmail.com
>
>
>
>>--
>>Darian Smith
>>Skype: The_Blind_Truth
>>Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com
>>Follow me on twitter: http://twitter.com/goldengateace
>
>>"The purpose of life is a life of purpose.
>
>>? Robert Byrne
>
>>_______________________________________________
>>blindtlk mailing list
>>blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for blindtlk:
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/kelbyca
> rlson%40usfamily.net
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 7
> Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 16:58:14 -0700 (PDT)
> From: "T. J." <tjmaries at yahoo.com>
> To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: [Blindtlk] Anyone know a place I can get the Vineyard
> Statement of Faith in Braille?
> Message-ID: <667659.47601.qm at web130105.mail.mud.yahoo.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii
>
> Wondering if anyone knows of a place I can get the Vineyard Statement of
> faith
> in Braille.
>
> Thanks,
> T. J.
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 8
> Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 20:24:02 -0400
> From: "Steve P. Deeley" <stevep.deeley at insightbb.com>
> To: "Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] note taker development
> Message-ID: <03AAB0ED381A42A5B676EC9C85545226 at StevePC>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"; Format="flowed"
>
> That is so great!! you can put me down as one of your capitol venture
> folks--say about $100,000!! I'll recoup my initial investment and even
> triple it in less than one year. Every blind person out there will want
> their Rehab agency to pony up!!
> Steve
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Alexander Kaiser" <AlexanderSKaiser90 at gmx.com>
> To: <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>; <nfb-cs at nfbnet.org>; <nfb-science at nfbnet.org>;
> <info at aph.org>; <info at levelstar.com>; <blindgeekzone at yahoogroups.com>;
> <blindgadgets at yahoogroups.com>; <ca.info at humanware.com>;
> <us.info at humanware.com>
> Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2011 11:42 PM
> Subject: [Blindtlk] note taker development
>
>
>> Help wanted:
>> Hi my name is Alexander Kaiser. I need help with developing a 100%
>> completely pocket sized handheld braille notetaker with pre-recorded
>> human speech output running under a windows version called windows zoom
>> hyperstorm a new version of windows mobile specifically designed for the
>> blind and Visually Impaired And on a version of linux called Linux ZZt a
>> linux version specifically built for the Blind and Visually Impaired. Can
>> we call it the techno thunder note gold?Can I have help developing this
>> notetaker with the following features: a pocket sized 80 cell braille
>> display with mini thumbkeys, a built in 8 terrabyte internal memory
>> microchip , a mini 10 key perkins style braille keyboard including an
>> enter key six braille keys, a spacebar, and a backspace key, with
>> additional features including access to XM satellite radio with a
>> mandatory Xm radio subscription with the best of sirius subscription
>> required, a sports feed network, a word processor, a game center, access
>> to aim
>> 7.5, internet access , access to email, ameture radio connection via
>> program encoding using morse code, access to citizen band radio
>> transmitions via an audio hosting program, access to klango, access to
>> NOAA weather radio stations, access to asterisk telephone chatline
>> development software,, access to netscape instant messenger, access to
>> ICQ
>> messenger, access to qwitter the adaptive version of twitter, access to
>> facebook, access to MYSpace instant messenger, access to skype, a phone
>> dialer, a media player for music and speech files, a memo recorder, a
>> full
>> dictionary in english, Belgin, Portuegese, latin, hindi, yitish, Danish,
>> German, Russian, Spanish and Dutch, an FM radio, a Theasaurus, a book
>> reader, a newspaper reader, a built in micro chip wireless ethernet
>> card
>> for network stability, a built in wireless microchip internet modem for
>> secure web browsing, an mp3 music file album organizer, a CD writing
>> drive, a CD player, Unlimited access license for ID vault, hotspot
>> shieled,an advanced securety system for file protection, a built in
>> function where the braille keyboard can be used as a keyboard for the
>> computer, a function where the braille keyboard works as a keyboard for
>> bluetooth ready cell phones, a wireless syncronization setting for the
>> braille keyboard can function as a keyboard for non-blutooth capable cell
>> phone devices, a mini bluetooth printer connector, a mini bluetooth
>> Braille embosser connector, a mini serial port for file transforing and
>> data Syncronization, a built in stereo Microphone, an advanced scientific
>> calculator, an address book, and a database manager? I can be contacted
>> by
>> email and by phone . My phone number is 9 7 3 5 2 5 8 0 9 6. My email
>> Address is AlexanderSKaiser90 at gmx.com. My skype for an additional form of
>> contact is alexander.the.great1990. Thank you for your time and
>> consideration.
>> Sincerely,
>> Alexander Kaiser
>> _______________________________________________
>> blindtlk mailing list
>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> blindtlk:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/stevep.deeley%40insightbb.com
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 9.0.901 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3630 - Release Date: 05/11/11
> 02:34:00
> -------------- next part --------------
>
> No virus found in this outgoing message.
> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
> Version: 9.0.901 / Virus Database: 271.1.1/3630 - Release Date: 05/11/11
> 02:34:00
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 9
> Date: Wed, 11 May 2011 21:48:45 -0500
> From: David Andrews <dandrews at visi.com>
> To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] note taker development
> Message-ID: <auto-000012664777 at mailfront3.g2host.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"; format=flowed
>
> Would you please stop posting this message to our lists. Your
> feature list is ridiculous and you have not responded to anybody's
> messages, so cut it out.
>
> David Andrews, List Owner and Moderator
>
> At 10:42 PM 5/10/2011, you wrote:
>>Help wanted:
>>Hi my name is Alexander Kaiser. I need help with developing a 100%
>>completely pocket sized handheld braille notetaker with
>>pre-recorded human speech output running under a windows version
>>called windows zoom hyperstorm a new version of windows
>>mobile specifically designed for the blind and Visually Impaired
>>And on a version of linux called Linux ZZt a linux version
>>specifically built for the Blind and Visually Impaired. Can we call
>>it the techno thunder note gold?Can I have help developing this
>>notetaker with the following features: a pocket sized 80 cell
>>braille display with mini thumbkeys, a built in 8 terrabyte internal
>>memory microchip , a mini 10 key perkins style braille keyboard
>>including an enter key six braille keys, a spacebar, and a backspace
>>key, with additional features including access to XM satellite radio
>>with a mandatory Xm radio subscription with the best of sirius
>>subscription required, a sports feed network, a word processor, a
>>game center, access to aim 7.5, internet access , access to email,
>>ameture radio connection via program encoding using morse code,
>>access to citizen band radio transmitions via an audio hosting
>>program, access to klango, access to NOAA weather radio stations,
>>access to asterisk telephone chatline development software,, access
>>to netscape instant messenger, access to ICQ messenger, access to
>>qwitter the adaptive version of twitter, access to facebook, access
>>to MYSpace instant messenger, access to skype, a phone dialer, a
>>media player for music and speech files, a memo recorder, a full
>>dictionary in english, Belgin, Portuegese, latin, hindi, yitish,
>>Danish, German, Russian, Spanish and Dutch, an FM radio, a
>>Theasaurus, a book reader, a newspaper reader, a built in micro chip
>>wireless ethernet card for network stability, a built in wireless
>>microchip internet modem for secure web browsing, an mp3 music file
>>album organizer, a CD writing drive, a CD player, Unlimited access
>>license for ID vault, hotspot shieled,an advanced securety system
>>for file protection, a built in function where the braille keyboard
>>can be used as a keyboard for the computer, a function where the
>>braille keyboard works as a keyboard for bluetooth ready cell
>>phones, a wireless syncronization setting for the braille keyboard
>>can function as a keyboard for non-blutooth capable cell phone
>>devices, a mini bluetooth printer connector, a mini bluetooth
>>Braille embosser connector, a mini serial port for file transforing
>>and data Syncronization, a built in stereo Microphone, an advanced
>>scientific calculator, an address book, and a database manager? I
>>can be contacted by email and by phone . My phone number is 9 7 3 5
>>2 5 8 0 9 6. My email Address is AlexanderSKaiser90 at gmx.com. My
>>skype for an additional form of contact is alexander.the.great1990.
>>Thank you for your time and consideration.
>>Sincerely,
>>Alexander Kaiser
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 10
> Date: Thu, 12 May 2011 07:58:02 -0400
> From: Chris Nusbaum <dotkid.nusbaum at gmail.com>
> To: NFB Announce list <nfb-announce at nfbnet.org>, Greater Baltimore
> chapter list <greater-baltimore at nfbnet.org>, Blind Talk list
> <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: [Blindtlk] [nabs-l] Fwd: [HIMS-News] Enter for a chance to
> win a freeSenseView LIGHT.
> Message-ID: <4dcbcb52.8a4ee50a.0b4f.2232 at mx.google.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=EUC-KR; format=flowed
>
> For all low-vision HIMS users... good luck!!!
>
> Chris Nusbaum
>
> "A loss of sight, never a loss of vision!" (Camp Abilities motto)
>
> --- Sent from my Braille-Note
>
> ---- Original Message ------
> From: David Andrews <dandrews at visi.com
> Subject: [nabs-l] Fwd: [HIMS-News] Enter for a chance to win a
> freeSenseView LIGHT.
> Date sent: Tue, 10 May 2011 20:02:32 -0500
>
>
> From: "Jenny Axler" <jenny at hims-inc.com
> To: <hims-news at googlegroups.com
> Subject: [HIMS-News] Enter for a chance to win a free SenseView
> LIGHT.
> Date: Tue, 10 May 2011 16:46:24 -0500
>
> Hello again everyone:
> Due to the overwhelming customer response to
> April?? BookSense DS giveaway, HIMS is pleased
> to offer a chance to win another HIMS product in May.
>
> Visit our website before May 31 and enter for a
> chance to win a free SenseView LIGHT, our
> pocket-sized video magnifier with an AMOLED
> screen, . if you are low vision, or know someone
> who is, visit the following link and register your entry today:
> <http://www.hims-inc.com/enter-chance-win-free-senseview-light>ht
> tp://www.hims-inc.com/enter-chance-win-free-senseview-light
>
> Jenny Axler
> Technical Support Specialist
> HIMS, Inc.
> 4616 West Howard Lane, Suite 960
> Austin, Texas 78728
> Phone: 512-837-2000
> email: Jenny at hims-inc.com
> Web: www.hims-inc.com
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for nabs-l:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/dotkid.nu
> sbaum%40gmail.com
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 11
> Date: Thu, 12 May 2011 08:02:09 -0400
> From: "Graves, Diane" <dgraves at icrc.IN.gov>
> To: "'Blind Talk Mailing List'" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
> Message-ID:
> <355B99F81FB99F48912BFDC096354330142FA444C6 at IOTMVSP03VW.shared.state.in.us>
>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> That one blew me away too. I can't imagine running with a cane.
>
>
> Diane Graves
> Civil Rights Specialist
> Indiana Civil Rights Commission
> Alternative Dispute Resolutions Unit
> 317-232-2647
>
> "It is service that measures success."
> George Washington Carver
>
> Confidentiality Notice: This E-mail transmission may contain confidential
> and/or legally privileged information intended only for the individual or
> entity(ies)
> named in the E-mail address. If you are not the intended recipient, be
> advised that any unauthorized disclosure, copying, distribution, or acting
> in reliance
> upon the contents of this E-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have
> received this E-mail transmission in error, please reply to sender to
> arrange for the return and proper delivery of the transmission.
> Subsequently, delete the message from your system immediately.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of Kelby Carlson
> Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2011 5:47 PM
> To: Blind Talk Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
>
> I didn't realize people jogged with canes. Forgive me for asking
> what may be a silly question, but how is it done?
>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>From: Darian Smith <dsmithnfb at gmail.com
>>To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>Date sent: Wed, 11 May 2011 16:01:13 -0500 (CDT)
>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no
> trailing?
>
>>I use a combination of two-point touch and constent
> contact. I
>>think that situationally, they both work fine. I would suggest
>>getting a handle on contact technique, then challange yourself
> with
>>touch. Shorelining, or trailing is good at times, when you are
>>looking for a pathway that is set along a grass line, but I
> don't use
>>it for looking for a door, unless the door it's self is blended
>>aginst the wall you are caning past.
>> also, while I do like white NFb canes, I also like the Iowa
> canes,
>>they are a little top-heavy, but I like the rolling-tip like
> feature
>>they have, and I think they work very good for jogging/running,
> if
>>you wish to go that route too.
>> hth
>> Darian
>
>
>>On 5/11/11, Kelby Carlson <kelbycarlson at usfamily.net> wrote:
>>> I'm going to have to agree on this one. I occasionally trail if
>>> I'm looking for a specific door, but even then it's not always
>>> necessary. Whether you use a folding or rigid cane, if your
>>> technique is correct you should have no trouble. (Trust me,
> it's
>>> taken me awhile to develop as much confidence as I as far as
>>> speed of travel goes. I know how you feel.)
>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>From: Ray Foret Jr <rforetjr at att.net
>>>>To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>Date sent: Wed, 11 May 2011 15:04:47 -0500 (CDT)
>>>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no
>>> trailing?
>
>>>>Frankly, you are not sacrificing any information you get from
>>> trailing. Why? That's because you are mistaken in the belief
>>> that you get any useful data at all from that technique. Better
>>> to develope a faster pace and trust your cane; and thus, trust
>>> yourself better also. Trailing will slow you down and frankly,
>>> you'l look strange and lacking in confidence compared to the
>>> other blind dues around you who are getting the girls because
>>> they are confident. How's that for insentive?
>
>
>>>>Sincerely,
>>>>The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
>
>>>>Now a very proud and happy Mac user!!!
>
>>>>Skype name:
>>>>barefootedray
>
>>>>Facebook:
>>>>facebook.com/ray.foretjr.1
>
>
>
>>>>On May 11, 2011, at 2:57 PM, Chris Nusbaum wrote:
>
>>>>> Hi, all.
>
>>>>> I have a cane travel question for you. For a long time, I was
>>> using a folding cane with a pencil tip along with the trailing
>>> technique, especially in familiar areas i.e. home, school, etc.
>>> After attending the LAW Program, where they took my folding cane
>>> on the first day and gave me a straight (aka rigid) cane with a
>>> metal tip that I was required to use during the four days I was
>>> there, I started to like the straight cane a lot better and came
>>> back home with one. I don't think I'll switch back to a folding
>>> cane unless I have to, by the way. While I was at the program,
>>> one of the blind mentors was helping me learn how to use this
> new
>>> cane, and in the process told me that he would suggest not
>>> trailing in hallways (whether they be in familiar or unfamiliar
>>> areas) and trusting the cane alone. He then said that I need to
>>> work on a faster, more confident pace than I have already. One
>>> of his reasons for that need of a confident pace, by the way, is
>>> to "get the girls," LOL. So I tried not trailing in the
> hallways
>>> of the Jernigan Institute building, and it did take some getting
>>> used to. After the program, I thought about what he'd said.
>>> Although I can understand what he's talking about with the
>>> confident pace, I think I get twice the information when I
>>> combine trailing with cane technique. So what do you all think?
>>> Should I sacrifice the information I get from trailing and just
>>> try to get more information from the cane, or keep trailing and
>>> have a little slower pace? Or are there any work-arounds you use
>>> that keep the confident pace and still trail? Any help would be
>>> appreciated! Thanks!
>
>>>>> Chris Nusbaum
>
>>>>> "A loss of sight, never a loss of vision!" (Camp Abilities
>>> motto)
>
>>>>> --- Sent from my Braille-Note
>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> blindtlk mailing list
>>>>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>> info for blindtlk:
>
>>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/rforetj
>>> r%40att.net
>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>blindtlk mailing list
>>>>blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>> for blindtlk:
>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/kelbyca
>>> rlson%40usfamily.net
>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> blindtlk mailing list
>>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
> info for
>>> blindtlk:
>>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/dsmithn
> fb%40gmail.com
>
>
>
>>--
>>Darian Smith
>>Skype: The_Blind_Truth
>>Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com
>>Follow me on twitter: http://twitter.com/goldengateace
>
>>"The purpose of life is a life of purpose.
>
>>- Robert Byrne
>
>>_______________________________________________
>>blindtlk mailing list
>>blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for blindtlk:
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/kelbyca
> rlson%40usfamily.net
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindtlk mailing list
> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindtlk:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/dgraves%40icrc.in.gov
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 12
> Date: Thu, 12 May 2011 07:10:32 -0500 (CDT)
> From: Kelby Carlson <kelbycarlson at usfamily.net>
> To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
> Message-ID:
> <mailman.80.1305219623.15051.blindtlk_nfbnet.org at nfbnet.org>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1; format=flowed
>
> Oh, good, I was hoping I wasn't the only one with that reaction.
> I want to run more once I get to college, but I'd planned on
> using a guide.
>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>From: "Graves, Diane" <dgraves at icrc.IN.gov
>>To: "'Blind Talk Mailing List'" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>Date sent: Thu, 12 May 2011 07:03:24 -0500 (CDT)
>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no
> trailing?
>
>>That one blew me away too. I can't imagine running with a cane.
>
>
>>Diane Graves
>>Civil Rights Specialist
>>Indiana Civil Rights Commission
>>Alternative Dispute Resolutions Unit
>>317-232-2647
>
>>"It is service that measures success."
>>George Washington Carver
>
>>Confidentiality Notice: This E-mail transmission may contain
> confidential and/or legally privileged information intended only
> for the individual or entity(ies)
>>named in the E-mail address. If you are not the intended
> recipient, be advised that any unauthorized disclosure, copying,
> distribution, or acting in reliance
>>upon the contents of this E-mail is strictly prohibited. If you
> have received this E-mail transmission in error, please reply to
> sender to arrange for the return and proper delivery of the
> transmission. Subsequently, delete the message from your system
> immediately.
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org
> [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf Of Kelby Carlson
>>Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2011 5:47 PM
>>To: Blind Talk Mailing List
>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no
> trailing?
>
>>I didn't realize people jogged with canes. Forgive me for asking
>>what may be a silly question, but how is it done?
>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>From: Darian Smith <dsmithnfb at gmail.com
>>>To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>Date sent: Wed, 11 May 2011 16:01:13 -0500 (CDT)
>>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no
>>trailing?
>
>>>I use a combination of two-point touch and constent
>>contact. I
>>>think that situationally, they both work fine. I would suggest
>>>getting a handle on contact technique, then challange yourself
>>with
>>>touch. Shorelining, or trailing is good at times, when you are
>>>looking for a pathway that is set along a grass line, but I
>>don't use
>>>it for looking for a door, unless the door it's self is blended
>>>aginst the wall you are caning past.
>>> also, while I do like white NFb canes, I also like the Iowa
>>canes,
>>>they are a little top-heavy, but I like the rolling-tip like
>>feature
>>>they have, and I think they work very good for jogging/running,
>>if
>>>you wish to go that route too.
>>> hth
>>> Darian
>
>
>>>On 5/11/11, Kelby Carlson <kelbycarlson at usfamily.net> wrote:
>>>> I'm going to have to agree on this one. I occasionally trail if
>>>> I'm looking for a specific door, but even then it's not always
>>>> necessary. Whether you use a folding or rigid cane, if your
>>>> technique is correct you should have no trouble. (Trust me,
>>it's
>>>> taken me awhile to develop as much confidence as I as far as
>>>> speed of travel goes. I know how you feel.)
>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>From: Ray Foret Jr <rforetjr at att.net
>>>>>To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>Date sent: Wed, 11 May 2011 15:04:47 -0500 (CDT)
>>>>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no
>>>> trailing?
>
>>>>>Frankly, you are not sacrificing any information you get from
>>>> trailing. Why? That's because you are mistaken in the belief
>>>> that you get any useful data at all from that technique. Better
>>>> to develope a faster pace and trust your cane; and thus, trust
>>>> yourself better also. Trailing will slow you down and frankly,
>>>> you'l look strange and lacking in confidence compared to the
>>>> other blind dues around you who are getting the girls because
>>>> they are confident. How's that for insentive?
>
>
>>>>>Sincerely,
>>>>>The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
>
>>>>>Now a very proud and happy Mac user!!!
>
>>>>>Skype name:
>>>>>barefootedray
>
>>>>>Facebook:
>>>>>facebook.com/ray.foretjr.1
>
>
>
>>>>>On May 11, 2011, at 2:57 PM, Chris Nusbaum wrote:
>
>>>>>> Hi, all.
>
>>>>>> I have a cane travel question for you. For a long time, I was
>>>> using a folding cane with a pencil tip along with the trailing
>>>> technique, especially in familiar areas i.e. home, school, etc.
>>>> After attending the LAW Program, where they took my folding cane
>>>> on the first day and gave me a straight (aka rigid) cane with a
>>>> metal tip that I was required to use during the four days I was
>>>> there, I started to like the straight cane a lot better and came
>>>> back home with one. I don't think I'll switch back to a folding
>>>> cane unless I have to, by the way. While I was at the program,
>>>> one of the blind mentors was helping me learn how to use this
>>new
>>>> cane, and in the process told me that he would suggest not
>>>> trailing in hallways (whether they be in familiar or unfamiliar
>>>> areas) and trusting the cane alone. He then said that I need to
>>>> work on a faster, more confident pace than I have already. One
>>>> of his reasons for that need of a confident pace, by the way, is
>>>> to "get the girls," LOL. So I tried not trailing in the
>>hallways
>>>> of the Jernigan Institute building, and it did take some getting
>>>> used to. After the program, I thought about what he'd said.
>>>> Although I can understand what he's talking about with the
>>>> confident pace, I think I get twice the information when I
>>>> combine trailing with cane technique. So what do you all think?
>>>> Should I sacrifice the information I get from trailing and just
>>>> try to get more information from the cane, or keep trailing and
>>>> have a little slower pace? Or are there any work-arounds you use
>>>> that keep the confident pace and still trail? Any help would be
>>>> appreciated! Thanks!
>
>>>>>> Chris Nusbaum
>
>>>>>> "A loss of sight, never a loss of vision!" (Camp Abilities
>>>> motto)
>
>>>>>> --- Sent from my Braille-Note
>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> blindtlk mailing list
>>>>>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>> info for blindtlk:
>
>
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/rforetj
>>>> r%40att.net
>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>blindtlk mailing list
>>>>>blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>> for blindtlk:
>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/kelbyca
>>>> rlson%40usfamily.net
>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> blindtlk mailing list
>>>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>info for
>>>> blindtlk:
>
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/dsmithn
>>fb%40gmail.com
>
>
>
>>>--
>>>Darian Smith
>>>Skype: The_Blind_Truth
>>>Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com
>>>Follow me on twitter: http://twitter.com/goldengateace
>
>>>"The purpose of life is a life of purpose.
>
>>>- Robert Byrne
>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>blindtlk mailing list
>>>blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>for blindtlk:
>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/kelbyca
>>rlson%40usfamily.net
>
>>_______________________________________________
>>blindtlk mailing list
>>blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for blindtlk:
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/dgraves
> %40icrc.in.gov
>
>>_______________________________________________
>>blindtlk mailing list
>>blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for blindtlk:
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/kelbyca
> rlson%40usfamily.net
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 13
> Date: Thu, 12 May 2011 09:18:59 -0400
> From: "David Evans" <drevans at bellsouth.net>
> To: "Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
> Message-ID: <98E52FD6C3B7409C882A1E1C642609D5 at DAVID>
> Content-Type: text/plain; format=flowed; charset="iso-8859-1";
> reply-type=original
>
>
> Dear Dianna,
>
> Many years ago, I observed Dr. Jernigan jogging around the National Center
> in Baltimore. As I use to be a runner and wanted to do so again, I
> watched
> him and asked him how it works with using a cane.
> He told me that he walks around the block first, just to make sure there
> are
> no cars parked at the curbs and he then runs in the street and lightly
> taps
> his cane against the side of the curb as he goes. He then runs laps
> around
> the block till he would reach his goal. He was in his 70's then.
> Maybe some others have some advice to add.
>
> David Evans, NFBF and GD Jack.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Graves, Diane" <dgraves at icrc.IN.gov>
> To: "'Blind Talk Mailing List'" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2011 8:02 AM
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
>
>
>> That one blew me away too. I can't imagine running with a cane.
>>
>>
>> Diane Graves
>> Civil Rights Specialist
>> Indiana Civil Rights Commission
>> Alternative Dispute Resolutions Unit
>> 317-232-2647
>>
>> "It is service that measures success."
>> George Washington Carver
>>
>> Confidentiality Notice: This E-mail transmission may contain confidential
>> and/or legally privileged information intended only for the individual or
>> entity(ies)
>> named in the E-mail address. If you are not the intended recipient, be
>> advised that any unauthorized disclosure, copying, distribution, or
>> acting
>> in reliance
>> upon the contents of this E-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have
>> received this E-mail transmission in error, please reply to sender to
>> arrange for the return and proper delivery of the transmission.
>> Subsequently, delete the message from your system immediately.
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>> Behalf Of Kelby Carlson
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2011 5:47 PM
>> To: Blind Talk Mailing List
>> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
>>
>> I didn't realize people jogged with canes. Forgive me for asking
>> what may be a silly question, but how is it done?
>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>From: Darian Smith <dsmithnfb at gmail.com
>>>To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>Date sent: Wed, 11 May 2011 16:01:13 -0500 (CDT)
>>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no
>> trailing?
>>
>>>I use a combination of two-point touch and constent
>> contact. I
>>>think that situationally, they both work fine. I would suggest
>>>getting a handle on contact technique, then challange yourself
>> with
>>>touch. Shorelining, or trailing is good at times, when you are
>>>looking for a pathway that is set along a grass line, but I
>> don't use
>>>it for looking for a door, unless the door it's self is blended
>>>aginst the wall you are caning past.
>>> also, while I do like white NFb canes, I also like the Iowa
>> canes,
>>>they are a little top-heavy, but I like the rolling-tip like
>> feature
>>>they have, and I think they work very good for jogging/running,
>> if
>>>you wish to go that route too.
>>> hth
>>> Darian
>>
>>
>>>On 5/11/11, Kelby Carlson <kelbycarlson at usfamily.net> wrote:
>>>> I'm going to have to agree on this one. I occasionally trail if
>>>> I'm looking for a specific door, but even then it's not always
>>>> necessary. Whether you use a folding or rigid cane, if your
>>>> technique is correct you should have no trouble. (Trust me,
>> it's
>>>> taken me awhile to develop as much confidence as I as far as
>>>> speed of travel goes. I know how you feel.)
>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>From: Ray Foret Jr <rforetjr at att.net
>>>>>To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>Date sent: Wed, 11 May 2011 15:04:47 -0500 (CDT)
>>>>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no
>>>> trailing?
>>
>>>>>Frankly, you are not sacrificing any information you get from
>>>> trailing. Why? That's because you are mistaken in the belief
>>>> that you get any useful data at all from that technique. Better
>>>> to develope a faster pace and trust your cane; and thus, trust
>>>> yourself better also. Trailing will slow you down and frankly,
>>>> you'l look strange and lacking in confidence compared to the
>>>> other blind dues around you who are getting the girls because
>>>> they are confident. How's that for insentive?
>>
>>
>>>>>Sincerely,
>>>>>The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
>>
>>>>>Now a very proud and happy Mac user!!!
>>
>>>>>Skype name:
>>>>>barefootedray
>>
>>>>>Facebook:
>>>>>facebook.com/ray.foretjr.1
>>
>>
>>
>>>>>On May 11, 2011, at 2:57 PM, Chris Nusbaum wrote:
>>
>>>>>> Hi, all.
>>
>>>>>> I have a cane travel question for you. For a long time, I was
>>>> using a folding cane with a pencil tip along with the trailing
>>>> technique, especially in familiar areas i.e. home, school, etc.
>>>> After attending the LAW Program, where they took my folding cane
>>>> on the first day and gave me a straight (aka rigid) cane with a
>>>> metal tip that I was required to use during the four days I was
>>>> there, I started to like the straight cane a lot better and came
>>>> back home with one. I don't think I'll switch back to a folding
>>>> cane unless I have to, by the way. While I was at the program,
>>>> one of the blind mentors was helping me learn how to use this
>> new
>>>> cane, and in the process told me that he would suggest not
>>>> trailing in hallways (whether they be in familiar or unfamiliar
>>>> areas) and trusting the cane alone. He then said that I need to
>>>> work on a faster, more confident pace than I have already. One
>>>> of his reasons for that need of a confident pace, by the way, is
>>>> to "get the girls," LOL. So I tried not trailing in the
>> hallways
>>>> of the Jernigan Institute building, and it did take some getting
>>>> used to. After the program, I thought about what he'd said.
>>>> Although I can understand what he's talking about with the
>>>> confident pace, I think I get twice the information when I
>>>> combine trailing with cane technique. So what do you all think?
>>>> Should I sacrifice the information I get from trailing and just
>>>> try to get more information from the cane, or keep trailing and
>>>> have a little slower pace? Or are there any work-arounds you use
>>>> that keep the confident pace and still trail? Any help would be
>>>> appreciated! Thanks!
>>
>>>>>> Chris Nusbaum
>>
>>>>>> "A loss of sight, never a loss of vision!" (Camp Abilities
>>>> motto)
>>
>>>>>> --- Sent from my Braille-Note
>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> blindtlk mailing list
>>>>>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>> info for blindtlk:
>>
>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/rforetj
>>>> r%40att.net
>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>blindtlk mailing list
>>>>>blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>> for blindtlk:
>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/kelbyca
>>>> rlson%40usfamily.net
>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> blindtlk mailing list
>>>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>> info for
>>>> blindtlk:
>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/dsmithn
>> fb%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>>
>>>--
>>>Darian Smith
>>>Skype: The_Blind_Truth
>>>Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com
>>>Follow me on twitter: http://twitter.com/goldengateace
>>
>>>"The purpose of life is a life of purpose.
>>
>>>- Robert Byrne
>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>blindtlk mailing list
>>>blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for blindtlk:
>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/kelbyca
>> rlson%40usfamily.net
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> blindtlk mailing list
>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> blindtlk:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/dgraves%40icrc.in.gov
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> blindtlk mailing list
>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> blindtlk:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/drevans%40bellsouth.net
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 14
> Date: Thu, 12 May 2011 09:43:01 -0400
> From: "Graves, Diane" <dgraves at icrc.IN.gov>
> To: "'Blind Talk Mailing List'" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
> Message-ID:
> <355B99F81FB99F48912BFDC096354330142FA444C7 at IOTMVSP03VW.shared.state.in.us>
>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Wow! I never would have thought. That's pretty amazing. Of course, I have
> to say that running was never something that appealed to me much anyway,
> LOL,, so I can't say that I ever would have done much to explore such a
> possibility. Never was much of an athlete I'm afraid.
>
>
> Diane Graves
> Civil Rights Specialist
> Indiana Civil Rights Commission
> Alternative Dispute Resolutions Unit
> 317-232-2647
>
> "It is service that measures success."
> George Washington Carver
>
> Confidentiality Notice: This E-mail transmission may contain confidential
> and/or legally privileged information intended only for the individual or
> entity(ies)
> named in the E-mail address. If you are not the intended recipient, be
> advised that any unauthorized disclosure, copying, distribution, or acting
> in reliance
> upon the contents of this E-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have
> received this E-mail transmission in error, please reply to sender to
> arrange for the return and proper delivery of the transmission.
> Subsequently, delete the message from your system immediately.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of David Evans
> Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2011 9:19 AM
> To: Blind Talk Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
>
>
> Dear Dianna,
>
> Many years ago, I observed Dr. Jernigan jogging around the National Center
> in Baltimore. As I use to be a runner and wanted to do so again, I
> watched
> him and asked him how it works with using a cane.
> He told me that he walks around the block first, just to make sure there
> are
> no cars parked at the curbs and he then runs in the street and lightly
> taps
> his cane against the side of the curb as he goes. He then runs laps
> around
> the block till he would reach his goal. He was in his 70's then.
> Maybe some others have some advice to add.
>
> David Evans, NFBF and GD Jack.
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: "Graves, Diane" <dgraves at icrc.IN.gov>
> To: "'Blind Talk Mailing List'" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2011 8:02 AM
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
>
>
>> That one blew me away too. I can't imagine running with a cane.
>>
>>
>> Diane Graves
>> Civil Rights Specialist
>> Indiana Civil Rights Commission
>> Alternative Dispute Resolutions Unit
>> 317-232-2647
>>
>> "It is service that measures success."
>> George Washington Carver
>>
>> Confidentiality Notice: This E-mail transmission may contain confidential
>> and/or legally privileged information intended only for the individual or
>> entity(ies)
>> named in the E-mail address. If you are not the intended recipient, be
>> advised that any unauthorized disclosure, copying, distribution, or
>> acting
>> in reliance
>> upon the contents of this E-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have
>> received this E-mail transmission in error, please reply to sender to
>> arrange for the return and proper delivery of the transmission.
>> Subsequently, delete the message from your system immediately.
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
>> Behalf Of Kelby Carlson
>> Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2011 5:47 PM
>> To: Blind Talk Mailing List
>> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
>>
>> I didn't realize people jogged with canes. Forgive me for asking
>> what may be a silly question, but how is it done?
>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>From: Darian Smith <dsmithnfb at gmail.com
>>>To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>Date sent: Wed, 11 May 2011 16:01:13 -0500 (CDT)
>>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no
>> trailing?
>>
>>>I use a combination of two-point touch and constent
>> contact. I
>>>think that situationally, they both work fine. I would suggest
>>>getting a handle on contact technique, then challange yourself
>> with
>>>touch. Shorelining, or trailing is good at times, when you are
>>>looking for a pathway that is set along a grass line, but I
>> don't use
>>>it for looking for a door, unless the door it's self is blended
>>>aginst the wall you are caning past.
>>> also, while I do like white NFb canes, I also like the Iowa
>> canes,
>>>they are a little top-heavy, but I like the rolling-tip like
>> feature
>>>they have, and I think they work very good for jogging/running,
>> if
>>>you wish to go that route too.
>>> hth
>>> Darian
>>
>>
>>>On 5/11/11, Kelby Carlson <kelbycarlson at usfamily.net> wrote:
>>>> I'm going to have to agree on this one. I occasionally trail if
>>>> I'm looking for a specific door, but even then it's not always
>>>> necessary. Whether you use a folding or rigid cane, if your
>>>> technique is correct you should have no trouble. (Trust me,
>> it's
>>>> taken me awhile to develop as much confidence as I as far as
>>>> speed of travel goes. I know how you feel.)
>>
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>From: Ray Foret Jr <rforetjr at att.net
>>>>>To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>Date sent: Wed, 11 May 2011 15:04:47 -0500 (CDT)
>>>>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no
>>>> trailing?
>>
>>>>>Frankly, you are not sacrificing any information you get from
>>>> trailing. Why? That's because you are mistaken in the belief
>>>> that you get any useful data at all from that technique. Better
>>>> to develope a faster pace and trust your cane; and thus, trust
>>>> yourself better also. Trailing will slow you down and frankly,
>>>> you'l look strange and lacking in confidence compared to the
>>>> other blind dues around you who are getting the girls because
>>>> they are confident. How's that for insentive?
>>
>>
>>>>>Sincerely,
>>>>>The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
>>
>>>>>Now a very proud and happy Mac user!!!
>>
>>>>>Skype name:
>>>>>barefootedray
>>
>>>>>Facebook:
>>>>>facebook.com/ray.foretjr.1
>>
>>
>>
>>>>>On May 11, 2011, at 2:57 PM, Chris Nusbaum wrote:
>>
>>>>>> Hi, all.
>>
>>>>>> I have a cane travel question for you. For a long time, I was
>>>> using a folding cane with a pencil tip along with the trailing
>>>> technique, especially in familiar areas i.e. home, school, etc.
>>>> After attending the LAW Program, where they took my folding cane
>>>> on the first day and gave me a straight (aka rigid) cane with a
>>>> metal tip that I was required to use during the four days I was
>>>> there, I started to like the straight cane a lot better and came
>>>> back home with one. I don't think I'll switch back to a folding
>>>> cane unless I have to, by the way. While I was at the program,
>>>> one of the blind mentors was helping me learn how to use this
>> new
>>>> cane, and in the process told me that he would suggest not
>>>> trailing in hallways (whether they be in familiar or unfamiliar
>>>> areas) and trusting the cane alone. He then said that I need to
>>>> work on a faster, more confident pace than I have already. One
>>>> of his reasons for that need of a confident pace, by the way, is
>>>> to "get the girls," LOL. So I tried not trailing in the
>> hallways
>>>> of the Jernigan Institute building, and it did take some getting
>>>> used to. After the program, I thought about what he'd said.
>>>> Although I can understand what he's talking about with the
>>>> confident pace, I think I get twice the information when I
>>>> combine trailing with cane technique. So what do you all think?
>>>> Should I sacrifice the information I get from trailing and just
>>>> try to get more information from the cane, or keep trailing and
>>>> have a little slower pace? Or are there any work-arounds you use
>>>> that keep the confident pace and still trail? Any help would be
>>>> appreciated! Thanks!
>>
>>>>>> Chris Nusbaum
>>
>>>>>> "A loss of sight, never a loss of vision!" (Camp Abilities
>>>> motto)
>>
>>>>>> --- Sent from my Braille-Note
>>
>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>> blindtlk mailing list
>>>>>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>> info for blindtlk:
>>
>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/rforetj
>>>> r%40att.net
>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>>blindtlk mailing list
>>>>>blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>>> for blindtlk:
>>>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/kelbyca
>>>> rlson%40usfamily.net
>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> blindtlk mailing list
>>>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>> info for
>>>> blindtlk:
>>>>
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/dsmithn
>> fb%40gmail.com
>>
>>
>>
>>>--
>>>Darian Smith
>>>Skype: The_Blind_Truth
>>>Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com
>>>Follow me on twitter: http://twitter.com/goldengateace
>>
>>>"The purpose of life is a life of purpose.
>>
>>>- Robert Byrne
>>
>>>_______________________________________________
>>>blindtlk mailing list
>>>blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> for blindtlk:
>>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/kelbyca
>> rlson%40usfamily.net
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> blindtlk mailing list
>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> blindtlk:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/dgraves%40icrc.in.gov
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> blindtlk mailing list
>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> blindtlk:
>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/drevans%40bellsouth.net
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindtlk mailing list
> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindtlk:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/dgraves%40icrc.in.gov
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 15
> Date: Thu, 12 May 2011 11:27:14 -0400
> From: Robert J Smith <rsmith247 at csc.com>
> To: BLINDTLK at nfbnet.org
> Subject: [Blindtlk] trailing with your hand or with your cane
> Message-ID:
> <OF4E6AB4AD.817075EB-ON8525788E.0053245B-8525788E.0054E429 at csc.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="US-ASCII"
>
> Hi all. My belief is that if you move your hand along a wall at your side
> versus sliding your cane tip along a wall, it makes no difference. They
> both will be noticed whether we like it or not. I believe that people
> will notice anything we do that they don't do and that one thing is no
> more likely to get noticed than another. You might keep in mind that if
> you walk fast and trail, you run somewhat of a risk of banging your arm
> into something that would be sticking out.
>
> One example of being noticed no matter what, happened to me very recently.
> I was walking to my bus stop. On the way to the stop there are numerous
> driveways with a very slight drop-off to the street at the bottom of their
> slopes. I check the drop-offs with one foot and my cane to make certain
> where the intersecting street is so I can turn left off the street I'm
> walking along and go west one street where the bus stop is. On this
> particular day, I had found the intersecting street, crossed the street I
> was walking along and headed west to the bus stop. About two or three
> minutes later, a man and woman came along. She asked me if I was alright
> because she said that she had seen me almost trip. I was so surprised
> that I didn't know what she meant at first. I told her that I was fine,
> just waiting for a bus. As I thought about it after she left, I realized
> that she had probably seen me dip down as I went across the slopes of a
> couple driveways, as well as putting my foot out to test for the slight
> drop-off and then bring it back again. I was nowhere near tripping
> though, hadn't even been anywhere close to pitching forward, just checking
> things out. I'd rather risk looking a little conspicuous though than die,
> as the street I turn down to go to the bus stop is very busy with no
> light. So, in summary, try to be as inconspicuous as possible and when
> you honestly can't that's the way things go and so be it.
>
> Bob Smith
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 16
> Date: Thu, 12 May 2011 08:37:58 -0700
> From: "Gloria Whipple" <ladygloria at webband.com>
> To: "'Blind Talk Mailing List'" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
> Message-ID: <001201cc10ba$924775e0$b6d661a0$@com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Me neither!
>
>
> Gloria Whipple
> Corresponding Secretary
> Inland Empire chapter
> nfb of WA
>
> Cell: 509-475-4993
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of Graves, Diane
> Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2011 05:02
> To: 'Blind Talk Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
>
> That one blew me away too. I can't imagine running with a cane.
>
>
> Diane Graves
> Civil Rights Specialist
> Indiana Civil Rights Commission
> Alternative Dispute Resolutions Unit
> 317-232-2647
>
> "It is service that measures success."
> George Washington Carver
>
> Confidentiality Notice: This E-mail transmission may contain confidential
> and/or legally privileged information intended only for the individual or
> entity(ies)
> named in the E-mail address. If you are not the intended recipient, be
> advised that any unauthorized disclosure, copying, distribution, or acting
> in reliance
> upon the contents of this E-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have
> received this E-mail transmission in error, please reply to sender to
> arrange for the return and proper delivery of the transmission.
> Subsequently, delete the message from your system immediately.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of Kelby Carlson
> Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2011 5:47 PM
> To: Blind Talk Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
>
> I didn't realize people jogged with canes. Forgive me for asking
> what may be a silly question, but how is it done?
>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>From: Darian Smith <dsmithnfb at gmail.com
>>To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>Date sent: Wed, 11 May 2011 16:01:13 -0500 (CDT)
>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no
> trailing?
>
>>I use a combination of two-point touch and constent
> contact. I
>>think that situationally, they both work fine. I would suggest
>>getting a handle on contact technique, then challange yourself
> with
>>touch. Shorelining, or trailing is good at times, when you are
>>looking for a pathway that is set along a grass line, but I
> don't use
>>it for looking for a door, unless the door it's self is blended
>>aginst the wall you are caning past.
>> also, while I do like white NFb canes, I also like the Iowa
> canes,
>>they are a little top-heavy, but I like the rolling-tip like
> feature
>>they have, and I think they work very good for jogging/running,
> if
>>you wish to go that route too.
>> hth
>> Darian
>
>
>>On 5/11/11, Kelby Carlson <kelbycarlson at usfamily.net> wrote:
>>> I'm going to have to agree on this one. I occasionally trail if
>>> I'm looking for a specific door, but even then it's not always
>>> necessary. Whether you use a folding or rigid cane, if your
>>> technique is correct you should have no trouble. (Trust me,
> it's
>>> taken me awhile to develop as much confidence as I as far as
>>> speed of travel goes. I know how you feel.)
>
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>From: Ray Foret Jr <rforetjr at att.net
>>>>To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>Date sent: Wed, 11 May 2011 15:04:47 -0500 (CDT)
>>>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no
>>> trailing?
>
>>>>Frankly, you are not sacrificing any information you get from
>>> trailing. Why? That's because you are mistaken in the belief
>>> that you get any useful data at all from that technique. Better
>>> to develope a faster pace and trust your cane; and thus, trust
>>> yourself better also. Trailing will slow you down and frankly,
>>> you'l look strange and lacking in confidence compared to the
>>> other blind dues around you who are getting the girls because
>>> they are confident. How's that for insentive?
>
>
>>>>Sincerely,
>>>>The Constantly Barefooted Ray!!!
>
>>>>Now a very proud and happy Mac user!!!
>
>>>>Skype name:
>>>>barefootedray
>
>>>>Facebook:
>>>>facebook.com/ray.foretjr.1
>
>
>
>>>>On May 11, 2011, at 2:57 PM, Chris Nusbaum wrote:
>
>>>>> Hi, all.
>
>>>>> I have a cane travel question for you. For a long time, I was
>>> using a folding cane with a pencil tip along with the trailing
>>> technique, especially in familiar areas i.e. home, school, etc.
>>> After attending the LAW Program, where they took my folding cane
>>> on the first day and gave me a straight (aka rigid) cane with a
>>> metal tip that I was required to use during the four days I was
>>> there, I started to like the straight cane a lot better and came
>>> back home with one. I don't think I'll switch back to a folding
>>> cane unless I have to, by the way. While I was at the program,
>>> one of the blind mentors was helping me learn how to use this
> new
>>> cane, and in the process told me that he would suggest not
>>> trailing in hallways (whether they be in familiar or unfamiliar
>>> areas) and trusting the cane alone. He then said that I need to
>>> work on a faster, more confident pace than I have already. One
>>> of his reasons for that need of a confident pace, by the way, is
>>> to "get the girls," LOL. So I tried not trailing in the
> hallways
>>> of the Jernigan Institute building, and it did take some getting
>>> used to. After the program, I thought about what he'd said.
>>> Although I can understand what he's talking about with the
>>> confident pace, I think I get twice the information when I
>>> combine trailing with cane technique. So what do you all think?
>>> Should I sacrifice the information I get from trailing and just
>>> try to get more information from the cane, or keep trailing and
>>> have a little slower pace? Or are there any work-arounds you use
>>> that keep the confident pace and still trail? Any help would be
>>> appreciated! Thanks!
>
>>>>> Chris Nusbaum
>
>>>>> "A loss of sight, never a loss of vision!" (Camp Abilities
>>> motto)
>
>>>>> --- Sent from my Braille-Note
>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> blindtlk mailing list
>>>>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>> info for blindtlk:
>
>>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/rforetj
>>> r%40att.net
>
>>>>_______________________________________________
>>>>blindtlk mailing list
>>>>blindtlk at nfbnet.org
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>>>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>> for blindtlk:
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>>> rlson%40usfamily.net
>
>>> _______________________________________________
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>>> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
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>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
> info for
>>> blindtlk:
>>>
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/dsmithn
> fb%40gmail.com
>
>
>
>>--
>>Darian Smith
>>Skype: The_Blind_Truth
>>Windows Live: Lightningrod2010 at live.com
>>Follow me on twitter: http://twitter.com/goldengateace
>
>>"The purpose of life is a life of purpose.
>
>>- Robert Byrne
>
>>_______________________________________________
>>blindtlk mailing list
>>blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
> for blindtlk:
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/kelbyca
> rlson%40usfamily.net
>
> _______________________________________________
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> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindtlk:
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> gov
>
> _______________________________________________
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> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindtlk:
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> nd.com
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 17
> Date: Thu, 12 May 2011 09:09:03 -0700 (PDT)
> From: "Roberthansen1970 at gmail.com" <roberthansen1970 at gmail.com>
> To: blindtlk at nfbnet.org
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
> Message-ID: <4dcc061f.c240440a.0e29.5161 at mx.google.com>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1"
>
> I have seen these guys do it. They have game. I used to hear about
> jernigan and his chain saw.
> -----Original Message-----
> Date: Thursday, May 12, 2011 10:38:31 am
> To: "Blind Talk Mailing List" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> From: "Gloria Whipple" <ladygloria at webband.com>
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
>
> Me neither!
>
>
> Gloria Whipple
> Corresponding Secretary
> Inland Empire chapter
> nfb of WA
>
> Cell: 509-475-4993
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of Graves, Diane
> Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2011 05:02
> To: 'Blind Talk Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
>
> That one blew me away too. I can't imagine running with a cane.
>
>
> Diane Graves
> Civil Rights Specialist
> Indiana Civil Rights Commission
> Alternative Dispute Resolutions Unit
> 317-232-2647
>
> "It is service that measures success."
> George Washington Carver
>
> Confidentiality Notice: This E-mail transmission may contain confidential
> and/or legally privileged information intended only for the individual or
> entity(ies)
> named in the E-mail address. If you are not the intended recipient, be
> advised that any unauthorized disclosure, copying, distribution, or acting
> in reliance
> upon the contents of this E-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have
> received this E-mail transmission in error, please reply to sender to
> arrange for the return and proper delivery of the transmission.
> Subsequently, delete the message from your system immediately.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of Kelby Carlson
> Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2011 5:47 PM
> To: Blind Talk Mailing List
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no trailing?
>
> I didn't realize people jogged with canes. Forgive me for asking
> what may be a silly question, but how is it done?
>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>>From: Darian Smith <dsmithnfb at gmail.com
>>To: Blind Talk Mailing List <blindtlk at nfbnet.org
>>Date sent: Wed, 11 May 2011 16:01:13 -0500 (CDT)
>>Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] cane travel question: trailing or no
> trailing?
>
>>I use a combination of two-point touch and constent
> contact. I
>>think that situationally, they both work fine. I would suggest
>>getting a handle on contact technique, then challange yourself
> with
>>touch. Shorelining, or trailing is good at times, when you are
>>looking for a pathway that is set along a grass line, but I
> don't use
>>it for looking for a door, unless the door it's self is blended
>>aginst the wall you are caning past.
>> also, while I do like white NFb canes, I also like the Iowa
> canes,
>>they are a little top-heavy, but I like the rolling-tip like
> feature
>>they have, and I think they work very good for jogging/running,
> if
>>you wish to go that route too.
>> hth
>> Darian
>
>
>>On 5/11/11, Kelby Carlson <kelbycarlson at usfamily.net> wrote:
>>> I'm going to have to agree on this one. I occasionally trail if
>>> I'm looking for a specific door, but even then it's not always
>>> necessary. Whether you use a folding or rigid cane, if your
>>> technique is correct you should have no trouble. (Trust me,
> it's
>>> taken me awhile to develop as much confidence as I as far as
>>> speed of travel goes. I know how you feel.)
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Message: 18
> Date: Thu, 12 May 2011 12:50:13 -0400
> From: "Jessica Kostiw" <jessicac.kostiw at gmail.com>
> To: "'Blind Talk Mailing List'" <blindtlk at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Blindness Misperceptions from kids
> Message-ID: <099C3BCDE6744B2A93E1A11135E88EDE at Jessica>
> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"
>
> Educating people, especially little kids many times can be very simple. A
> few weeks ago my boyfriend and I were running in a 5K in Richmond. We
> hold
> a very short rope between us while we run to make sure I know where to go,
> but so we don't trip over each other's feet. This guy was running next to
> us and pulling one of those little chariot's. This little boy inside, who
> couldn't have been more than 4 asked his father why those people had that
> rope. The father said he supposed it was just to pull each other along.
> I
> chimed in that actually I was blind. Just something quick, but I could
> see
> the little wheels in the little boys head turning... and the father too.
> In
> that one moment I was saying "I do what you do. Blind people are just
> regular folks." I don't know, it was cute and I had to share.
> Jessica
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of Graves, Diane
> Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2011 9:14 AM
> To: 'Blind Talk Mailing List'
> Subject: Re: [Blindtlk] Blindness Misperceptions from kids
>
> Hi Humberto,
>
> Well, I have had many similar experiences. When I was a child I was
> attending a picnic with my family one day in a park and several kids began
> throwing rocks at me until my father intervened. I recall an incident
> where
> another boy who attended our church asked my sister, "how can your sister
> be
> so smart, and she is blind?" I think this was definitely an inherited
> perception, something he had heard his parents say. I remember when I was
> in
> high school, a friend of mine was walking down the street in her
> neighborhood, and some kids put some logs in her way, presumably either
> hoping to entertain themselves by her fall, or wanting to see whether she
> would maneuver around the logs. Her mom saw what the kids had done, and
> neither of these possibilities occurred. So, all that to say that I
> understand what you have experienced.
>
> You certainly don't have to accept anyone else's intentional cruelty be
> they
> child or adult, and you aren't going to have time to talk with every kid
> you
> pass while walking down the street. But if you have a child who really
> wants
> to know, I would say you should seize the opportunity to teach them. If
> you
> meet up with a child who says "why do you have a stick in your hand," you
> might say: "This isn't a stick, this is my white cane and, because I can't
> see, it helps me find my way." If they want to know how you manage other
> tasks, you should explain to them that, even though you are blind, you
> have
> other senses that work just as well.
>
> In my case, since I had retinoblastoma, I usually tell the kids that I was
> very sick, and that is what caused my blindness, but I am not sick any
> more.
> You can't preach to them about positive attitudes, you have to bring
> things
> down to their level.
>
> Believe me, I get extremely impatient and irritated with the ignorance I
> meet with in the adult population every single day, and, though I am not
> proud to admit it, I'm not always very nice about it. By the time someone
> reaches adulthood, I sort of expect them to have some common sense, and,
> even if they don't know how we accomplish everything, there are enough of
> us
> around that they should know that we can be productive citizens. But the
> kids on the other hand, really don't know any better, and if we have the
> opportunity to set them straight and teach them when they are absorbing
> information like little sponges, we really shouldn't pass up the
> opportunity. If they are seeking to understand, we should jump on that.
>
> Diane Graves
> Civil Rights Specialist
> Indiana Civil Rights Commission
> Alternative Dispute Resolutions Unit
> 317-232-2647
>
> "It is service that measures success."
> George Washington Carver
>
> Confidentiality Notice: This E-mail transmission may contain confidential
> and/or legally privileged information intended only for the individual or
> entity(ies)
> named in the E-mail address. If you are not the intended recipient, be
> advised that any unauthorized disclosure, copying, distribution, or acting
> in reliance
> upon the contents of this E-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have
> received this E-mail transmission in error, please reply to sender to
> arrange for the return and proper delivery of the transmission.
> Subsequently, delete the message from your system immediately.
> -----Original Message-----
> From: blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blindtlk-bounces at nfbnet.org] On
> Behalf Of humberto
> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2011 11:11 PM
> To: blindTlk at nfbNet.org
> Subject: [Blindtlk] Blindness Misperceptions from kids
>
> Hi dear listers:
>
> Some time ago, somebody in here posted a really really
> interesting message with an interesting question that caused
> threads that hit the list with high fever and great discussions.
> Today I'm here to ask you another question and to share my
> opinions. My concerns deal with the statement written in the
> subject line, blindness misperceptions coming out of children.
> First of all, I have found an essay that was really interesting
> that someone posted on the National Students Division (Nabs)
> mailing list, that explains that adults have these outdated
> negative views about blindness, and kids have better views about
> it than adults, especially when they were raised or growing
> around blind people.
> This person explained that her nephews had a more positive
> attitude around her and that they thought she was cool and could
> do everything by herself. They even think that it's not such a
> big deal being blind.
> In my personal experience, this is not true. Often kids, when I'm
> walking by, think I am weird and ask me a whole bunch of
> questions that I don't know even how to respond to. Some kids
> think I can not walk, and some even say my disability (blindness)
> is an illness, which makes me upset and wanting to advocate them
> and their parents. One day when I was living in California, I
> went to a social gathering with my family and one of their
> friends had two kids. I was sitting down and I had my wonderful
> trusty white cane folded with me at the side, and one girl asked
> "Why is he carrying those four sticks, and why are there for?" Of
> course she asked her mom but we quickly told her what it was and
> what it was used for. At the time I didn't know anything about
> NFB philosophies and my blindness philosophy was not the one that
> it is now, so my Mom had to explain everything.
> But now, when I'm walking down the street or even doing something
> that other people would do regularly, kids still ask me "Why the
> heck you have a stick in your hand?" Some other kids will just
> stare at me like non-sense and run away. Some others will talk,
> but yes according to myself, they would talk to themselves
> because I don't know if they are talking to me until I tell them
> "Are you talking to me?" And yet, when I was little, one day one
> kid even tried to hit me with a small rock, because of no reason,
> or maybe just because of a sign of disrespect toward people with
> disabilities, and even more, blind people. (or that is what I
> think now.)
> The problem with kids, I suppose, from my personal experiences,
> is that their parents inherit those misperceptions of blindness
> into them and / or the kids get them from other people, or
> they've never been around blind people before or something. I can
> understand how they have never been around people who are blind
> before, but the parents issue is what gets me straight the most.
> Yet I don't even have the right time to advocate these kids in a
> diplomatic way patience being one of the factors. But the times I
> try to educate them about my blindness and being just a regular
> person, I don't know how to start engaging them, and they keep
> asking dumb questions.
> Any opinions on how to say to them about positive attitudes of
> blindness, or how to diplomatically explain them? Have you had
> any similar experiences? Any stories you want to share? Any more
> concerns or issues? Any help is appreciated please.
>
> Cheers, Humberto
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindtlk mailing list
> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blindtlk_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blindtlk:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blindtlk_nfbnet.org/dgraves%40icrc.in.
> gov
>
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> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
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> gmail.com
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> blindtlk mailing list
> blindtlk at nfbnet.org
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>
>
> End of blindtlk Digest, Vol 59, Issue 14
> ****************************************
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