[Flagdu] Fw: [Nfbf-l] May I ask a question.

Mon Nov 30 02:59:48 UTC 2009

From: "Charles Randall" <randybns at earthlink.net>
Sent: Sunday, November 29, 2009 4:06 PM

I have worked at the O&A Center for 17 years. I can tell you that we did not
serve that many clients during the switch to NFB concepts. We had clients
who did not wish to use the sleep shades. Because of the slow down due to
having a set period of time, six to nine months in the general program,
clients had ato wait a long period for service. Just because one's
philosophy was being implemented doesn't mean service was better. The use of
sleep shades can be a very useful tool and should be both an option and a
suggestion to certain clients. However, it is not always necessary. Refusing
to offer such a tool is as unfortunate as forcing it on clients. As an
employee at the Center, I can tell you that we tried to be sure that the
customer received quality training and recommended additional instruction
when needed. In regards to being a revolving door, it is my opinion that if
a client came back to the Center not for new training, it was unfortunately
because a councelor in the field didn't know what to do with the client and
in some cases, wasn't assisting with job development. I appreciate learning
about different methods for teaching blindness skills and in 2004, I spent
three weeks at the Louisianna Center for the Blind in what they call an
immersion. What I learned best was that what they do is what we do at the
Daytona Center. Good people , concerned about and respectful of the
customers, teaching skills for travel, daily living and technology. One of
the instructors I enjoyed getting to know, was very strong in his NFB
philosophy, he felt it was the best way to work, but he was an open-minded
person who was willing to dialog and show respect to people with other
ideas.

Regarding scholarships, I worked with a woman who had a number of
scholarships. DBS didn't as a result pay for her school but they did provide
her with equipment she needed to accomplish her goals. Remember, that the
pot is not unending and those scholarships should be used first allowing
funds to be used for those clients not so fortunate. In the case mentioned
where the client was asked to pay the money to the agency. I don't know for
sure what happened but I can speculate. Unfortunately, some offices aren't
run as well as they should be. They should not have paid the money to DBS
but rather used it for further education knowing that DBS would not have a
requirement to give additional funds until the scholarship was used.

During Craig's administration, he made some very useful contributions.
Providing the opportunity for clients and training facilities to access more
technology was one I felt was long overdue. However, in a speech he made,
later published in the Braille Monitor, he made it appear that blind rehab
in Florida was totally underserved until his changes and the things he said
about the Daytona Center were, shall we say, inaccurate.

It continues to be the responsibility of the consumer groups and the
customers to make their voices heard and have an influence on the Division
of Blind Services. And all due respect to one of my colleagues, and no
besmirching  of his integrity, in my opinion, no employee of the agency
should serve on the Rehab Council. It is not essential that all employees of
DBS be blind to ably provide good service, as we gain new employees who have
no background in the blindness field, they need to be encouraged to educate
themselves in order to understand their customers and the community around
themselves in order to provide quality services, not just manage paperwork.
Such education should involve not just course work but taking part in
activities alongside their customers and the consumer groups.

Yes it is understood that I am an insider; I am also an officer in my local
chapter of the FCB. What is more important to me is my responsibility to
express what I feel is a more accurate picture of how some matters have been
dealt with between clients and the Division. I am not a spokesman for the
agency, only one man with an opinion. I appreciate the chance these channels
offer to interact with differing ideas. May I continue to learn from those I
don't always agree with. As iron sharpens iron,
so one man sharpens another. Proverbs 27-17 NIV.

Charles "Randy" Randall

-----Original Message-----

Sent: Sunday, November 29, 2009 12:32 PM
Subject: Fw: [Flagdu] [Nfbf-l] May I ask a question.

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Sherri" <flmom2006 at gmail.com>
To: "Florida Association of Guide Dog Users" <flagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, November 28, 2009 4:19 PM
Subject: Re: [Flagdu] [Nfbf-l] May I ask a question.

>I appreciate your thoughtful observations David and I still say that as an
>organization, one of the things we can do is get NAC out of Florida. I do
>not understand the need of Florida agencies to be accredited by NAC. I then

>think that if we know of individual cases of people whose cases are not
>being handled well, we work on them on a chapter-by-chapter basis and
>involve others in the state affiliate if need be. I hate to see Florids'd
>rehab system slip back into the dark ages. Again, just my thoughts!
> ----- Original Message ----- 
> From: "davidw" <dwermuth1 at earthlink.net>
> To: "Florida Association of Guide Dog Users" <flagdu at nfbnet.org>
> Sent: Saturday, November 28, 2009 3:41 PM
> Subject: Re: [Flagdu] [Nfbf-l] May I ask a question.
>
>
>> Hello Sherri,
>>
>> I have the personality and knowledge to sometimes kick back and observe
>> before putting myself in unknowledgeable situations. The reason I ask
>> these questions is to learn and figure out ways to positively asisst in
>> the areas that might be takeing a wrong way. We all know that sometimes
>> people blind or not have issues with advocateing for themselves and Yes
>> it is frustrateing at times but that is the way it is, and sometimes we
>> end up with egg on our face but...   I have sat and listened to
>> consumer's of DBS and heard some story's of how VRC's don't have time to
>> fill out the ppw for O and M and they just say OK and fade away sitting
>> in their homes because...
>>
>> It disturbs me and yes I am done observeing, so I ask all of you what is
>> next?  We all know the rehabilitation system here in Florida isn't
>> working, so????
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>> From: "Sherri" <flmom2006 at gmail.com>
>> To: "Marion & Martin" <swampfox1833 at verizon.net>; "Florida Association of

>> Guide Dog Users" <flagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Saturday, November 28, 2009 8:31 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Flagdu] [Nfbf-l] May I ask a question.
>>
>>
>>> David and list, I agree with most of what Marion says and was actually
>>> going to answer in a similar way, but let me add that years ago, when
>>> serving as president of the National Federation of the Blind Greater
>>> Orlando Chapter and vice-president of the NFBF, I did advocate with
>>> local scholarship winners in Orlando when DBS insisted that because DBS
>>> helps them procure equipment and pay for school, the scholarship winner
>>> should return the scholarship from NFB-GOC to DBS. I was furious and
>>> went all the way to the top on that one. One person did give her
>>> winnings to DBS, but it was after much advice from me not to do so. This

>>> was in the pre Craig Kiser era.
>>>
>>> I do believe that DBS was making many progressive strides when Craig
>>> Kiser was director. I am acquainted with their present director and am
>>> frankly surprised at the turn the O&A center in Daytona has taken. I
>>> believe that advocacy from NFBF for those seeking help from DBS is done
>>> more on an individual case-by-case basis rather than having some sort of

>>> state-wide policy.
>>>
>>> We have, however, participated in phone conferences with FAASB so our
>>> input is noted, though not necessarily acted upon.
>>>
>>> I also think we need to take into careful consideration our advocacy
>>> efforts. How much can we really advocate for the blind when several
>>> people are employed by DBS. This also spills over into transportation as

>>> there are those who also work for transportation companies who serve the

>>> disabled in Florida.
>>>
>>> I would actually like to see NFB work to drive NAC out of Florida, as
>>> accreditation by this organization holds no validity.
>>>
>>> Why should you joiner NFB? Primarily because if you want to change
>>> something about an organization--if you want to move it forward-- you
>>> can only do so from the inside out. Putting forth negativity from the
>>> outside-in only hurts that organization and minimizes your own view.
>>> Having been both more and less involved with NFB over the years, I have
>>> found that my views are noted far more if I am working in the
>>> organization to change what it means to be blind, rather than just being

>>> an outside observer. Whether I agree or disagree with policies, I find
>>> my choice is to do what I can to help the blind throughout Florida and
>>> this country and I can do that more effectively being part of NFB than
>>> by being out there on my own.
>>>
>>> Just my thoughts and I thank you for asking these questions.
>>> Sherri
>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>> From: "Marion & Martin" <swampfox1833 at verizon.net>
>>> To: "NFB of Florida Listserv" <nfbf-l at nfbnet.org>; "FLAGDU List"
>>> <flagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>> Sent: Saturday, November 28, 2009 10:04 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [Flagdu] [Nfbf-l] May I ask a question.
>>>
>>>
>>>> David,
>>>>    The questions you ask are very valid ones! There was a time when the

>>>> NFB
>>>> had a greater influence with the Division of Blind Services. During
>>>> Craig
>>>> Kiser's administration, DBS was moving in a more positive direction.
>>>> Craig
>>>> is a very progressive thinker, understanding, living, and implementing
>>>> the
>>>> NFB's philosophy, in spite of a great deal of opposition from those who

>>>> are
>>>> content with the status quo. The Orientation & Adjustment center for
>>>> the
>>>> blind in Daytona Beach began implementing NFB-style training, including

>>>> the
>>>> use of sleep shades, in an effort to close the revolving door of
>>>> rehabilitation that once and now, again, exists. His goal was to
>>>> provide
>>>> excellent training once, not bits and pieces as consumers lose more and

>>>> more
>>>> eyesight, returning to the O&A Center to improve their lacking skills
>>>> that
>>>> should have been taught from the beginning. Unfortunately, Craig's
>>>> health
>>>> necessitated his retirement as the Director.
>>>>    We now have a Director who cannot even use the word "blind", as
>>>> evidenced by her presentation at our last NFBF convention. Though her
>>>> words
>>>> seemed to indicate that she is turning to the NFB for direction and
>>>> support,
>>>> I believe these words are only political rhetoric. The status quo has
>>>> been
>>>> returned to the O&A Center, taking two giant steps backward,  and the
>>>> Florida Association of Agencies Serving the Blind (FAASB) has more
>>>> influence and control over our lives as it
>>>> pertains to DBS than do we, the blind consumer! Florida has the
>>>> unfortunate distinction of having more NAC accreditted institutions
>>>> than any other state
>>>> and FAASB proports itself - and is accepted - to be the authoritative
>>>> voice
>>>> on issues of blindness. This is no surprise, as the Director of the
>>>> Division of Blind Services is a former Director of a NAC accreditted
>>>> institution - Lighthouse of Central Florida!
>>>>    As for the NFBF's involvement in consumer advocacy, I am of the
>>>> opinion that this is one of our major roles! I also feel that too many
>>>> are too close
>>>> to agency people to be effective consumer advocates. When crossing the
>>>> lines from colleagues to friends, we diminish our capacity to be
>>>> effective consumer advocates and succumb to the pressures of those
>>>> doing the
>>>> pressuring! Our purpose is not to
>>>> be popular with the agencies, but to advance consumer rights of the
>>>> individual with the goal of helping consumers reach for and achieve
>>>> their highest potential!
>>>>
>>>> Fraternally yours,
>>>> Marion Gwizdala
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> ----- Original Message ----- 
>>>> From: "davidw" <dwermuth1 at earthlink.net>
>>>> To: "Florida Association of Guide Dog Users" <flagdu at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Cc: "NFB of Florida Listserv" <nfbf-l at nfbnet.org>
>>>> Sent: Saturday, November 28, 2009 5:00 AM
>>>> Subject: [Nfbf-l] May I ask a question.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> First a little background on me.  I've worked for the state of Texas
>>>>> and
>>>>> Washington in the Rehabilitation for the blind and moved to Florida
>>>>> last
>>>>> May.  I am not asking these question's to cause waves or insult in
>>>>> anyway
>>>>> as I don't know the answers or how much the NFB has influence with the

>>>>> DBS
>>>>> here and I am just trying to understand.  I have noticed that
>>>>> hopefully
>>>>> many people on this list just read the post's and for some reason
>>>>> don't
>>>>> participate in the conversation's and I totally understand but here
>>>>> are a
>>>>> couple question's and comments:
>>>>>
>>>>> 1.  Does the NFB of Florida meet with the DBS for (Division of Blind
>>>>> Services) in making decisions for the low vision-blind for employment
>>>>> or
>>>>> for their future goals?
>>>>>
>>>>> In other words do you as leaders  of the blind community stand up for
>>>>> the
>>>>> rights for equal opportunity.  I've sat at many meeting's negotiateing

>>>>> for
>>>>> (throwing my fist down a few times on occasion" for the right's of the
>>>>> rehab act and the right of "choice"
>>>>>
>>>>> 2.  Does the NFB of Florida demand that all VRC's (Vocational
>>>>> Rehabilitation Counselers have the professionalism to asisst their
>>>>> consumers in obtaining their goals?
>>>>>
>>>>> I sat there at the leadership convention and heard at least three
>>>>> times to
>>>>> paraphase" when we getting a commission for the blind" and heard no
>>>>> comment.
>>>>>
>>>>> And I only ask not to be insultive or arogant in any way I promise you

>>>>> but
>>>>> for those whom are wondering where to turn when DBS trys and as you
>>>>> know
>>>>> most of the time intimidates them can they turn to the NFB of Florida
>>>>> and
>>>>> Why?
>>>>>
>>>>> I've been to a lot of NFB and ACB meetings through out the USA and I
>>>>> am
>>>>> concerned that the majority of them have just been a lot of bull and
>>>>> quite
>>>>> frankly butt-kissing their members to have numbers in their chapters.
>>>>> What makes you different and why should I join the NFB of Florida?
>>>>> and
>>>>> remember many people are reading this for leadership.
>>>>> Dave Wermuth
>>>>> A to Z Adaptive Aids
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Nfbf-l mailing list
>>>>> Nfbf-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>> http://www.nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nfbf-l_nfbnet.org
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>>>>> Nfbf-l:
>>>>>
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on.net
>>>>
>>>>
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>>>
>>>
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>>
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