[blparent] [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] Re: Blind Parents Meeting
Deborah Kent Stein
dkent5817 at worldnet.att.net
Sat Jun 6 01:28:49 UTC 2009
Thank you, Steve, for your very articulate response. There may be a fine
line between preparedness and paranoia, but most of the blind parents I've
talked to over the years are aware that a CPS complaint is always a
possibility, even if it never happens. Unfortunately, as we all know, the
public is not well-informed about the capabilities of blind people, and the
thought of blind people caring for children throws some folks into high
anxiety. I believe discussions like this are valuable to help us think
about how to handle such situations if they arise, and to provide
much-needed emotional support to one another around this very painful topic.
Debbie
----- Original Message -----
From: "Steve Jacobson" <steve.jacobson at visi.com>
To: "NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 3:07 PM
Subject: Re: [blparent] [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] Re: Blind Parents Meeting
> My comments here are meant to address the general problem raised and not
> necessarily the specific one that started this thread. While I understand
> the concern of
> throwing around a statistic like 50% of blind parents have such problems
> without some sort of proof, I would personally oppose
> spending money on us doing a study because I don't believe it would gain
> us anything. We know there have been cases of a consistent nature over
> the years
> because we
> have helped pay for them and usually won them. I frankly had never heard
> the claim of 50% of parents experience issues with child protection and I
> believe it is
> high, but any blind parent who thinks it can't happen to them has their
> head in the sand. In dealing with any sort of a visit from a social
> service agency, we need to
> be very careful about the assumptions we make. If we have ourselves all
> wound up and react accordingly, we are going to make our cases worse and
> appear to
> have something to be investigated. One has to be careful not to appear
> paranoid. On the other hand, assuming that the social service person is
> well-educated and
> therefore assumes that a blind person can parent is equally wrong. It
> doesn't mean that their motives are bad, just that their background and
> education does little to
> change whatever preconceived notions they may have about blindness. Those
> of us who have gone through adoption often find that we must take the
> social
> workers involved from a point of thinking that we are unrealistic to even
> apply, to a point of accepting that we can be good parents. We also have
> to realize that
> some of us are
> not going to be good parents just as some sighted persons are not.
>
> We must also be careful to separate apples from oranges. Some of us would
> feel that child
> protection's role is government interference inside the family and we'd
> feel that way if we were sighted. Others of us are advocates of narrow
> family views
> endangering children. If a blind parent refuses to have a child's medical
> condition treated on religious grounds, issues will be raised that have
> nothing to do with
> being a blind parent and our positions will depend very much upon or
> political and religious views.
>
> It is important also to realize that what we're talking about here affects
> multiple areas. Child protection is one obvious point of contact, but the
> lack of exposure to
> blind people as parents can play a role in adoption and in awarding
> custody in the case of a divorce. A divorce involving a blind and a
> sighted spouse can be very
> tricky where custody is concerned if the sighted spouse decides to play
> all the angles to get full custody.
>
> Our best approach is to learn from one another and be prepared as well as
> we can if problems should arise but be glad if they never do. The
> percentage of times it
> happens, whether one spouse is sighted, if the situation has improved or
> become worse, none of this really matters. It does still happen, and
> dealing with the issue
> carefully and fairly is something htat we have to be prepared to handle.
>
> On Wed, 3 Jun 2009 08:10:44 -0400, Pickrell, Rebecca M (IS) wrote:
>
>>So why doesn't NFB do a study quantifying this and then use that for
>>educational purposes on both sides of the fence, both to educate blind
>>parents as well as social workers?
>>
>
>>-----Original Message-----
>>From: blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>On Behalf Of Tammy, Paul and Colyn
>>Sent: Wednesday, June 03, 2009 1:22 AM
>>To: NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List
>>Subject: Re: [blparent] [Bulk] Re: [Bulk] Re: Blind Parents Meeting
>
>>Hi,
>
>>I don't have anything to hide either so usually if they don't come in to
>>my life and my home like raging bulls and scare my kids half to death, I
>>have no issues answering whatever questions they might ask. But I don't
>>understand and never have understood why the parenting standard for me
>>and for lots of other blind couples seems to be higher then for my
>>sighted neighbour who I know for a fact swears, spanks, and screams at
>>her kids both publicly and privately and cps never gets a call. That's
>>what I'm talking about here, and as much as I would love to see proof of
>>this data, I never will. I am the proof, as is Joe Elizabeth, and many
>>others on this list who've had visits from these so-called well-meaning
>>people. These organizations will never come out and say oh it's because
>>you're blind, that would be discrimination. But they'll justify their
>>involvement by saying it's because of fill in the blank, and that will
>>be okay with their managers, bosses, etc. But we all know why cps, dcf,
>>or whatever acronym the organization goes by in your state, province, or
>>area use. Most of these calls are made by hospitals, pools, neighbours
>>and strangers who just happen to see something on the street not knowing
>>the full story, and they're made because the parent just happens to have
>>little to no eye-sight, or may do something a little differently, or
>>their child might fall down etc.
>
>>hth
>
>>Tammy
>>----- Original Message -----
>>From: <kate02 at bellsouth.net>
>>To: "NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
>>Sent: Tuesday, June 02, 2009 10:13 PM
>>Subject: [Bulk] Re: [blparent] [Bulk] Re: Blind Parents Meeting
>
>
>>>
>>> I think we should keep in mind that being blind parents places us in
>>the
>>> minority. I have found over the years that it is popular for minority
>
>>> populations to justify removal of children on solely the issue or
>>choices
>>> that create their situation. It just seams to be a common theme in
>>> Minority and fringe populations. My kid was removed because fill in
>>the
>>> blank and let the panic begin.
>>>
>>> Are there times that blind parents are questioned by CPS?, yes and I
>>would
>>> imagine if you reacted badly things could go that way.
>>>
>>> But the constant being told that because your blind you may lose your
>>kids
>>> does nothing but scare people and helps no one. How can a new Mother,
>
>>> father, or couple who is blind handle themselves if DCF is involved if
>
>>> they have been siked up.
>>>
>>> Kids get hurt. Kids put their clothes on backwards. Kids forget
>>homework.
>>> That's just how it is.
>>>
>>> Its one thing to be informed of your rights but having yourself in
>>this
>>> panic that its you against DCF is just going to the extreme. I expect
>
>>> questions and have no reason not to answer I have nothing to hide so
>>why
>>> should I panic? Fifty percent of blind parents being seen by DCF and
>>> being threatened with the removal of their children just sounds high.
>>>
>>> Personally I'd like to see proof not stats, any one can write stats.
>>>
>>> Kate
>>>
>>> -------------- Original message ----------------------
>>> From: "Tammy, Paul and Colyn" <tcl189 at rogers.com>
>>>>
>>>> Hi,
>>>>
>>>> But the you might be next mind set is the one you need to take with
>>>> organizations like cps, because you very well could be and for no
>>other
>>>> reason the fact that you're blind. The fact is that every disabled
>>>> person
>>>> should be aware that this could happen to them. Cps could be called
>>on
>>>> them
>>>> by a neighbour well-meaning or not, a friend, or even a family
>>member,
>>>> and
>>>> they do have the power to make your life miserable for a very long
>>time,
>>>> and
>>>> even to tear your family apart without even a second thought after
>>your
>>>> kids
>>>> are in foster care and you're sitting in your empty home saying you
>>>> wished
>>>> you'd listened to all the fear mongering and advice from lists like
>>this
>>>> one.
>>>>
>>>> Tammy
>>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> From: "Pickrell, Rebecca M (IS)" <REBECCA.PICKRELL at ngc.com>
>>>> To: "NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, June 02, 2009 11:52 AM
>>>> Subject: [Bulk] Re: [blparent] Blind Parents Meeting
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> > My daughter is learning to put her clothes on and has put them on
>>>> > inside
>>>> > out, backwards, you n ame it. She's so proud of herself, I won't
>>>> > correct
>>>> > her, that joy and confidence she displays is precious.
>>>> > The times people have commented, I just explain that she did it
>>>> > herself,
>>>> > and I say it proudly. It hasn't been an issue.
>>>> > Also, if you are going to present raw data, how is it not fear
>>>> > mongering
>>>> > when you offer no supporting data. It's like saying "100 people
>>will be
>>>> > killed in a car wreck today, you might be one of them" without
>>saying
>>>> > "to lessen the odds, wear a seatbelt and don't ride with someone
>>who
>>>> > has
>>>> > been drinking".
>>>> > Knowing what actions and attitudes we can take is far more
>>bennificial
>>>> > then just tossing out numbers with the "and you might be next"
>>mindset.
>>>> >
>>>> >
>>>> > -----Original Message-----
>>>> > From: blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>[mailto:blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>> > On Behalf Of Barbara Hammel
>>>> > Sent: Tuesday, June 02, 2009 11:34 AM
>>>> > To: NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List
>>>> > Subject: Re: [blparent] Blind Parents Meeting
>>>> >
>>>> > It's not fear-mongering. It's just pointing out a fact. Sighted
>>>> > people
>>>> > sometimes have such an overwhelming sense of fear of being blind
>>that
>>>> > they butt into people's business because they don't think they
>>could
>>>> > handle a child if they were blind.
>>>> > Those people are there. They always want to help you. After
>>putting
>>>> > your child's shoes on the right feet for 9/10 of the school year
>>and
>>>> > then you put them on wrong by accident, instead of just changing
>>them,
>>>> > they have to point out to you that you made a mistake. I know, we
>>all
>>>> > do that to some extent.
>>>> > Barbara
>>>> >
>>>> > If wisdom's ways you wisely seek, five things observe with care:
>>of
>>>> > whom you speak, to whom you speak, and how and when and where.
>>>> >
>>>> > --------------------------------------------------
>>>> > From: "Pickrell, Rebecca M (IS)" <REBECCA.PICKRELL at ngc.com>
>>>> > Sent: Tuesday, June 02, 2009 7:46 AM
>>>> > To: "NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
>>>> > Subject: Re: [blparent] Blind Parents Meeting
>>>> >
>>>> >> I don't think any of us are excluded per sea, but putting out
>>these
>>>> >> stats with no other data is nothing more then fear mongering in my
>>>> >> oppinion. What value is to be gained in that?
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> -----Original Message-----
>>>> >> From: blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>[mailto:blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>> >> On Behalf Of Kliph
>>>> >> Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 6:27 PM
>>>> >> To: 'NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List'
>>>> >> Subject: Re: [blparent] Blind Parents Meeting
>>>> >>
>>>> >> That would be me also. I am blind, but my wife can see. So does
>>that
>>>> >
>>>> >> exclude us?
>>>> >>
>>>> >> -----Original Message-----
>>>> >> From: blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>[mailto:blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>> >> On Behalf Of Scott Lawlor
>>>> >> Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 3:43 PM
>>>> >> To: NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List
>>>> >> Subject: Re: [blparent] Blind Parents Meeting
>>>> >>
>>>> >> I'd also be interested in this information and does any of the
>>data
>>>> >> apply to
>>>> >>
>>>> >> a situation where only one of the parents is blind?
>>>> >> ----- Original Message -----
>>>> >> From: "Pickrell, Rebecca M (IS)" <REBECCA.PICKRELL at ngc.com>
>>>> >> To: "NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
>>>> >> Sent: Monday, June 01, 2009 3:03 PM
>>>> >> Subject: Re: [blparent] Blind Parents Meeting
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>> Interesting.
>>>> >>> I'd be interested to k now more about this statistic.
>>>> >>> One half of all blind parents.
>>>> >>> Where is this number coming from?
>>>> >>> What are the nature of these contacts? Do these cases involve the
>>>> >> blind
>>>> >>> parent who is at home with his/her kids or ones who work outside
>>the
>>>> >>> home?
>>>> >>> What impact does a blind couple raising a child v. a
>>sighted-blind
>>>> >>> couple have on these contacts with social services?
>>>> >>> What sparks these contacts?Does doing something "unconventional"
>>such
>>>> >> as
>>>> >>> having a child born at home or choosing not to vaccinate play a
>>>> >>> factor in if CPS comes calling?
>>>> >>> Has anybody done a quantifiable breakdown of blind parents and
>>their
>>>> >>> contact with CPS?
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> I ask because I've heard this statistic before but would be
>>>> >>> interested to know more about the data driving it.
>>>> >>> Anybody?
>>>> >>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> >>> From: blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>> >>> [mailto:blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>> >>> On Behalf Of Barbara Hammel
>>>> >>> Sent: Sunday, May 31, 2009 5:14 PM
>>>> >>> To: NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List
>>>> >>> Subject: Re: [blparent] Blind Parents Meeting
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> I'm so glad that, according to our current schedule, I'll be able
>>to
>>>> >>> attend.
>>>> >>> It's funny, in 2006 I attended the meeting and you talked about
>>how
>>>> >>> something like one half of all blind parents will have Child
>>>> >> Protective
>>>> >>> Services call on them. In some respects, I was so glad--yet very
>>>> >>> appalled--to hear that fact. A friend of mine insisted I go to
>>that
>>>> >>> meeting, not knowing that was the subject. I had just marked the
>>>> >> first
>>>> >>> anniversary of having the twins and had just had CPS at my door
>>on
>>>> >> that
>>>> >>> last day of school. Back then, Paul would never cry when he was
>>hurt
>>>> >
>>>> >>> and he'd fallen on a toy and got a big bruise and I didn't know
>>it.
>>>> >>> I am the bather and changer in our house and at that time my
>>>> >>> husband's
>>>> >> job
>>>> >>> took him away quite a bit. Luckily he was home that day.
>>>> >>> So anyone who's going, I hope to meet you this year.
>>>> >>> Barbara
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> If wisdom's ways you wisely seek, five things observe with care:
>>of
>>>> >>> whom you speak, to whom you speak, and how and when and where.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> --------------------------------------------------
>>>> >>> From: "Veronica Smith" <madison_tewe at spinn.net>
>>>> >>> Sent: Saturday, May 30, 2009 9:38 PM
>>>> >>> To: "'NFBnet Blind Parents Mailing List'" <blparent at nfbnet.org>
>>>> >>> Subject: Re: [blparent] Blind Parents Meeting
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>> It is so funny, I was just remembering meeting you the year the
>>>> >>>> convention was in Kentucky. Was that 2002 or 2003? Gab was
>>very
>>>> >>>> young and I left her with my hubby for the first time. I felt
>>lost
>>>> >>>> without her. Well anyway I went to your meeting and felt
>>completely
>>>> >
>>>> >>>> like a dodo. I asked questions such as how will she know what
>>color
>>>> >> a
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>> crayon is or how will she color with me or how will I teach her
>>the
>>>> >>>> alphabet. How will I read to her. They all seemed trivial but
>>you
>>>> >>>> were so kind and made me feel right at home.
>>>> >>>> Thanks for everything. I wish I was going this year, maybe next
>>>> >> time.
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>> V
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> >>>> From: blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org
>>>> >> [mailto:blparent-bounces at nfbnet.org]
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>>> On Behalf Of Deborah Kent Stein
>>>> >>>> Sent: Friday, May 29, 2009 10:01 AM
>>>> >>>> To: Multiple recipients of NFBnet blparent Mailing List
>>>> >>>> Subject: [blparent] Blind Parents Meeting
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> Hi, all,
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> This year the Blind Parents Group will meet at convention on
>>July 4
>>>> >>>> from 7:30 to 10 P.M. Traditionally this is an informal meeting
>>>> >>>> where everyone is
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> free to share experiences and ideas. I would love to hear your
>>>> >>>> thoughts about possible topics for discussion, so please feel
>>free
>>>> >>>> to contact me
>>>> >>>> on-
>>>> >>>> or off-list. I look forward to meeting many of you at this
>>year's
>>>> >>>> meeting!
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> Debbie Stein
>>>> >>>> dkent5817 at worldnet.att.net
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> >>>> blparent mailing list
>>>> >>>> blparent at nfbnet.org
>>>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
>>>> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>info
>>>> >>>> for
>>>> >>>> blparent:
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/madison_tewe
>>>> >>>> %40spi
>>>> >>>> nn.net
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> No virus found in this incoming message.
>>>> >>>> Checked by AVG - www.avg.com
>>>> >>>> Version: 8.5.339 / Virus Database: 270.12.46/2142 - Release
>>Date:
>>>> >>>> 05/29/09 17:53:00
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> >>>> blparent mailing list
>>>> >>>> blparent at nfbnet.org
>>>> >>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
>>>> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account
>>info
>>>> >>>> for
>>>> >>>> blparent:
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/poetlori8%40
>>>> >>>> msn.com
>>>> >>>>
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> _______________________________________________
>>>> >>> blparent mailing list
>>>> >>> blparent at nfbnet.org
>>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
>>>> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>for
>>>> >>> blparent:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/rebecca.pick
>>>> >> re
>>>> >>> ll%40ngc.com
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>> _______________________________________________
>>>> >>> blparent mailing list
>>>> >>> blparent at nfbnet.org
>>>> >>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
>>>> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>for
>>>> >>> blparent:
>>>> >>>
>>>> >>
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/sklawlor%40m
>>>> >> ac
>>>> >> .com
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> blparent mailing list
>>>> >> blparent at nfbnet.org
>>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
>>>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>for
>>>> >> blparent:
>>>> >>
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/phantom3919%
>>>> >> 40
>>>> >> yaho
>>>> >> o.com
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >>
>>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> blparent mailing list
>>>> >> blparent at nfbnet.org
>>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
>>>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>for
>>>> >> blparent:
>>>> >>
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/rebecca.pick
>>>> >> re
>>>> >> ll%40ngc.com
>>>> >>
>>>> >> _______________________________________________
>>>> >> blparent mailing list
>>>> >> blparent at nfbnet.org
>>>> >> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
>>>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>for
>>>> >> blparent:
>>>> >>
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/poetlori8%40
>>>> >> msn.com
>>>> >>
>>>> >
>>>> > _______________________________________________
>>>> > blparent mailing list
>>>> > blparent at nfbnet.org
>>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
>>>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>for
>>>> > blparent:
>>>> >
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/rebecca.pickre
>>>> > ll%40ngc.com
>>>> >
>>>> > _______________________________________________
>>>> > blparent mailing list
>>>> > blparent at nfbnet.org
>>>> > http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
>>>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>>for
>>>> > blparent:
>>>> >
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/tcl189%40roger
>>s.com
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> blparent mailing list
>>>> blparent at nfbnet.org
>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>
>>>> blparent:
>>>>
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/kate02%40bells
>>outh.net
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> blparent mailing list
>>> blparent at nfbnet.org
>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>> blparent:
>>>
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/tcl189%40roger
>>s.com
>>>
>
>
>>_______________________________________________
>>blparent mailing list
>>blparent at nfbnet.org
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>blparent:
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/rebecca.pickre
>>ll%40ngc.com
>
>>_______________________________________________
>>blparent mailing list
>>blparent at nfbnet.org
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>>blparent:
>>http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/steve.jacobson%40visi.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> blparent mailing list
> blparent at nfbnet.org
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/blparent_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> blparent:
> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/options/blparent_nfbnet.org/dkent5817%40worldnet.att.net
More information about the BlParent
mailing list