[nagdu] GDF Questions

Sat Oct 31 18:12:05 UTC 2009

Hi Tami,

Interesting. In all of my experiences (I had Juno walks for schools I didn't 
attend), I was asked to give the hardest correction I could, not to prevent 
Juno from sniffing, but so the staff could assess my physical strength. They 
explained that they did not want to give me a dog I couldn't control. I 
didn't have the impression that I'd need to use these corrections on 
anything like a regular basis. And thankfully, I haven't had to. (Well, 
Glaze has gotten into trouble a few times...)

I, too, find it interesting to read about people's experiences with Juno 
walks.

Angie

----- Original Message ----- 
From: "Tamara Smith-Kinney" <tamara.8024 at comcast.net>
To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'" 
<nagdu at nfbnet.org>
Sent: Saturday, October 31, 2009 3:18 AM
Subject: Re: [nagdu] GDF Questions

>I did have one evaluation before I decided to owner-train.  It was only my
> second ever Juno walk, so I didn't have much to go by.  So Juno stopped 
> and
> sniffed, and I gave what I considered apretty harsh leash correction, far
> stronger than I was comfortable with.  So Ms. Juno insisted that next time
> she sniffed I giver her a two-handed leash correction with every ounce of 
> my
> strength.  I complied, since it was just Juno, but...  I will confess that
> my first thought was, "If that's all the better you can do at training 
> your
> dogs, I don't want one!"
>
> Okay, so I grew up handling large animals, some of them dangerous, and I
> know there's a time and a place to use physical force to prevent them from
> harming you or themselves and that you had better not be kidding around.
> Those animals outweighed me by 10 times or more.  Yeah, I could knock an 
> 18
> hand, 1750 (ish) pound mean Appy mare off her feet before I hit 100 
> pounds.
> We will not discuss a father who would put his own child in a position to
> need to do that on a somewhat regular basis.  She was his horse, and I
> entirely understood why she was so vicious.  That did not mean I was going
> to let her smoosh me.
>
> So given my own life context, I really had a hard time with the very 
> notion
> of giving a dog that level of correction for sniffing. The two-handed bit
> seemed much.  Which is not to say I won't turn Ms. Mitzi around in circles
> if I need to.  Or needed to; she's not a pup in training anymore.  Even
> downtown when she's in a mood for pigeon chasing, I don't have to use full
> one-arm strength; I just stand there until she remembers what she's about 
> or
> just give a verbal reminder to pay attention.  She bounces a bit, but she
> doesn't go all rodeo on me anymore.  /smile/
>
> Anyway, it's good to hear others' experiences in assessment Juno walks.  I
> know that when it's part of a home evaluation the assessor is looking for
> certain things that they need to know to give you a good match...  I did
> find that one incredibly off-putting, though.  Seriously, if she needed to
> see how well I could correct a dog her organization trained with an 
> all-out,
> two-handed leash correction for sniffing...  She wasn't a trainer or
> instructor, at least as far as I know, and I've met some very nice dogs 
> from
> that program who don't seem to need aggressive manhandling, so I know it 
> was
> a mistaken impression.  Still!
>
> For the record, I have been mad enough at Mitzi at times to consider 
> trying
> that exact same maneuver. /smile/  Wonderful dog; very head strong.  Even 
> a
> very lightly sharp leash correction, however, has the exact opposite 
> effect
> I might want with her, though, so I stick to finesse.  Now that I don't 
> even
> have to do that on a consistent basis -- she saves her misbehavior up for
> really special occasions -- I hardly know what to do with myself.  /smile/
>
> Then again, there are always pigeons.  /smile/
>
> Tami Smith-Kinney
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org [mailto:nagdu-bounces at nfbnet.org] On Behalf
> Of Wayne Merritt
> Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 7:20 PM
> To: NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users
> Subject: Re: [nagdu] GDF Questions
>
> I remember being at The Seeign Eye and my instructor purposely pulled
> harder or very little in order to get a "feel": for how much of a pull
> I wanted and how fast I was able/willing to walk. I would rather have
> the dog pulling slightly in front of me, so that if the dog ever
> suddenly dstopped, I would have some warning that something was up.
>
> Wayne
>
> On 10/30/09, Angie Matney <angie.matney at gmail.com> wrote:
>> Hi Gary,
>>
>> One thing to keep in mind is that most schools will consider the amount 
>> of
>> pull you want when they match you with a dog. Also, when I was at GDB
>> getting my first dog, I had Juno walks from two different instructors on
>> campus before I got my dog. These walks felt very different. This is not
> to
>> say that the school's philosophy of using the harness shouldn't be a
>> consideration; I just mean that part of the differences in Juno walks can
>> sometimes be attributed to the individual instructors.
>>
>> Best,
>>
>> Angie
>>
>>
>> ----- Original Message -----
>> From: "Gary" <rainshadowmusic at shaw.ca>
>> To: "'NAGDU Mailing List,the National Association of Guide Dog Users'"
>> <nagdu at nfbnet.org>
>> Sent: Friday, October 30, 2009 11:32 AM
>> Subject: [nagdu] GDF Questions
>>
>>
>>> Hello Albert:
>>>
>>> How are you. I am on the guide dog list as well and have applied at
>>> gdf. I am curious what you thought of the schools programs? This is
>>> your first dog? It will be mine as well. Taking that in mind, how did
>>> you find the training program? Was it reasonably easy to learn what you
>>> needed to learn to work with your new dog? Did the bonding process go
>>> smoothly for you?
>>>
>>> With regard to the schools guiding philosophy, how do they teach you to
>>> use the harness? I have done two Juno walks (using a harness without the
>>>>dog) with two different schools and they had very different styles. One
>>> had the dog slightly ahead of me so that my arm was forward at about a
>>> 45 degree angle (or maybe slightly less). They also had quite a bit of
>>> pull/tension  on the
>>> harness by the dog. The other school I have done this walk with had my
>>> arm down more by my side, say around the place where the seem of your
>>> pants would be with very little tension on the harness.
>>>
>>> I have decided I like the second way much better so want to be sure
>>> that the school I go to does not do it the way my first walker did.
>>>
>>> What does gdf do?
>>>
>>> Thanks very much for anything you are willing to share with me. I am
>>> waiting for a poodle so I have applied at three schools.
>>>
>>> Feel free to apply off line at g.steeves at shaw.ca if you would prefer.
>>>
>>>
>>> have a great day.
>>> Gary
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Gary Steeves, BSW, RSW
>>> 204 - 1110 West 10th Ave
>>> Vancouver, BC  V6H 1J1
>>> Work: 778-452-6504
>>> Cell: 604-764-0777
>>> Email: g.steeves at shaw.ca
>>>
>>>
>>>
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>>
>>
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>
>
> -- 
> My blog:
> http://wayneism.blogspot.com
> My websites:
> www.wayneism.com
> www.whitecaneday.org
>
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