[nabs-l] freinds

Tue Nov 4 00:39:44 UTC 2008

We as blind students certainly have a lack of social opportunity, especially 
with significant others.  I was lucky to have a boyfriend briefly, until he 
found his current gf.  I know his decision wasn't based on social skills or 
blindness issues cause his current gf is blind and we're still best friends! 
I still always feel lucky to have the friends I have, blind/another 
disability or sighted/able-bodied.  I had only 3 real friends in high 
school.  Two of them are best friends with each other and invite me to hang 
out.  The other is friends with me separately and sometimes invites me to 
hang out, but sometimes, I have to ask him.  I simply think it's cause he 
has some issues of his own.

Serena

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Beth" <thebluesisloose at gmail.com>
To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list" 
<nabs-l at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Monday, November 03, 2008 2:56 PM
Subject: Re: [nabs-l] freinds

> You are right, Carey.  The people in question could be too busy.
> However, may I point out that my younger brother, eighteen years old,
> already has a girlfriend and runs around everywhere with her?  I am
> envious of every sighted person who has a significant other, and you
> know why he has her?  Because he can immitate appropriate social
> skills.  I am a firm believer in having good social skills as a
> prerequisite to scoring with the oppoite sex.  The key to winning a
> successful date and keeping that significant other is having good
> social skills.  I have a young man in college here at FSU who is a
> friend, but he understands unlike the previous people I've dealt with,
> the nature of blindness and its accessories because his mom had a
> blind student.  I've spoken to him and his mom about this issue and it
> just makes sense that he wouldn't simply give up on me as a friend.  I
> admit I did a few things he didn't like, but then he admitted he
> wouldn't give up.
> Beth
>
> On 11/3/08, Carrie Gilmer <carrie.gilmer at gmail.com> wrote:
>> I would just like to add to Beth and Hope,
>>
>> Jordan has not had many social offers himself. And he is well liked and 
>> this
>> is key-respected- in class and in the extra curricular groups. I have 
>> found
>> that blind people maybe especially need to be very pro-active on this. I
>> told him once that to eat lunch with others he needed to initiate, or to 
>> go
>> out, he needed to call. I told him he was not like a Hollywood Star, 
>> people
>> were not going to line up to go out with him. In my own life, as a 
>> sighted
>> person, I can tell you that nearly every one of my friendships are 
>> because I
>> my self kept in contact. I called, I made the lunch date, I invited them
>> over, I remembered the birthday card. I have friends from grade school
>> still, but most often I am the one to keep up the contact. It is often 
>> that
>> way, some people are better at it. I never care or make anyone feel it
>> mattered if they haven't called me for three years, I don't even listen 
>> to
>> the "excuse" I just say forget it, how are you now, wanna do lunch on
>> Thursday and catch up?
>>
>> I know that there are people who will avoid the blindness, most are 
>> though
>> just unsure. But I think it can affect fro your end too, in the can you 
>> walk
>> the walk you talk totally? Like that little girl I mentioned, IF your 
>> skill
>> level and independence is not truly equal that can effect. But on the 
>> other
>> hand kids know Jordan is equal to them in school, I think sometimes they
>> don't realize he is equally independent out of school too. On the other
>> hand, he is often too busy to have any free time to go out, and these 
>> days I
>> know a lot of students (my husband is a high school teacher) who are high
>> GPA, working jobs, volunteering and in extra curricular and they don't 
>> have
>> time much either. So I think they aren't calling like he isn't, just too
>> busy!
>>
>>
>>
>> Carrie Gilmer, President
>> National Organization of Parents of Blind Children
>> A Division of the National Federation of the Blind
>> NFB National Center: 410-659-9314
>> Home Phone: 763-784-8590
>> carrie.gilmer at gmail.com
>> www.nfb.org/nopbc
>>
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nabs-l-bounces at nfbnet.org] On 
>> Behalf
>> Of Hope Paulos
>> Sent: Monday, November 03, 2008 7:57 AM
>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Social Etiquette
>>
>> I was in the same boat, Beth.  I totally understand what you
>> mean.  I had one very good friend, so I thought, in high school.
>> She would do things with me, but when it came time to be with me
>> or her sighted friends, (she was also sighted), she chose them
>> instead.  There were very few times when she would invite to go
>> places with her other friends.  I guess she didn't accept the
>> blindness.
>>
>> Hope and Beignet
>>
>>> ----- Original Message -----
>>>From: Beth <thebluesisloose at gmail.com
>>>To: "National Association of Blind Students mailing list"
>> <nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>Date sent: Mon, 3 Nov 2008 07:11:39 -0500
>>>Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Social Etiquette
>>
>>>I think joining an extracurricular activity and going out with
>> friends
>>>is a great idea, but let's face it: people have to have the
>> friends in
>>>the first place.  I had practically no friends in high school
>> that I
>>>could go shopping with, and my oly connection to the rld wa
>> marching
>>>band and chorus.  That was it.
>>>Beth
>>
>>>On 11/3/08, T.  Joseph Carter <carter.tjoseph at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>> Arielle,
>>
>>>> I don't think knowledge and motivation are enough.  What is
>> needed along
>>>> with those things is someone we trust who is willing to pull us
>> aside and
>>>> say, "Let me tell you what I just saw..."  Honest,
>> non-judgmental feedback
>>>> is necessary for improvement.  If you know what you just did and
>> what cue
>>>> you just missed, you can adapt.  If you don't, you can't.
>>
>>>> Joseph
>>
>>>> On Mon, Nov 03, 2008 at 05:43:21AM +1100, Arielle Silverman
>> wrote:
>>>>>Hi all,
>>
>>>>>I certainly think that social skills/etiquette is important for
>> high
>>>>>school students to understand when transitioning to college and
>>>>>beyond.  One of the difficulties with detailing it on the fact
>> sheet is
>>>>>that many rules of etiquette and social grace vary depending on
>> the
>>>>>situation and the expectations of the people around.  Just as
>> there is
>>>>>more than one way to look fashionable, there is more than one way
>> to
>>>>>be "well-mannered" and what is considered appropriate for one
>> setting
>>>>>may be considered wildly inappropriate in a different one.
>> Really what
>>>>>I think we want to capture is the ability to adapt to situations
>> and
>>>>>"blend in" by following the social/etiquette norms called for in
>> those
>>>>>situations.
>>
>>>>>I would also point out that I think most adolescents (blind and
>>>>>sighted) who didn't grow up under a rock have a pretty good
>>>>>intellectual knowledge of what is and isn't appropriate public
>>>>>behavior.  However, there is a big difference between simply
>> knowing
>>>>>what's appropriate and actually complying with social norms.  In
>> order
>>>>>to comply with social norms one must know what they are, and also
>> be
>>>>>motivated to comply with them, and be in full  control of their
>>>>>behavior.  Returning to the hypothetical ten-year-old kid who
>> picks
>>>>>his nose in public, it's possible that he honestly doesn't know
>> that
>>>>>it's inappropriate.  More likely, though, is that he's  been told
>> it's
>>>>>inappropriate before (or laughed at for doing it), but he simply
>>>>>doesn't care-either because his parents didn't scold or punish
>> him for
>>>>>doing it, or because they did but they're simply not around in
>> the
>>>>>situation and the kid doesn't think he's likely to get in trouble
>> for
>>>>>picking his nose.  A third possibility is that he is motivated to
>> not
>>>>>pick his nose, but he's just spaced out and doesn't realize he's
>> doing
>>>>>it, or he has a bad nasal itch and feels compelled to scratch
>> inside
>>>>>his nose to relieve it, etc.  The point is that mere knowledge of
>>>>>etiquette isn't enough-people have to be motivated (ideally,
>>>>>self-motivated) to do what's appropriate.  There are some
>> behaviors
>>>>>commonly seen in blind people-known as "blindisms"-that can
>> become so
>>>>>habitually ingrained that even when people become motivated to
>> stop
>>>>>they still  have difficulty doing it.  Eye-poking is an example
>> of a
>>>>>behavior that most people engaging in it know full well that it's
>>>>>unattractive (and bad for their eyes), and often people are
>> motivated
>>>>>to stop, but some have a very hard time completely eliminating
>> it.
>>>>>(Speaking from  personal experience here, but also from
>> conversations
>>>>>with teenagers and adults who have genuinely struggled to stop
>> and
>>>>>still find themselves occasionally poking their eyes).  To give a
>>>>>different example, I think the vast majority of adults know about
>> the
>>>>>negative consequences of being chronically late for things, but
>> there
>>>>>are just some people who are always late-maybe they just don't
>> care,
>>>>>or maybe they do but just haven't figured out how to organize
>> their
>>>>>time so they're not late, etc.
>>
>>>>>That said, I do think parents and teachers can help kids improve
>> their
>>>>>social etiquette-not only by teaching what's appropriate
>> (knowledge),
>>>>>but by instilling motivation.  Blind kids may be less motivated
>> than
>>>>>sighted kids to comply with social expectations either because
>> they've
>>>>>been held to lower standards by adults or because they don't see
>> other
>>>>>people's negative reactions to their behavior.  So I think the
>> emphasis
>>>>>should be on teaching blind kids and teens to truly care about
>>>>>conducting themselves well in public, adapting to different
>> social
>>>>>situations and building connections with others-rather than just
>>>>>telling them to do or not do certain things.  Giving rewards for
>> good
>>>>>behavior and punishments for bad is motivating to an extent, but
>>>>>eventually kids need to be motivated regardless of who's around
>> to
>>>>>observe their actions.  Ideally they will learn through
>> experience that
>>>>>following social norms and initiating connections with others
>> makes
>>>>>them happier and helps them to reach their goals.
>>
>>>>>So how do we do this? Any ideas?
>>
>>>>>Arielle
>>
>>>>>_______________________________________________
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>> oseph%40gmail.com
>>
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