[nabs-l] Advanced foreign language advice needed

Fri Aug 24 21:51:17 UTC 2012

Hi all,
I agree with Dave. In addition to the "employers won't provide a
notetaker" argument, I would also suggest that the act of taking notes
is a huge learning aid. Taking notes requires actively listening to
the material and writing it down in your own words, which will make
things much easier to remember when you go to study and on tests,
assignments etc. If you let someone else engage with the material to
take notes, you miss out on this learning opportunity and will
probably require more studying later than if you took your own notes.
Besides, do you really want to entrust your personal study materials
to somebody else? What if your assigned notetaker zones out and misses
something that's really important or that you need to study a little
extra?
Unfortunately I think that students are often not taught good
notetaking skills. In my opinion good notetaking is not about writing
down absolutely everything that's spoken or displayed on the board. If
it were, then blind students would be at a serious disadvantage, and
all students would struggle and actually learn little. But good
notetaking is about writing down either the most important points or
the points that you didn't know before, so you will have some extra
help studying these points later. As I've said before, in my
experience, the most important points are the ones the professor
verbalizes. Having a sighted person copy down what's on the board for
you is only marginally helpful, and this benefit is canceled out by
losing the memory reinforcement from writing things down. So go in to
class, write down the major points, definitions of terms, and anything
your professor says that's surprising or entertaining (jokes will help
you remember things too) and don't worry about the rest. The more you
can write down definitions in your own words rather than just
robotically copying down the class notes, the better off you will be
on the exam when the professor will ask you to define a term in your
own words. I think blind students with good notetaking skills often
have an advantage over sighted students who use PowerPoint as a crutch
instead of really processing the information and putting it in terms
that make sense to them.
That said, while I discourage notetakers, I do encourage sharing notes
with classmates or discussing them in study groups. A classmate can
clarify visual things you might have missed, but you can also help
them by filling in gaps in their notes or giving them notes if they
miss class. Discussing concepts with other students is a good way to
clarify and reinforce comprehension. And, if all else fails, please
make use of your professor's office hours. At least at my university,
professors are required to block out two hours a week to be in their
offices waiting for students to come by and ask questions, and
students rarely do. Most university professors also have doctoral
degrees in the subject they teach, meaning they have spent at least
five years of their lives doing in-depth study or research on that
subject. The majority of professors love their subject and are happy
when students want to talk with them about it. Plus, you never know if
a relationship with a professor might turn into a job or other
opportunity. When I was a teaching assistant one semester, only one
student came to my office hours the entire semester. A year later when
my advisor and I were looking to hire a research assistant, her name
was mentioned to me and I was willing to hire her without knowing her
well,in part because I remembered that she was a good student who came
to my office hours.
Arielle

On 8/24/12, Danielle Sykora <dsykora29 at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi everyone,
> Yes, I agree that we should be able to take our own notes. The ability
> to take notes is a very important skill. It doesn't seem practical to
> always expect to have someone else take notes for you.
> Just my opinion,
> Danielle
>
> On 8/24/12, Lavonya Gardner <hotdancer1416 at gmail.com> wrote:
>> They have note takers for school and assistances for work. I have 1
>>
>> Sent from my iPad
>>
>> On Aug 24, 2012, at 17:00, David Andrews <dandrews at visi.com> wrote:
>>
>>> My view may not be popular -- but, it seems to me that as blind persons
>>> we
>>> need to be able to take notes as does everybody else.  Use of a human
>>> note
>>> taker, while it may seem expedient, isn't going to prepare you for the
>>> real world.  Unless you have a problem, in addition to blindness, most
>>> employers aren't, and shouldn't provide you with a note taker.  We need
>>> to
>>> have the tools to study as everybody else does.
>>>
>>> I would use the Braille note to take notes in class, and worry about
>>> powerpoints etc. later.
>>>
>>> Dave
>>>
>>> At 09:10 PM 8/21/2012, you wrote:
>>>> Hello,
>>>> If this is a state college, if you ask for a note taker, they can't
>>>> deny
>>>> you a note taker. If they say that is against their policy, say that is
>>>> BS and you can sue them.
>>>> If they are a private college that put you on a 504 plan the case is
>>>> the
>>>> same. They can provide you accommodation if it isn't unreasonable.
>>>> Thank you,
>>>>
>>>> Brandon Keith Biggs
>>>> -----Original Message----- From: Ashley Bramlett
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2012 6:37 PM
>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Advanced foreign language advice needed
>>>>
>>>> Aleeha,
>>>> Well, that is too bad because I think a foregin language class is one
>>>> where
>>>> a notetaker would be very  beneficial.
>>>> If you feel you miss material in class, you can always go to the
>>>> professor's
>>>> office hours. In my experience, they are generally real willing to help
>>>> and
>>>> repeat or clarify any lecture material.
>>>>
>>>> Ashley
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message----- From: aleeha dudley
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2012 8:28 PM
>>>> To: National Association of Blind Students mailing list
>>>> Subject: Re: [nabs-l] Advanced foreign language advice needed
>>>>
>>>> I use a note taker in science classes and am not ashamed to say it. The
>>>> university does not provide these services for foreign language
>>>> classes.
>>>> Thanks to everyone for the suggestions.
>>>>
>>>> Aleeha Dudley
>>>> President, Ohio Association of Blind Students
>>>> Changing what it means to be blind
>>>>
>>>> On Aug 21, 2012, at 6:40 PM, "Ashley Bramlett"
>>>> <bookwormahb at earthlink.net>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Aleeha,
>>>>> Sounds like a handful. I would not be able to read notes on a laptop,
>>>>> take notes and listen at the same time even if it was in english!
>>>>> What teaching style does she use? I only took foreign language in high
>>>>> school; I would not want to try in college due to no braille
>>>>> availability. In high school I was accomodated with hard copy braille
>>>>> and braille texts which was vital to my success; college you have to
>>>>> do
>>>>> auditorily.
>>>>>
>>>>> What I'd suggest is not reading the class notes in class. Do you need
>>>>> to
>>>>> read them for a worksheet or group activity? If so, could someone else
>>>>> read them with you? Sometimes my professors have a study guide but I
>>>>> follow auditorily since I ask the professor to speak out the questions
>>>>> before going over them. If in a group of students, I try and get them
>>>>> to
>>>>> read the handout to me so I can participate.
>>>>> Instead of in class, get any handouts ahead of time and read them. If
>>>>> you feel you need them in class, is it possible to put the handout
>>>>> file
>>>>> on your braille note and switch files from your notes and class notes?
>>>>>
>>>>> Another idea which might be quicker for accessing notes is to emboss
>>>>> the
>>>>> class notes. Do you have an embosser of yours or the schools?
>>>>> I find that i can  skim a hard copy document faster than a braille
>>>>> display file.
>>>>> Also recording class might help. Another idea, which many would
>>>>> disagree
>>>>> with, is have a notetaker. Your school should provide a notetaker upon
>>>>> request for you. Languages classes go fast and I think it would be
>>>>> hard
>>>>> to take notes as fast as they go especially when other students can
>>>>> copy
>>>>> notes from the board or slide at their pace and you have to do it
>>>>> right as the teacher talks.
>>>>>
>>>>> HTH,
>>>>> Ashley
>>>>> -----Original Message----- From: aleeha dudley
>>>>> Sent: Tuesday, August 21, 2012 10:08 AM
>>>>> To: nabs-l at nfbnet.org
>>>>> Subject: [nabs-l] Advanced foreign language advice needed
>>>>>
>>>>> I was wondering if any of you have taken 300 level foreign language
>>>>> classes and if so, how did you keep track of all that is happening in
>>>>> the class? I am finding it difficult to read the class notes on my
>>>>> laptop, take my own notes on my Braillenote apex, and also try to
>>>>> comprehend what the instructor is saying since it is all in Spanish.
>>>>> Let
>>>>> me know what you think. Any ideas would be greatly appreciated.
>>>>> Thanks,
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Aleeha Dudley
>>>>> President, Ohio Association of Blind Students
>>>>> Changing what it means to be blind
>>>
>>>
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