[nabs-l] Grabbing Etc.

Tue Nov 8 18:51:10 UTC 2011

I touch someone's shoulder when I know where I'm going but want to
stick with someone, such as a friend or my boyfriend. It makes it
clear that I'm not using them as a sighted guide and they don't have
to look out for me, but it is also clear that we are walking together.
When doing sighted guide, I only take someone's shoulder if they are
much shorter than me, such as a child (though I've only done this with
one person, and she wasn't a child).

~Jewewl

On 11/8/11, Carly <carlymih at earthlink.net> wrote:
>
> Good morning all,
>
> One technique that mmy partner who is also blind and and I use is,
> holding a person's shoulder. This way, the awkward, who is to grab
> whose arm, is removed. Try it.
> for today,
> CarAt 06:39 AM 11/8/2011, Lea williams wrote:
>>My dad has always tried to lead me by pushing me through doors. I
>>always hated it and would trip in to signs and stuff if he was turned
>>around trying to hold the door open for another behind us. I would
>>tell him not to and to let me go behind him, but he insisted in doing
>>it like this so he could see where it is that i was going. Leading me
>>by me hanging on to him would force me to be behind him and he could
>>not see me. I get people who wants to guide me the way the nurses do
>>to the older in the hospitle, holding my elbow, but I do not like this
>>either, I feel more likely to trip. If I am walking wiht someone and i
>>grab their arm, they grab my hand, I grab their arm again and they go
>>after my hand presistantly , I will either say let me hold your arm,
>>or I am going to hold on to your arm, all in a nice way of course. But
>>some people, like some of the bus drivers who I will ask to walk me in
>>to places that are complicated, like my doctors, will grab my hand and
>>I just go with it a lot of the time. It is how my much younger cuzzins
>>led me, but that was because they were to short for me to hold their
>>arms. One driver held my hand up really high and then ergently told me
>>to slow down, I was walking to fast and step up step up.
>>I had to go to the doctor for applying for a guide dog lately and the
>>new doctor lady insisted on me being on that aweful table instead of
>>the much perfured chair, so she grabbed my hand to make sure I did not
>>get lost in the tiny room and kept telling me to slow down I moved to
>>fast. I guess they think we do that granny walk or something?
>>I do not feel off ballenced so much, but more vollenerble than if I
>>held on to the person the right way. Most people are willing to change
>>to what i want as long as I tell them so.
>>
>>On 11/8/11, Jewel <herekittykat2 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > Add to that my situation, where touching me can sometimes shoot severe
>> > pain up and down my body (I have fibromyalgia), and you have a recipe
>> > for disaster. When someone grabs me, I stop everything I'm doing and
>> > say "Please don't grab me." If they don't let go, I wrench my arm away
>> > or if they are touching my back (which is a super big no-no with me,
>> > since my spine is super-sensitive thanks to two slipped discs along
>> > with fibromyalgia), I arch my back whether it's painful or not, to
>> > show them that it's not all right to touch. I'll tell you one story of
>> > when grabbing me caused a problem...
>> >
>> > I was walking from the library and my cane was sweeping back and
>> > forth. Suddenly someone came over and grabbed my cane arm and wrenched
>> > me sideways. I shouted in alarm and wrenched my arm away, but my arc
>> > had already been interrupted and I didn't realize that there was a
>> > pole right in front of me. This was one of those metal poles to hold
>> > up a handicapped sign. I hit it full on becaus emy cane's arc had been
>> > interrupted and didn't catch the pole, and now I have a dent in the
>> > upper part of my forehead from that pole. It didn't break the skin,
>> > but I can always feel the dent if I rub my forehead.  Plus it caused a
>> > minor concussion. I was soooo embarrassed by it, but realized later
>> > that it wasn't my fault, that it was caused by this person grabbing my
>> > cane arm. Sheessh!
>> >
>> > ~Jewel
>> >
>> > On 11/8/11, Joshua Lester <jlester8462 at students.pccua.edu> wrote:
>> >> LOL!
>> >> My brother guides me all around Walmart, and he likes to go faster
>> >> than I can go.
>> >> He doesn't understand that I can't walk at a normal pace, because of a
>> >> Syatic Nerve problem.
>> >> Blessings, Joshua
>> >>
>> >> On 11/7/11, Sam Hogle <hogle.sam at gmail.com> wrote:
>> >>> Actually, I've had the opposite problem. For some reason, guides think
>> >>> they have to go slower. The funny thing is they think I can't walk at
>> >>> a
>> >>> normal pace, but they also think I can see the curbs we walk up or
>> >>> down.
>> >>> I will never understand people.
>> >>> On 11/7/2011 11:50 PM, Joshua Lester wrote:
>> >>>> Wow!
>> >>>> Arielle, you've been through it!
>> >>>> That's not necessary, that they do those things!
>> >>>> I've been through alot of stuff regarding this, as well.
>> >>>> I've also had guides go faster than I'm accustomed to, and I've
>> >>>> fallen, because they didn't go at my pace.
>> >>>> I always tell people, if they guide me, that they must go at my pace.
>> >>>> Blessings, Joshua
>> >>>>
>> >>>> On 11/7/11, Arielle Silverman<arielle71 at gmail.com>  wrote:
>> >>>>> Hi all,
>> >>>>> I don't know if any of you can relate to this, but for me, being
>> >>>>> grabbed or pulled by the arm or back is more than just a dignity
>> >>>>> issue; it's a safety issue as well. I have always had poor balance,
>> >>>>> and when someone is putting pressure on one side of my body, or
>> >>>>> propelling me from behind, I feel unsafe and unbalanced. If I were
>> >>>>> to
>> >>>>> bump into an obstacle or trip while being pulled this way, I feel I
>> >>>>> would have a much harder time regaining my balance. For some reason,
>> >>>>> many sighted people think leading me this way is helpful, but in
>> >>>>> fact
>> >>>>> it's not only unnecessary, but makes safe and efficient travel more
>> >>>>> challenging for me. For example, I went on a white-water rafting
>> >>>>> trip
>> >>>>> in high school and one of the river guides tried to pull me up into
>> >>>>> the boat by my arm. I felt unbalanced and asked him to let go of my
>> >>>>> arm and let me get into the raft by myself. The guide told me to
>> >>>>> stop
>> >>>>> arguing with him and pulled me up into the boat. As I was getting
>> >>>>> in,
>> >>>>> my foot slipped and I wasn't able to stabilize myself because of the
>> >>>>> one-sided pressure on my body. I fell and bruised my leg, and was
>> >>>>> incredibly annoyed that the guide didn't listen to me. I also feel
>> >>>>> very unsafe when people attempt to grab my left arm because I am a
>> >>>>> left-handed cane user and my cane arc is impaired when they do this.
>> >>>>> The absolute worst is when someone grabs me without any verbal
>> >>>>> communication at all, such as a bus driver who grabbed me by both
>> >>>>> shoulders without saying a word because he thought I was going to
>> >>>>> run
>> >>>>> into a pole that my cane had just barely cleared. Needless to say,
>> >>>>> the
>> >>>>> silent grab scares me to death!
>> >>>>> Because of these experiences, I have learned to dig my feet in and
>> >>>>> will not follow someone who is grabbing or pulling me, especially if
>> >>>>> they are holding on to my cane arm. I will politely ask them to let
>> >>>>> go, and most people are just shocked that I don't want them to do
>> >>>>> that, especially if I have asked them for verbal directions.
>> >>>>> Unfortunately, many people think the only way to "help" a blind
>> >>>>> person
>> >>>>> is through this kind of physical maneuvering. Sometimes if I ask
>> >>>>> someone for information or directions, they will answer my question
>> >>>>> and then say, "Do you want me to help you?" I guess implying they
>> >>>>> are
>> >>>>> offering to physically lead me there. I will of course tell them
>> >>>>> they
>> >>>>> have already helped me a lot with the directions and that I really
>> >>>>> appreciate their help and don't need any more. If someone does the
>> >>>>> silent grab, or if they refuse to let go after a polite request to
>> >>>>> do
>> >>>>> so, then I will gently but firmly disengage my arm. Fortunately this
>> >>>>> has been very effective. If time allows I will give a simple
>> >>>>> explanation for not wanting to be grabbed, such as "Please don't
>> >>>>> grab
>> >>>>> me-it makes me feel off-balance" or "Please don't grab me-it's
>> >>>>> easier
>> >>>>> for me if you just walk beside me" etc. I do think that most people
>> >>>>> are just very ignorant and don't necessarily grab out of pity, but
>> >>>>> because they believe that grabbing is the most effective way to
>> >>>>> provide guidance to the blind. I try to educate them and some
>> >>>>> definitely do understand. I do feel guilty about times when I have
>> >>>>> snapped at people and not had the time to explain, such as when
>> >>>>> crossing a street or getting on a bus. But even though I feel bad, I
>> >>>>> don't regret my action because to me, it's a matter of safety above
>> >>>>> all else. I've also found that in some circumstances it's actually
>> >>>>> more efficient to do things independently than to be "helped". For
>> >>>>> instance, I went to get a pedicure a few weeks ago and the
>> >>>>> pedicurist
>> >>>>> insisted on putting my shoes and coat back on me after the pedicure
>> >>>>> was over. I tried to politely refuse, but she wouldn't hear it.
>> >>>>> Thing
>> >>>>> is, for whatever reason she was very methodical in putting my shoes
>> >>>>> on, and it took her about twice as long to do it as it would have if
>> >>>>> I
>> >>>>> had done it myself.
>> >>>>> Incidentally, I've never understood why some people get confused
>> >>>>> about
>> >>>>> sighted guide and think the technique is for them to grab my elbow
>> >>>>> and
>> >>>>> walk a step behind me. Even when I teach people the proper way, they
>> >>>>> will occasionally "get it backwards" and want to grab my elbow
>> >>>>> instead. Isn't it a lot harder to lead or guide someone if you're
>> >>>>> behind them than if you're in front of them?
>> >>>>> Best,
>> >>>>> Arielle
>> >>>>>
>> >>>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>>> nabs-l mailing list
>> >>>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> >>>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> >>>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info
>> >>>>> for
>> >>>>> nabs-l:
>> >>>>>
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40students.pccua.edu
>> >>>>>
>> >>>> _______________________________________________
>> >>>> nabs-l mailing list
>> >>>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> >>>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> >>>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> >>>> nabs-l:
>> >>>>
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/hogle.sam%40gmail.com
>> >>>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> _______________________________________________
>> >>> nabs-l mailing list
>> >>> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> >>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> >>> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> >>> nabs-l:
>> >>>
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/jlester8462%40students.pccua.edu
>> >>>
>> >>
>> >> _______________________________________________
>> >> nabs-l mailing list
>> >> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> >> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> >> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> >> nabs-l:
>> >>
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.com
>> >>
>> >
>> > _______________________________________________
>> > nabs-l mailing list
>> > nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>> > http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>> > To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> > nabs-l:
>> >
>> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/leanicole1988%40gmail.com
>> >
>>
>>
>>--
>>Lea Williams
>>
>>Phone;
>>704-732-4470
>>Skipe;
>>Lea.williams738
>>Facebook
>>http://www.facebook.com/#!/profile.php?id=100001775297080
>>
>>_______________________________________________
>>nabs-l mailing list
>>nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
>>To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
>> nabs-l:
>>http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/carlymih%40earthlink.net
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> nabs-l mailing list
> nabs-l at nfbnet.org
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/listinfo/nabs-l_nfbnet.org
> To unsubscribe, change your list options or get your account info for
> nabs-l:
> http://nfbnet.org/mailman/options/nabs-l_nfbnet.org/herekittykat2%40gmail.com
>