[nabs-l] draft 2 - complete section with amendment

Sun Jun 19 10:43:57 UTC 2011

Arielle:
With all due respect,
how would we be able to identify current members without any problem?

That is to say,
do we keep some kind of database of who is *currently* on NABS?
The reason I'm asking is because I don't see how NABS keeps track of current membership to begin with,  let alone new members.

Are you saying you're opposed to such an amendment because it would mean creating a tracking system for the entire membership?

And if so, wouldn't this help NABS in the long run?

Thanks,

Jorge

On Jun 19, 2011, at 1:52 AM, Arielle Silverman wrote:

> Excellent point, Kurt. I have heard of cases at state conventions
> where candidates brought all  their friends who were not NFB members
> on the day of the election to pay their dues and vote in person. Sure,
> this could happen at a national convention, but it seems less likely,
> and much more likely if absentee voting were allowed. The problem
> could be minimized by requiring payment of dues a month or so in
> advance of the election. But even then, how could we verify payment
> status virtually? The U.S. government allows mail-in voting, but in
> that case candidates are clearly identified in advance. In short, even
> if this amendment were permissible and philosophically desirable, our
> election procedures, from nomination of candidates to membership
> verification, would have to be radically modified. I'm not opposed to
> change, but I question whether the dramatic investment of effort
> required is worth the benefit of allowing a few more people to vote.
> As Darian emphasized, there are many, many other ways we can be using
> our energy and exercising our membership rights.
> Respectfully,
> Arielle
> 
> On 6/18/11, Kirt Manwaring <kirt.crazydude at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Jorge,
>>  You're putting this out in the open for public scrutiny so I'm going
>> to be honest.  I really, really don't like the idea-it opens up all
>> sorts of cans of worms that don't seem right to me.  Consider the
>> following.
>>  We probably won't know all the candidates in the election *until*
>> the actual business meeting.  There could be someone who, for whatever
>> reason, hasn't announced their candidacy for office on the list.  I
>> think it's only fair that anyone who's even considering voting in the
>> election knows who all candidates are and has the opportunity to
>> listen to each introduction speech (even if it's only 30 seconds
>> long), before they cast their ballot.  That's only fair to all the
>> candidates involved.  I would consider supporting an idea that allows
>> those due-paying members in virtual attendance (through an official
>> NABS skype call or the like) the opportunity to vote.  Beyond that, I
>> don't think you have much of a case.
>>  Also, think about this.  Let's say you, hypothetically, were running
>> for NABS president.  You get a bunch of your blind friends who aren't
>> going to convention, who may or may not want anything to do with the
>> Federation, and have them pay $5 so they're voting members.  I'm not
>> saying you'd do such a thing, I'm just saying you're leaving that kind
>> of possibility open.  No matter how secure the voting method is, that
>> makes this something that could happen.  Do other organizations open
>> that door?  Sure.  Should we?  I say no.
>>  But the spirit behind the idea isn't bad.  I think, personally, if
>> we could ensure some sort of secure method for virtual attendance at
>> the meeting for those due-paying members who can't make convention,
>> I'd be all for allowing them to vote.  Maybe set up a shoutcast server
>> streaming the meeting, and only give the password to those due-paying
>> members who request it?  Make a conference call and only give the
>> calling info/access code for those due-paying members who ask for it?
>> If we instituted a system like that, I don't see why we couldn't allow
>> that sort of absentee voting, but only for those who are in virtual
>> attendance at the NABS business meeting and not for anyone else.  Am I
>> making any sense?  Is that a possibility?
>>  All the best,
>> Kirt
>> 
>> On 6/18/11, Jorge Paez <computertechjorgepaez at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> Arielle:
>>> Not exactly,
>>> I'm going to continue to edit the amendment myself and should be able to
>>> submit it before July second.
>>> I posted this version so that people could see my amendment in light of
>>> the
>>> entire section.
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Jun 18, 2011, at 7:59 PM, Arielle Silverman wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Jorge,
>>>> Is this the final version you would like read at the NABS meeting this
>>>> year? Or, would you like to wait until 2012 when you will be at
>>>> convention yourself and can present and defend it?
>>>> If you want it read in 2011 and you will not be at convention, you
>>>> will need to find someone else who will be there to read and defend
>>>> it.
>>>> Arielle
>>>> 
>>>> On 6/17/11, Joseph C. Lininger <jbahm at pcdesk.net> wrote:
>>>>> George,
>>>>> I hate to be a killjoy on you, but you're probably wasting your time
>>>>> with this. The organization isn't going to change this particular
>>>>> policy, no matter how many people would like to see it happen. For the
>>>>> record, I'm with you on this one, but I'm also no longer a federationest
>>>>> and haven't been for some years now. Too many differences of opinion.
>>>>> --
>>>>> "All models are wrong, but some are useful." George E. P. Box
>>>>> Joseph C. Lininger, <jbahm at pcdesk.net>
>>>>> 
>>>>> _______________________________________________
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>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> --
>>>> Arielle Silverman
>>>> President, National Association of Blind Students
>>>> Phone:  602-502-2255
>>>> Email:
>>>> nabs.president at gmail.com
>>>> Website:
>>>> www.nabslink.org
>>>> 
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>>> 
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>> 
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> 
> 
> -- 
> Arielle Silverman
> President, National Association of Blind Students
> Phone:  602-502-2255
> Email:
> nabs.president at gmail.com
> Website:
> www.nabslink.org
> 
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