[nabs-l] Social Etiquette

Mon Nov 3 18:12:17 UTC 2008

Beth,

We have something in common wich is comforting.  Even though I was raised 
with manners, I had few friends in high school as well.  Students were 
acquaintences but not friends.
I did join extra curricular activities like Spanish club but no friends 
developed.  The adults were always more friendly and helpful than students.
Beth, I was also in chorus in middle school.  I love singing but am not good 
at it.  Can you send me a file with you singing or put it on a website so I 
can hear you?

I also did not go to the social things like dances and shop with friends. 
That is why I suggested these things and you can do them with friends if you 
have them.  They are:
1. Talk with parents and teachers about how to act and manners.
2. Role play some situations.
3. Parents can take their children to such gatherings for practice.  For 
instance my father invited me to his holiday work party.  I learned much by 
just doing them.  For instance my parents took me to church, fancy 
restaurants occassionally, I got invited to a lion's club meeting and saw 
how it was conducted like Robert's Rules, and public places.  For instance 
although not with friends I went with family including my older siblings to 
the mall, restaurants including buffets, movies, church, concerts, and 
amusement parks.  I went more places but you get the picture.
So Beth, although we may not have friends I think  parents can foster good 
manners and expose their children to many life experiences so they learn in 
those settings.

Ashley
----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Beth" <thebluesisloose at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, November 03, 2008 7:11 AM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Social Etiquette

I think joining an extracurricular activity and going out with friends
is a great idea, but let's face it: people have to have the friends in
the first place.  I had practically no friends in high school that I
could go shopping with, and my oly connection to the rld wa marching
band and chorus.  That was it.
Beth

On 11/3/08, T. Joseph Carter <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com> wrote:
> Arielle,
>
> I don't think knowledge and motivation are enough.  What is needed along
> with those things is someone we trust who is willing to pull us aside and
> say, "Let me tell you what I just saw..."  Honest, non-judgmental feedback
> is necessary for improvement.  If you know what you just did and what cue
> you just missed, you can adapt.  If you don't, you can't.
>
> Joseph
>
> On Mon, Nov 03, 2008 at 05:43:21AM +1100, Arielle Silverman wrote:
>>Hi all,
>>
>>I certainly think that social skills/etiquette is important for high
>>school students to understand when transitioning to college and
>>beyond. One of the difficulties with detailing it on the fact sheet is
>>that many rules of etiquette and social grace vary depending on the
>>situation and the expectations of the people around. Just as there is
>>more than one way to look fashionable, there is more than one way to
>>be "well-mannered" and what is considered appropriate for one setting
>>may be considered wildly inappropriate in a different one. Really what
>>I think we want to capture is the ability to adapt to situations and
>>"blend in" by following the social/etiquette norms called for in those
>>situations.
>>
>>I would also point out that I think most adolescents (blind and
>>sighted) who didn't grow up under a rock have a pretty good
>>intellectual knowledge of what is and isn't appropriate public
>>behavior. However, there is a big difference between simply knowing
>>what's appropriate and actually complying with social norms. In order
>>to comply with social norms one must know what they are, and also be
>>motivated to comply with them, and be in full  control of their
>>behavior. Returning to the hypothetical ten-year-old kid who  picks
>>his nose in public, it's possible that he honestly doesn't know that
>>it's inappropriate. More likely, though, is that he's  been told it's
>>inappropriate before (or laughed at for doing it), but he simply
>>doesn't care—either because his parents didn't scold or punish him for
>>doing it, or because they did but they're simply not around in the
>>situation and the kid doesn't think he's likely to get in trouble for
>>picking his nose. A third possibility is that he is motivated to not
>>pick his nose, but he's just spaced out and doesn't realize he's doing
>>it, or he has a bad nasal itch and feels compelled to scratch inside
>>his nose to relieve it, etc. The point is that mere knowledge of
>>etiquette isn't enough—people have to be motivated (ideally,
>>self-motivated) to do what's appropriate. There are some behaviors
>>commonly seen in blind people—known as "blindisms"—that can become so
>>habitually ingrained that even when people become motivated to stop
>>they still  have difficulty doing it. Eye-poking is an example of a
>>behavior that most people engaging in it know full well that it's
>>unattractive (and bad for their eyes), and often people are motivated
>>to stop, but some have a very hard time completely eliminating it.
>>(Speaking from  personal experience here, but also from conversations
>>with teenagers and adults who have genuinely struggled to stop and
>>still find themselves occasionally poking their eyes). To give a
>>different example, I think the vast majority of adults know about the
>>negative consequences of being chronically late for things, but there
>>are just some people who are always late—maybe they just don't care,
>>or maybe they do but just haven't figured out how to organize their
>>time so they're not late, etc.
>>
>>That said, I do think parents and teachers can help kids improve their
>>social etiquette—not only by teaching what's appropriate (knowledge),
>>but by instilling motivation. Blind kids may be less motivated than
>>sighted kids to comply with social expectations either because they've
>>been held to lower standards by adults or because they don't see other
>>people's negative reactions to their behavior. So I think the emphasis
>>should be on teaching blind kids and teens to truly care about
>>conducting themselves well in public, adapting to different social
>>situations and building connections with others—rather than just
>>telling them to do or not do certain things. Giving rewards for good
>>behavior and punishments for bad is motivating to an extent, but
>>eventually kids need to be motivated regardless of who's around to
>>observe their actions. Ideally they will learn through experience that
>>following social norms and initiating connections with others makes
>>them happier and helps them to reach their goals.
>>
>>So how do we do this? Any ideas?
>>
>>Arielle
>>
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