[Faith-talk] more truth

Mon Jun 6 02:34:18 UTC 2011

The only thing we have tp proselytize is that God loved us enough to send 
His son to live as man and die for the sins of all.  God is a loving God and 
wishes that none should perish but He is also a just God.  Sin is not 
allowed in Heaven.  You must repent of your sins and ask Christ into your 
heart and allow Him to be Lord and Savior of your life.
It doesn't matter whether God is God, Jesus and holy spirit in one or if the 
Godhead is the Trinity.  It doesn't matter any other of the silly things 
that we debate when saying our belief is the only truth.
It's also letting folks know that their own works cannot save them but by 
grace we have been saved.
Barbara

Let every nation know whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall pay 
any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend, oppose 
any foe, in order to assure the survival and the success of liberty.--John 
F. Kennedy
-----Original Message----- 
From: Joshua Lester
Sent: Sunday, June 05, 2011 1:31 AM
To: Faith-talk,for the discussion of faith and religion
Subject: Re: [Faith-talk] more truth

Kirt, with all due respect, we as Christians must procilite.
The Bible says, that if we don't share the Gospel with people, and
they die, and go to Hell, their blood is on our hands.
We have to share this with them.
I'm trying to show you what was taught, by the original apostles, in 33 AD.
We need to go back to what the early church taught.
You'll never have what the apostles, had, if you don't do, teach, and
practice, what the apostles did.
Some people, we can never win, but that shouldn't keep us from trying.
I love everyone here, but I can't stand it, when people of other
faiths talk down to our faith.
I even had one person say that my doctrine, (which is actually as old
as God himself,) is heresy.
Blessings, Joshua

On 6/5/11, Kirt Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com> wrote:
> Nicki,
>   I totally respect where you're coming from here.  We've all seen how
> contention and arguing can divide us.  But I think we really need to
> talk, and I think John just gave us a fine example of how it should be
> done.  Here's how I see it.  If we don't honestly get to know each
> other, how can we really get along?  If we don't seek to understand
> our differences, as well as our more numerous similarities, how can we
> really love each other?  It's honestly been my experience that, the
> more you openly share your feelings and faith, especially with people
> who don't totally agree, the more respect you gain for those around
> you.  It's perfectly ok to talk about disagreements-I think it's fair
> to say most problems in the world come from people deciding *not* to
> talk.  I honestly think the more we have a sincere and open dialogue
> (not an argument), the more people on all sides are built up and I'll
> even say sanctified.  It's a beautiful thing, I've seen it and been a
> part of it!  When people are willing to listen more than talk, and
> willing to stop trying to prove they're right and start working
> together with people from all faith traditions to make the world a
> brighter place for their children...it's honestly the most inspiring
> thing I've ever seen.  So I say, to all who want to come together and
> learn and grow...keep talking!  Keep listening!  We may disagree, but
> we honestly can make our dialogue a powerful force for good when we
> stop procelyting, start listening, and open our minds and hearts to
> each other.  Is Joshua's oneness belief respectable?  Absolutely!  Is
> the Trinitarian belief shared by most Christians respectable?  Most
> definitely!  Is the Mormon belief in three distinct persons who make
> up the godhead respectable?  You bet!  And, just because we disagree
> on points of doctrine, which we need to explore and analyze with love
> and respect in order to really understand each other, that doesn't
> mean we can't join hands and work for a better future for all of us
> and all of our children.  If we don't, if we refuse to talk, our
> future is bleak indeed!
>   Sorry.  I didn't mean to ramble.  I obviously feel strongly about
> this, and I also totally understand why argument is, quite frankly, of
> the devil.  In closing, I'd like to share a song by one of my favorite
> artists (who happens to be a Muslim), that says what I just tried to
> say better than I can say it.
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8OvbWGgdiEU
>   Your friend,
> Kirt
>
> On 6/4/11, Nikki <daizies304 at comcast.net> wrote:
>>     John,
>> By saying all that, you are asking for an argument to start.
>> That's just what I see happening.
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: John J. Boyer
>> Sent: Saturday, June 04, 2011 11:33 PM
>> To: Faith-talk,for the discussion of faith and religion
>> Subject: Re: [Faith-talk] more truth
>>
>> Kirt,
>>
>> That is the spirit of interreligious dialog.
>>
>> Now, to state my own beliefs. The correct interpretation of the Bible
>> and of the teachings of the early Church that didn't make it into the
>> New Testament is likely to be the interpretation of the Church Fathers.
>> They were much closer to the culture of the Bible than we are, and they
>> had resources that we don't.
>>
>> I believe that the Catholic Church is the one Christian group that has
>> adhered most closely to the teaching of the Church Fathers. There has
>> never been a Great Apostasy in which the whole Church abandoned the
>> teachings. Therefore there cannot be a Restoration. Likewise, there was
>> never a Reformation. However, the Church did learn from the latter to
>> clean up its own house.
>>
>> This is not intended as a polemic. It is a rather novice attempt at
>> interreligious dialog.
>>
>> Peace, Love, Service,
>> John
>>
>> On Sat, Jun 04, 2011 at 09:15:32PM -0600, Kirt Manwaring wrote:
>>> John,
>>>   Here, here!  But that doesn't mean we don't talk and learn from each
>>> other and have a constructive discussion.  I think it's ok to have a
>>> civilized debate so long as it doesn't turn into an argument...am I
>>> making any sense?  It's like saying "I respect you enough to tell you
>>> I disagree with you on this issue, but look at all this common ground
>>> we share!"  In other words, disagree agreeably.
>>>   Blessings,
>>> Kirt
>>>
>>> On 6/4/11, John J. Boyer <john at godtouches.org> wrote:
>>> > Argument is out of place in discussion of religion. The objective
>>> > should
>>> > be to build tolerance, trust and understanding. There is a saying
>>> > "Argue
>>> > with no true believer." That is amply illistrated by some of the
>>> > messages in this thread.
>>> >
>>> > Peace, Love, Service,
>>> > John
>>> >
>>> > On Sat, Jun 04, 2011 at 08:51:47PM -0500, Barbara Hammel wrote:
>>> >> Once upon a time this started out as a nice discussion comparing
>>> >> different
>>> >> beliefs and asking others about why they believed what they did.
>>> >> Now, it seems to me, this conversation is turning into an argument
>>> >> that
>>> >> someone must win about whose beliefs are correct.
>>> >> Let???s please just take this back to a question/answer thing instead
>>> >> of
>>> >> trying to convert.  Whether you believe in the Trinity or that the
>>> >> three
>>> >> are one is a silly point to argue over as long as we all know that 
>>> >> one
>>> >> must accept Christ as Lord and Savior and that one must repent and 
>>> >> ask
>>> >> to
>>> >> be forgiven in order to be called a child of God.
>>> >> This debate is almost as silly as whether one is a mid-tribulation,
>>> >> pre-tribulation or post-tribulation subscriber.
>>> >> If you???ve asked to be forgiven, and accepted Christ as Lord and
>>> >> Savior
>>> >> of your life, the rest of these debates is just the devil trying to
>>> >> separate us.  And a house divided against itself cannot stand.
>>> >> Barbara
>>> >>
>>> >> Let every nation know whether it wishes us well or ill, that we shall
>>> >> pay
>>> >> any price, bear any burden, meet any hardship, support any friend,
>>> >> oppose
>>> >> any foe, in order to assure the survival and the success of
>>> >> liberty.--John
>>> >> F. Kennedy
>>> >> _______________________________________________
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>>> >
>>> > --
>>> > John J. Boyer, Executive Director
>>> > GodTouches Digital Ministry, Inc.
>>> > http://www.godtouches.org
>>> > Madison, Wisconsin, USA
>>> > Peace, Love, Service
>>> >
>>> >
>>> > _______________________________________________
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>>>
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>>
>> --
>> John J. Boyer, Executive Director
>> GodTouches Digital Ministry, Inc.
>> http://www.godtouches.org
>> Madison, Wisconsin, USA
>> Peace, Love, Service
>>
>>
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>
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