[blparent] Noisy shoes
Amber Boggs
amberboggs at socal.rr.com
Mon Nov 17 06:14:47 UTC 2008
I am jumping in way late after a long computer crash. But I wanted to point
out a few things. The blind childrens center here in LA is teaching kids as
early as the child is walking to use a cane. They start with a thing that
looks sort of like a walker but it is not quite a walker. I have personally
seen little kids with the smallest cane ever. They have pamplits and they
are there to help parents with little children. I can give anyone who wants
it the number. Rick is on the board of derectors out there. I would have to
agree, it is a very bad idea to have a child hold on to you cane rather then
holding on by some other manner.
I have a few questions, Are you getting them proper ONM and have they seen a
licenced instructor who can help?
And Tammy, I had no idea Collen was blind. How did I miss that? Hmmm
I had a few other thaughts, and when I remember them I will post them.
AMber
----- Original Message -----
From: "Barbara Hammel" <poetlori8 at msn.com>
To: "NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Sunday, November 16, 2008 8:29 PM
Subject: Re: [blparent] Noisy shoes
>I guess we'll never know the ratios at those places, but if you were one
>person for, say 8 babies, I could see doing it--though it would break my
>heart.
>
> When I worked at a day-care, another staff member and I had 17
> one-year-olds all by ourselves. Ratio is one adult for four children. It
> was a zoo. I can't imagine having those kinds of ratios every day 24/7.
> Barbara
>
> --------------------------------------------------
> From: "Tammy, Paul and Colyn" <tcl189 at rogers.com>
> Sent: Saturday, November 15, 2008 9:28 PM
> To: "NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
> Subject: Re: [blparent] Noisy shoes
>
>> Hi,
>> I honestly am at a loss for what to say that might help you. It sounds
>> like you're doing the best you can with what you have, and it's hard
>> enough teaching things to willing learners. I don't know how anybody
>> could just put two kids in a crib or swing and leave them there.
>>
>> Tammy
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Barbara Hammel" <poetlori8 at msn.com>
>> To: "NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Saturday, November 15, 2008 3:59 PM
>> Subject: Re: [blparent] Noisy shoes
>>
>>
>>> To some extent you're right about being frustrated. However, with them
>>> frustration kicks in the minute you introduce them to something new.
>>> They don't want to try anything new. You see, for the first three years
>>> of their life no one asked a thing of them. They probably spent the
>>> whole time in a crib or a swing. I don't know what they do with gobs of
>>> children in an orphanage. The time they spent in a foster home I don't
>>> know what was expected of them either. I know when they went back to
>>> the orphanage when we said we'd take them, the foster parents were at
>>> their wits' end as to what to do with them.
>>>
>>> They fight us tooth and nail--literally--to stay in that happy place
>>> they knew, one more so than the other.
>>> Barbara
>>>
>>> --------------------------------------------------
>>> From: "Tammy, Paul and Colyn" <tcl189 at rogers.com>
>>> Sent: Saturday, November 15, 2008 1:51 PM
>>> To: "NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
>>> Subject: Re: [blparent] Noisy shoes
>>>
>>>> Hi,
>>>> No, I'm not saying that at all. But if it's frustrating them to the
>>>> point they throw the cane then they're not learning anything from the
>>>> experience. Maybe they're showing you in their own way that they're not
>>>> ready for using a cane. If they're developmentally challenged, it
>>>> would be sensible to keep showing them the cane, but not pressuring
>>>> them to use it. Wait a bit until they ask about it or seem a little
>>>> interested in it and then maybe things will go better. They're six
>>>> years old and not interested in the cane at all right now. What's
>>>> wrong with them holding on to someone's hand if they feel comfortable
>>>> doing that. Why force a cane in to their hands when they don't know
>>>> how to be safe with it right now? They'll just rebell against it
>>>> later, and then you're back at square one again. My son loves using
>>>> his cane, but he's 3 and he sees us using ours all the time so that
>>>> helps. He's recently started using it at school to go from one room to
>>>> the other, and I'm told he uses it well. But if he didn't want to use
>>>> it, I wouldn't make him, and even in 3 years when he's six I wouldn't
>>>> pressure him to use it. He'd get tired of falling down stairs and
>>>> bumping in to things eventually. This isn't an issue of stopping
>>>> showing them how to use the cane, it's an issue of effective and safe
>>>> travel, and letting someone, anyone hold on to your cane for teaching
>>>> purposes is unsafe and dangerous for all concerned imo.
>>>>
>>>> Tammy
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Veronica Smith" <madison_tewe at spinn.net>
>>>> To: "NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Saturday, November 15, 2008 2:10 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: [blparent] Noisy shoes
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> So tammy, are you saying if someone can't understand something from no
>>>>> fault of their own, we shouldn't try to teach them anything. this is
>>>>> like keeping them locked up because they are not the same as you or
>>>>> me. These kids are developmentally challenged and I believe they
>>>>> should continue trying, not give up on them in any way, shape or form.
>>>>> I beliee that each and everyday their mother should show them the cane
>>>>> and practice with it. this is how some people learn. V
>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>> From: "Tammy, Paul and Colyn" <tcl189 at rogers.com>
>>>>> To: "NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
>>>>> Sent: Friday, November 14, 2008 10:19 PM
>>>>> Subject: Re: [blparent] Noisy shoes
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>> No, you're right, not everyone's a pro at first tap, but when a
>>>>>> person is
>>>>>> trying to learn how to use a cane properly they at least have the
>>>>>> ability to
>>>>>> know what the purpose of the cane is so they can at least try to use
>>>>>> it
>>>>>> effectively. What's the point of trying to teach him something he
>>>>>> doesn't
>>>>>> seem to understand? It will just frustrate him and his mother, and
>>>>>> cause
>>>>>> him to not want to use the cane at all, and that's far from what
>>>>>> anybody
>>>>>> involved wants.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Tammy
>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>> From: "Veronica Smith" <madison_tewe at spinn.net>
>>>>>> To: "NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2008 2:17 PM
>>>>>> Subject: Re: [blparent] Noisy shoes
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> We all have to start somewhere. Not everyone is a pro at first tap.
>>>>>>> Smile. When I went to the orientation center for the blind when I
>>>>>>> was 29,
>>>>>>> it was hard learning to trust it. I always felt better holding on
>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>> someone. All the instructors would show us how to hold it, where
>>>>>>> our
>>>>>>> hands should be and then they would turn us out to the wild. Some
>>>>>>> people
>>>>>>> were so frightened they dropped out and left the center. Imagine
>>>>>>> how
>>>>>>> scarry it is for a child to all of a sudden not be able to hold on
>>>>>>> to mom
>>>>>>> anymore and not be able to see. If indeed, Barbara is just teaching
>>>>>>> by
>>>>>>> letting him hold the cane it is okay, but just for walking and
>>>>>>> getting
>>>>>>> around it is not a good idea for either of them. V
>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>> From: "Tammy, Paul and Colyn" <tcl189 at rogers.com>
>>>>>>> To: "NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2008 11:10 AM
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [blparent] Noisy shoes
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Hi,
>>>>>>>> If he doesn't know or has no concept of how and why to use a cane
>>>>>>>> then he
>>>>>>>> shouldn't be using one. As for holding on to your cane, there has
>>>>>>>> to be
>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>> better more safe way to travel with your children. Not only are
>>>>>>>> you
>>>>>>>> putting
>>>>>>>> yourself in danger when you let your child hold on to your cane,
>>>>>>>> but
>>>>>>>> your
>>>>>>>> children are also in danger if you don't use safe methods of
>>>>>>>> traveling.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Tammy
>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>> From: "Barbara Hammel" <poetlori8 at msn.com>
>>>>>>>> To: "NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2008 10:21 AM
>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [blparent] Noisy shoes
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> And that is a problem we do have. He refuses to use it correctly
>>>>>>>>> so
>>>>>>>>> it's
>>>>>>>>> a good thing I know our block and other places where I have him do
>>>>>>>>> that.
>>>>>>>>> Once in a while I do run into things or trip, but he has to learn
>>>>>>>>> somehow.
>>>>>>>>> Got any ideas how to get him to hold his own cane. We've tried
>>>>>>>>> fastening
>>>>>>>>> it in his hand but he hates that. The teaching cane is the best
>>>>>>>>> method
>>>>>>>>> I've found so far. I'm not bragging when I say I'm a very good
>>>>>>>>> traveler
>>>>>>>>> who is very aware of my surroundings because I'm not brave at all
>>>>>>>>> when
>>>>>>>>> it
>>>>>>>>> comes to new situations.
>>>>>>>>> Barbara
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>> From: "Dena Wainwright" <autumnrose21 at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>> Sent: Thursday, November 13, 2008 8:12 AM
>>>>>>>>> To: "NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [blparent] Noisy shoes
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> having a child hold onto your cane doesn't seem especially
>>>>>>>>>> effective or
>>>>>>>>>> safe to me... how can you get accurate info with someone holding
>>>>>>>>>> it?
>>>>>>>>>> also, what if he lets go?
>>>>>>>>>> Dena
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>>>> From: "Veronica Smith" <madison_tewe at spinn.net>
>>>>>>>>>> To: "NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, November 12, 2008 11:30 PM
>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [blparent] Noisy shoes
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Personally, instead of holding your cane, you should have your
>>>>>>>>>>> child
>>>>>>>>>>> hold onto your pants or belt loop. V
>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Barbara Hammel" <poetlori8 at msn.com>
>>>>>>>>>>> To: "NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, November 12, 2008 5:55 PM
>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [blparent] Noisy shoes
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> The leashes we have are just harnesses with the leash attached.
>>>>>>>>>>>> They
>>>>>>>>>>>> fasten
>>>>>>>>>>>> with velcro in the back. They're kind of tricky to figure out
>>>>>>>>>>>> though.
>>>>>>>>>>>> You
>>>>>>>>>>>> have to get the child's arms through in the right place. We
>>>>>>>>>>>> don't
>>>>>>>>>>>> use
>>>>>>>>>>>> them
>>>>>>>>>>>> often but if I take the twins alone I take one on a leash and
>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>> other
>>>>>>>>>>>> holds onto my cane. I've even tied the one's cane to his leash
>>>>>>>>>>>> so we
>>>>>>>>>>>> don't
>>>>>>>>>>>> have to spend forever looking for it if he drops it or throws
>>>>>>>>>>>> it.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Now
>>>>>>>>>>>> looking for cane tips? That's a different story. So far I've
>>>>>>>>>>>> found
>>>>>>>>>>>> them
>>>>>>>>>>>> when the pop off.
>>>>>>>>>>>> Barbara
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Veronica Smith" <madison_tewe at spinn.net>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, November 12, 2008 12:05 PM
>>>>>>>>>>>> To: "NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [blparent] Noisy shoes
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> I only had the opportunity to use it once and it was a real
>>>>>>>>>>>>> leash
>>>>>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>>>>> belonged to our husky. Gab thought it great fun to wear
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Shelby's
>>>>>>>>>>>>> leash as
>>>>>>>>>>>>> we made our way through a very busy airport in Las Angelas. I
>>>>>>>>>>>>> don't
>>>>>>>>>>>>> care
>>>>>>>>>>>>> what others think as long as my child is safe. V
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: "Pickrell, Rebecca M." <Rebecca.Pickrell at ngc.com>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: "NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, November 12, 2008 6:06 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [blparent] Noisy shoes
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I've gotten comments on the leash I use for my daughter, and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they've
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> all
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> been positive.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Really though, I don't much care, because as parents, it is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> our job
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> keep our kids safe, while still providing them and ourselves
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> oppertunities to get out and about.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Your husband doesn't have to like the leash, but he does need
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> keep
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> his child safe. Liking the leash is not a requirement for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> *using* a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> leash.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> From: blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> [mailto:blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Behalf Of Melissa Ann Riccobono
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sent: Wednesday, November 12, 2008 7:30 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To: 'NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List'
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Subject: [blparent] Noisy shoes
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hi Shannon,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I wasn't thrilled about the squeaking shoes either, so I put
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bells
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> son's shoes. They are noisy, but at least it's a pleasant
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> noise to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> listen to. As for leashes, at least in the US, they sell
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> really
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> cute
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ones that are a small backpack that looks like an animal (we
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> monkey) and the tail of the animal is the leash. Austin
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> still
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> loves
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> his
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (not all kids do, of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> course) and has even named it. Maybe I get stares when I'm
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> out in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> public, but at least I know Austin is safe. And, I've
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> received a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ton
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> comments about how cute the leash is, and even what a good
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> idea it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Good luck!
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Melissa
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> No virus found in this outgoing message.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Checked by AVG.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Version: 7.5.549 / Virus Database: 270.9.1/1781 - Release
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Date:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 11/11/2008
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 8:59 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> blparent mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> blparent at nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> info
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> for
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>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/rebecca.pickre
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ll%40ngc.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> blparent mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> blparent at nfbnet.org
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>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>>>>>>> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.9.2/1783 - Release
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Date:
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 11/12/2008
>>>>>>>>>>>>> 10:01 AM
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>>>> blparent mailing list
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>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
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>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>>>>>>>>>>> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
>>>>>>>>>>> Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.9.2/1783 - Release Date:
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>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>>> blparent mailing list
>>>>>>>>>>> blparent at nfbnet.org
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>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>>> blparent mailing list
>>>>>>>>>> blparent at nfbnet.org
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>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>>> blparent mailing list
>>>>>>>>> blparent at nfbnet.org
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>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>>>>> blparent mailing list
>>>>>>>> blparent at nfbnet.org
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
>>>>>>> Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.9.2/1783 - Release Date:
>>>>>>> 11/12/2008
>>>>>>> 10:01 AM
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>>
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>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>>>>> Checked by AVG - http://www.avg.com
>>>>> Version: 8.0.175 / Virus Database: 270.9.2/1783 - Release Date:
>>>>> 11/12/2008 10:01 AM
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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